All Claims of The Son's Deity

[synergy]

run away? When did I ever run away from a biblical conversation?

Look no further than this one right here with your feeble "no cars" attempt to run away.

 

[Peterlag]

Look no further than this one right here with your feeble "no cars" attempt to run away.

In the real world we talk about things that are. We don't talk about things that are not. Example: The Bible talks about the son of God. It does not talk about God the son. We don't look for things that don't exist and then explain why they are not there.

 

[Peterlag]

Speaking of baptism...

These words also are not found in any Greek Manuscript before the 15th century and in no ancient Version. E. W. Bullinger., A Critical Lexicon and Concordance to the English and Greek New Testament: (London: Samuel Bagster & Sons, 1975), Appendix A. p. 11.

1 John 3:7-8
For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

 

[synergy]

In the real world we talk about things that are. We don't talk about things that are not. Example: The Bible talks about the son of God. It does not talk about God the son. We don't look for things that don't exist and then explain why they are not there.

The Bible does talk about things that are not. For example, idols are not God. You, on the other hand, want to run away from the real world and to live in your imaginary world.

 

[mikesw]

The early church was always baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus...

until the development of the Trinity doctrine in the 2nd century. The Catholics acknowledge baptism was changed and Scripture such as Matthew 28:19 that was never in the Bible was added by them.

Britannica Encyclopedia, 11th Edition, Volume 3, page 365 – Baptism was changed from the name of Jesus to words Father, Son and Holy Ghost in the 2nd Century.

Canney Encyclopedia of Religion, page 53 – The early church baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus until the second century.

Hastings Encyclopedia of Religion, Volume 2 – Christian baptism was administered using the words "in the name of Jesus." page 377. Baptism was always in the name of Jesus until the time of Justin Martyr, page 389.

Catholic Encyclopedia, Volume 2, page 263 – Here the authors acknowledged that the baptismal formula was changed by their church.

Schaff – Herzog Religious Encyclopedia, Volume 1, page 435 – The New Testament knows only the baptism in the name of Jesus.

Hastings Dictionary of Bible, page 88 – It must be acknowledged that the three fold name of Matthew 28:19 does not appear to have been used by the primitive church, but rather in the name of Jesus, Jesus Christ or Lord Jesus.

whoa. four to six times mentioned by one writer. Justin Martyr does not say that the name for baptism was changed, as if Acts was somehow describing a problematic baptism. He says:

I will also relate the manner in which we dedicated ourselves to God when we had been made new through Christ; lest, if we omit this, we seem to be unfair in the explanation we are making. As many as are persuaded and believe that what we teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly, are instructed to pray and to entreat God with fasting, for the remission of their sins that are past, we praying and fasting with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Saviour Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water. https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0126.htm

This then appears to be a standard ongoing practice. It also seems reasonable that Acts seeks to emphasize the required baptism in light of Christ as distinguished from the baptism of John. So the name used is expressed thematically rather than word for word. The hyperliteralistic Arianist would not be able to recognize such distinctions.

 

[Johann]

The Bible does talk about things that are not. For example, idols are not God. You, on the other hand, want to run away from the real world and to live in your imaginary world.

The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of the Trinity

Bold, Compassionate Truth: Resources For Investigating Todays Competing Religious Claims

bib.irr.org

Powerful link brother.

J.

 

[Peterlag]

The Bible does talk about things that are not. For example, idols are not God. You, on the other hand, want to run away from the real world and to live in your imaginary world.

Idols were all around everywhere in those days as they are now. Only a fool would say there were no idols.

 

[Capbook]

Now Capbook,
This is not an intelligent question. We don't entertain what is not there by saying it is not there. There were no cars on the earth when Jesus was walking the earth. And thus, there's no Scripture that says there are no cars because there were no cars.

I believe you are the one that ask if, "There is not one verse that says Jesus is God the Son." I just follow your line of argument.
When countered by the same asking, you complain about "intelligence" where it is you who first introduced that to the discussion. Review your post#740 to convince you from your own words.

