Your Views on The Trinity

The trinity folks have a couple of get out of jail free cards...

They use them on me whenever I corner them. I think my count is now up to three.

1.) That was Jesus acting in his human side.
2.) It's a mystery and God is to difficult to understand.

And the new one whenever I ask for Scripture to back up what they said...

3.) God does not need to write the Bible the way you think it should be written.
Yeah, they have a workaround for everything, but they are doing what the other denominations do who want to justify their doctrines. The Transubstantiation doctrine comes to mind. Most Protestants seem to rightly understand that the bread doesn't literally become human flesh. To me, this reveals their hand because they show awareness of what should be taken literally and not taken literally.
 
Not a convincing argument since Hebrews 1:8-10 says the human is a man who was anointed above his companions. God doesn't have companions to be anointed above. YHWH also isn't a man with a God.

You've already been shown that Psalm 45 doesn't transfer the idea of deity, that you seem to think it does, to Hebrews 1:8-10. Why you are running into issues with your claims is because they don't actually support what your conclusions are. Read Hebrews 1 and Psalm 45 again. Read it closely.

Not argument here just scripture.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
 
Again, it makes no difference if you say Trinity or Oneness or Jesus is not God. It all comes from the same devil. You keep quoting Hebrews like if Paul was calling Jesus God. He was not. He's quoting the Old Testament that called "God" God.

I don’t say anything about the Trinity or Oneness.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
 
Your throne O God= error by Catholicism translating.

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10

Who created the heavens and the earth according to scripture, the Father of the Son?


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16


Who became flesh according to the scriptures, the Father of the Son?
 
Again, it makes no difference if you say Trinity or Oneness or Jesus is not God. It all comes from the same devil. You keep quoting Hebrews like if Paul was calling Jesus God. He was not. He's quoting the Old Testament that called "God" God.
I cannot believe the disrespect Peterlag has for Jesus and the scriptures. I guess that could be the reason he is a unitarian.
 
Not argument here just scripture.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
This argument is flawed in that it doesn't take into account the context of Hebrews 1 and Psalm 45, where the man being discussed is a man who's God is YHWH, not God who's God is YHWH.

There is also a problem with the version of 1 Timothy 3:16. It's a well-known fact among theologians nowadays, even Trinitarians agree, that 1 Timothy 3:16 doesn't contain the "God" because it's not in the earliest manuscripts. It's also a theological issue that God needed to be justified in or by the Spirit.

So what you have provided isn't convincing despite it. Can you explain why none of these verses you have provided do not offer the conclusions you do and why there are verses that contradict your conclusions?
 
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I cannot believe the disrespect Peterlag has for Jesus and the scriptures. I guess that could be the reason he is a unitarian.
You can't beat Peter in a head on debate about Scripture so you slander him. They did the same sort of thing to Jesus when he was constantly silencing the arguments and questions of the opposition. You also can't win if you go low. Maybe you just need to be mature and have some class.
 
I don’t say anything about the Trinity or Oneness.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
1 Timothy 3:16 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. There are some Greek manuscripts that read, “God appeared in the flesh.” This reading of some Greek manuscripts has passed into some English versions, and the King James Version is one of them. Trinitarian scholars admit, however, that these Greek texts were altered by scribes in favor of the Trinitarian position. The reading of the earliest and best manuscripts is not “God” but rather “he who.” Almost all the modern versions have the verse as “the mystery of godliness is great, which was manifest in the flesh,” or some close equivalent.
 
Not argument here just scripture.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10


YHWH the Son is God.

YHWH the Son created the heavens and the earth.


YHWH The Son became flesh.



And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16
Hebrews 1:8 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Hebrews is saying your throne oh God is forever. Not Jesus is forever. In Hebrews it's quoted referring to Jesus having the use of that throne.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.


“Your throne is God.” Hebrews 1:8 is an almost exact quotation from the Septuagint version of Psalm 45:6, which itself was a very good translation of the Hebrew text of Psalm 45:6, and Hebrews 1:9 is from the Septuagint of Psalm 45:7. The theme of Hebrews 1 centers around the Father’s rule and elevation of the Son over the rest of creation. God spoke through the prophets, and then through His Son, who He appointed heir of all things and who is now seated at God’s right hand as second n command under God.