 

[Capbook]

GINOLJC, to all.
number 1. no one's personal name is "I AM", for H1961 הָיָה hayah (haw-yaw) v. is a VERB and not a noun.
1. to exist.
2. to be or become.
3. to come into being, i.e. to happen, to occur (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary).
[a primitive root]
KJV: beacon, X altogether, be(-come), accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass), do, faint, fall, + follow, happen, X have, last, pertain, quit (one-)self, require, X use.
Compare: H1933

second, you said, "Whom He is the one speaking in Gen 1:26 "Let us" make man in our image. Jesus is the other that the Father talked to about". yes, to COME in the IMAGE he made, man. supportive scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come." FIGURE here is ... "IMAGE", and God was to come in that IMAGE, .... MAN. for thge Christ was not at Genesis 1:1, but JESUS the Spirit was. supportive scripture, Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them." PLEASE NOTE, IT WAS ONLY ONE PERSON IN THE BEGINNING WHO MADE MAN MALE AND FEMALE, read Genesis 1:27 again.

see, people don't understand how God went from a plurality of US and OUR in verse 26 to a singularity of HIS and he in the very next verse. yes, the ANOTHER in the ECHAD .... "WAS TO COME", just as Romans 5:14 clearly states.

and this coming "Last", or Later" is in Ordinal designations of First and Last, or Root and Offspring, ot Alpha and Omega, or Aleph and Tav, or beginning and end..... must 101G go on?

think, ....... God is the ECHAD, or the Another of himself in Ordinal designations, in ..... TIME, PLACE, ORDER and RANK, just at the term "beginning" clearly states in Genesis 1:1. "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth"

and beginning here is,
H7225 רֵאשִׁית re'shiyth (ray-sheeth') n-f.
1. the first, in place, time, order or rank.
2. (specifically) a firstfruit.
[from the same as H7218]
KJV: beginning, chief(-est), first(-fruits, part, time), principal thing.
Root(s): H7218

THE "FIRST" in place, time, order or rank.

this is just too easy,
101G.

May I know what version of the Bible you are using about Gen 1:27? In NASB it renders "He created him" while yours, "created he him", I believe from there comes the confusion. And also is "them" one person?

Gen 1:26-28
27 And God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
NASB

 

[MTMattie]

GINOLJC, to all.
number 1. no one's personal name is "I AM", for H1961 הָיָה hayah (haw-yaw) v. is a VERB and not a noun.
1. to exist.
2. to be or become.
3. to come into being, i.e. to happen, to occur (always emphatic, and not a mere copula or auxiliary).
[a primitive root]
KJV: beacon, X altogether, be(-come), accomplished, committed, like), break, cause, come (to pass), do, faint, fall, + follow, happen, X have, last, pertain, quit (one-)self, require, X use.
Compare: H1933

second, you said, "Whom He is the one speaking in Gen 1:26 "Let us" make man in our image. Jesus is the other that the Father talked to about". yes, to COME in the IMAGE he made, man. supportive scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come." FIGURE here is ... "IMAGE", and God was to come in that IMAGE, .... MAN. for thge Christ was not at Genesis 1:1, but JESUS the Spirit was. supportive scripture, Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them." PLEASE NOTE, IT WAS ONLY ONE PERSON IN THE BEGINNING WHO MADE MAN MALE AND FEMALE, read Genesis 1:27 again.

see, people don't understand how God went from a plurality of US and OUR in verse 26 to a singularity of HIS and he in the very next verse. yes, the ANOTHER in the ECHAD .... "WAS TO COME", just as Romans 5:14 clearly states.

and this coming "Last", or Later" is in Ordinal designations of First and Last, or Root and Offspring, ot Alpha and Omega, or Aleph and Tav, or beginning and end..... must 101G go on?

think, ....... God is the ECHAD, or the Another of himself in Ordinal designations, in ..... TIME, PLACE, ORDER and RANK, just at the term "beginning" clearly states in Genesis 1:1. "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth"

and beginning here is,
H7225 רֵאשִׁית re'shiyth (ray-sheeth') n-f.
1. the first, in place, time, order or rank.
2. (specifically) a firstfruit.
[from the same as H7218]
KJV: beginning, chief(-est), first(-fruits, part, time), principal thing.
Root(s): H7218

THE "FIRST" in place, time, order or rank.

this is just too easy,
101G.

Say what??????????/ number 1. no one's personal name is "I AM"

Guess what... another term that is not a name but it is thrown about here daily and that is Savior. And we all know who that is referencing.

@101G ... your writings are becoming more and more confusing by the day.

 

[Johann]

Say what??????????/ number 1. no one's personal name is "I AM"

Guess what... another term that is not a name but it is thrown about here daily and that is Savior. And we all know who that is referencing.

@101G ... your writings are becoming more and more confusing by the day.

Lol!!.

J.

 

[civic]

Now Peterlag,
So there are a zillion warnings in the Bible saying not to worship images, statues, people, idols, etc... as God and there is not even one single verse warning you not to worship Jesus as God?!?! Your response is a clearly a feeble attempt to run away from the fact that the Bible does not support your heresies.

Inescapable.

You might as well throw away the entire N.T. since Jesus is worshiped and treated as God in all of the books in the N.T.

To deny this is to turn a blind eye to the bibles teaching about Jesus and believe what you have been taught by men of other religions regarding Jesus.

The most important question any professing bible believer must answer is the very one Jesus asked His followers and audience.

Who do people say that I am ?

One eternity rests upon knowing, believing in the right Jesus and following the True Son of God, son of man. Having both the nature of God and the nature of man. Truly God, truly man. God manifest in the flesh as the bible declares- The Word who is God, who became flesh. John 1:1, 14. All the fulness of Deity dwells in Him as per Colossians 1:19, Colossians 2:9. The One who is called our Great God and Savior. Titus 2:13, 2 Peter 1:1, the True God and Eternal Life 1 John 5:20. The Lord God Almighty, the Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, The Beginning and the End- Revelations 1, Revelations 22. The Eternal One without beginning Micah 5:2; the Creator of all- John 1:1-4, Colossians 1, Hebrews 1. The One who is worshipped by all in heaven- Revelation 4-5.

Its either idolatry condoned in all of the N.T. or He is God worthy of all worship, honor, power, praise, glory. And we know that YHWH will never share His glory with another. But we know the Son before creation equally shared the Glory together with the Father as per John 17:5.

End of discussion for unitarianism. Now watch them explain away all of the above and strip Jesus of His honor, glory, majesty, power, praise and worship due His Holy name.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

Inescapable.

You might as well throw away the entire N.T. since Jesus is worshiped and treated as God in all of the books in the N.T.

To deny this is to turn a blind eye to the bibles teaching about Jesus and believe what you have been taught by men of other religions regarding Jesus.

The most important question any professing bible believer must answer is the very one Jesus asked His followers and audience.

Who do people say that I am ?

One eternity rests upon knowing, believing in the right Jesus and following the True Son of God, son of man. Having both the nature of God and the nature of man. Truly God, truly man. God manifest in the flesh as the bible declares- The Word who is God, who became flesh. John 1:1, 14. All the fulness of Deity dwells in Him as per Colossians 1:19, Colossians 2:9. The One who is called our Great God and Savior. Titus 2:13, 2 Peter 1:1, the True God and Eternal Life 1 John 5:20. The Lord God Almighty, the Alpha and Omega, the First and the Last, The Beginning and the End- Revelations 1, Revelations 22. The Eternal One without beginning Micah 5:2; the Creator of all- John 1:1-4, Colossians 1, Hebrews 1. The One who is worshipped by all in heaven- Revelation 4-5.

Its either idolatry condoned in all of the N.T. or He is God worthy of all worship, honor, power, praise, glory. And we know that YHWH will never share His glory with another. But we know the Son before creation equally shared the Glory together with the Father as per John 17:5.

End of discussion for unitarianism. Now watch them explain away all of the above and strip Jesus of His honor, glory, majesty, power, praise and worship due His Holy name.

hope this helps !!!

Have you noticed this massive uptick in more and more people
trying to deny the diety of CHRIST .
THEY DID THIS my friend . THEY had to remove the diety of CHRIST
in order to make an equal playing field FOR ALL RELIGOINS .
They have long been at work to merge ALL the religons . AND You cant merge them
IF JESUS IS WHO HIS OWN WORDS declare him to be . I AM ALPHA and OMEGA , the first and the last
THEY HAD TO REMOVE that . Cause they have to make it seem as though everyones religion
seem equal . A LIE of course . But satan is a liar now aint he .
That which is of anti christ has grown massive in these last hours
John did battle against it
Pual and other did so too as the mystery of inquity was at work even in their days .
BUT IT HAS GROWN MASSIVE NOW . and they all beleive
this big ol broad common ground path is the key to attaining WORLD PEACE N SAFETY .
And now a word
FOR WHEN THEY SHALL SAY PEACE N SAFETY , SUDDEN DESTRUCTION cometh upon them all .
The signs ARE VERY CLEAR as to what days we be in my friend . THE COMING OF KING JESUS
draws VERY nigh indeed .

 

[MTMattie]

Have you noticed this massive uptick in more and more people
trying to deny the diety of CHRIST .
THEY DID THIS my friend . THEY had to remove the diety of CHRIST
in order to make an equal playing field FOR ALL RELIGOINS .
They have long been at work to merge ALL the religons . AND You cant merge them
IF JESUS IS WHO HIS OWN WORDS declare him to be . I AM ALPHA and OMEGA , the first and the last
THEY HAD TO REMOVE that . Cause they have to make it seem as though everyones religion
seem equal . A LIE of course . But satan is a liar now aint he .
That which is of anti christ has grown massive in these last hours
John did battle against it
Pual and other did so too as the mystery of inquity was at work even in their days .
BUT IT HAS GROWN MASSIVE NOW . and they all beleive
this big ol broad common ground path is the key to attaining WORLD PEACE N SAFETY .
And now a word
FOR WHEN THEY SHALL SAY PEACE N SAFETY , SUDDEN DESTRUCTION cometh upon them all .
The signs ARE VERY CLEAR as to what days we be in my friend . THE COMING OF KING JESUS
draws VERY nigh indeed .

I have just a very small side comment on this, as we are headed well down the yellow brick road to the end of end times.

Thank you @TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY for the comments on this.

Pope Francis is credited with saying the following

and this is from Snopes.

Claim:
Pope Francis once said, “All religions are paths to God.”
Rating:

Correct Attribution
About this rating
Context
He made the remark while speaking to a Singapore crowd on Sept. 13, 2024. Per the Vatican's Italian-to-English translation, he said, "All religions are paths to God." Meanwhile, a video by the Catholic News Service shows an interpreter at the event who translated the phrase as "every religion is a way to arrive at God."
Internet users have attributed this quote to Pope Francis: "All religions are paths to God."

Popular evangelists have posted variations of the quote on social media platforms such as Facebook and X since mid-September 2024. The alleged remark has received tens of thousands of interactions. Also, at least one Reddit post questioned whether Francis said the phrase.




The underlying assertion was correct based on Italian-to-English translations of the pope's words to a crowd at Singapore's Catholic Junior College on Sept. 13, 2024. According to the Vatican's transcript, he said, "All religions are paths to God." Meanwhile, a video by the Catholic News Service shows an interpreter who translated the phrase as "every religion is a way to arrive at God."

Since the meanings of those translations are generally the same, the in-question quote is correctly attributed.

Here are the pope's words translated in the official Vatican transcription (the emphasis is ours):

One of the things that has impressed me most about the young people here is your capacity for interfaith dialogue. This is very important because if you start arguing, "My religion is more important than yours...," or "Mine is the true one, yours is not true....," where does this lead? Somebody answer. [A young person answers, "Destruction".] That is correct. All religions are paths to God. I will use an analogy, they are like different languages that express the divine. But God is for everyone, and therefore, we are all God's children. "But my God is more important than yours!". Is this true? There is only one God, and religions are like languages, paths to reach God. Some Sikh, some Muslim, some Hindu, some Christian. Understood?

You can see a video, if you care at https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/god-religions-pope-francis/

Now I only mention this now because with the new Pope from the US who is suggested that he will follow in Frankie's ways
I believe we are going to see more and more of this.

Now.... Back on topic.

 

[101G]

May I know what version of the Bible you are using about Gen 1:27? In NASB it renders "He created him" while yours, "created he him", I believe from there comes the confusion. And also is "them" one person?

Gen 1:26-28
27 And God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.
NASB

First thanks for the reply, and second ... it is good to ask questions.
A. 101G use the KJV
B. is not "he" one person?
C. no confusion, because God is the ECHAD of himself .... to Come.... note "TO COME". so, at Genesis 1:26 he has not come because it was not "TIME" yet. supportive Galatians 4:4 "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law," GOT IT?

101G.

 

[Peterlag]

I believe you are the one that ask if, "There is not one verse that says Jesus is God the Son." I just follow your line of argument.
When countered by the same asking, you complain about "intelligence" where it is you who first introduced that to the discussion. Review your post#740 to convince you from your own words.

There were no cars when Jesus walked the earth. If you say Jesus had a car. I think it would be okay to ask for a verse that says Jesus had a car. What you then ask is for me to show a verse that says Jesus did not have a car. We talk about what is there, what is real. We don't talk about what is not there or what is not real like cars in the first century or a trinity in the first century.

 

[101G]

Say what??????????/ number 1. no one's personal name is "I AM"

Guess what... another term that is not a name but it is thrown about here daily and that is Savior. And we all know who that is referencing.

Saviour, it this the Lord Jesus personal name, or is Saviour his personal TITLE? which one.

@101G ... your writings are becoming more and more confusing by the day.

when one have no UNDERSTANDING of the KNOWLEDGE that 101G speak of .... to "THEM" ....... to THEM .... it is confusing. see you have not clue, because you have been indoctrinated in a erroneously false doctrine of a three person Godhead. understand 101G was indoctrinated also, but when what 101G was told did not add up what what the bible was really saying. 101G refused to stay in Ignorance. so 101G asked God himself to teach 101G, and he did. so now 101G have no hard question that cannot be answered ... by God's holy Word.

101G suggest you start from the BEGINNING, yes, Genesis 1:1

101G

 

[civic]

There were no cars when Jesus walked the earth. If you say Jesus had a car. I think it would be okay to ask for a verse that says Jesus had a car. What you then ask is for me to show a verse that says Jesus did not have a car. We talk about what is there, what is real. We don't talk about what is not there or what is not real like cars in the first century or a trinity in the first century.

The disciples did .

Acts 2:1
And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one Accord.

I drive a Honda accord and the disciples all fit , we’re all in One Accord.

 

[civic]

I need to change my name from civic to acccord or maybe Hondaman

 

[MTMattie]

First thanks for the reply, and second ... it is good to ask questions.
A. 101G use the KJV
B. is not "he" one person?
C. no confusion, because God is the ECHAD of himself .... to Come.... note "TO COME". so, at Genesis 1:26 he has not come because it was not "TIME" yet. supportive Galatians 4:4 "But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law," GOT IT?

101G.

He is an us.

NASB95

26Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”

27God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.