The God of the Son—anointed him and set him above his companions, such that the Son now sits on God’s right hand. Hebrews exalts the Son, and in so doing exalts the Father. But in contrast to what Trinitarians say, Hebrews 1:8 (and thus Psalm 45:6) does not call Jesus “God” and does not support the Trinity. To see that fully, one must study Psalm 45. Upon examination, Psalm 45 does not support the Trinity, so when it is quoted in Hebrews 1:8 then that quotation does not support the Trinity either. The Jews read Psalm 45 for centuries and never concluded that the Messiah would be “God in the flesh” or somehow be part of a Triune God.
 
You can't beat Peter in a head on debate about Scripture so you slander him. They did the same sort of thing to Jesus when he was constantly silencing the arguments and questions of the opposition. You also can't win if you go low. Maybe you just need to be mature and have some class.
he slandered himself, roughly speaking. He was calling scripture and jesus of the devil, not me.
 
he slandered himself, roughly speaking. He was calling scripture and jesus of the devil, not me.
That is not what he said and you know it. Seriously, just chill. Your attitude and slander is why he has you on ignore and I get that. A lot of toxicity can simply go away if select people are ignored.
 
This argument is flawed in that it doesn't take into account the context of Hebrews 1 and Psalm 45, where the man being discussed is a man who's God is YHWH, not God who's God is YHWH.

There is also a problem with the version of 1 Timothy 3:16. It's a well-known fact among theologians nowadays, even Trinitarians agree, that 1 Timothy 3:16 doesn't contain the "God" because it's not in the earliest manuscripts. It's also a theological issue that God needed to be justified in or by the Spirit.

So what you have provided isn't convincing despite it. Can you explain why none of these verses you have provided do not offer the conclusions you do and why there are verses that contradict your conclusions?

There is no argument.

There is just the words of scripture. You either believe what the scriptures so plainly say, or you deny what the scriptures so plainly say.

But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10

Who created the heavens and the earth according to this scripture, the Father of the Son?
 
1 Timothy 3:16 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. There are some Greek manuscripts that read, “God appeared in the flesh.” This reading of some Greek manuscripts has passed into some English versions, and the King James Version is one of them. Trinitarian scholars admit, however, that these Greek texts were altered by scribes in favor of the Trinitarian position. The reading of the earliest and best manuscripts is not “God” but rather “he who.” Almost all the modern versions have the verse as “the mystery of godliness is great, which was manifest in the flesh,” or some close equivalent.

1 Timothy 3:16 doesn’t mention the Trinity.


And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16


Who became flesh the Father or the Son according to this scripture?
 
Hebrews 1:8 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Hebrews is saying your throne oh God is forever. Not Jesus is forever. In Hebrews it's quoted referring to Jesus having the use of that throne.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.


“Your throne is God.” Hebrews 1:8 is an almost exact quotation from the Septuagint version of Psalm 45:6, which itself was a very good translation of the Hebrew text of Psalm 45:6, and Hebrews 1:9 is from the Septuagint of Psalm 45:7. The theme of Hebrews 1 centers around the Father’s rule and elevation of the Son over the rest of creation. God spoke through the prophets, and then through His Son, who He appointed heir of all things and who is now seated at God’s right hand as second n command under God.

The God of the Son—anointed him and set him above his companions, such that the Son now sits on God’s right hand. Hebrews exalts the Son, and in so doing exalts the Father. But in contrast to what Trinitarians say, Hebrews 1:8 (and thus Psalm 45:6) does not call Jesus “God” and does not support the Trinity. To see that fully, one must study Psalm 45. Upon examination, Psalm 45 does not support the Trinity, so when it is quoted in Hebrews 1:8 then that quotation does not support the Trinity either. The Jews read Psalm 45 for centuries and never concluded that the Messiah would be “God in the flesh” or somehow be part of a Triune God.

Hebrews 1:8-10 doesn’t mention the Trinity.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10



Who created the heavens and the earth according to this scripture, the Father of the Son?
 
Hebrews 1:8-10 doesn’t mention the Trinity.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10



Who created the heavens and the earth according to this scripture, the Father of the Son?
They work as a team. That's right the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are understood to work together as a team, forming the Holy Trinity. This concept is central to Christian theology and describes how the three persons of God are distinct yet inseparable in their divine nature and work.
 
Hebrews 1:8-10 doesn’t mention the Trinity.


But to the Son He says:
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever;
A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom.
You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness;
Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You
With the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”
And: “You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Hebrews 1:8-10



Who created the heavens and the earth according to this scripture, the Father of the Son?
Hebrews 1:8 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Hebrews is saying your throne oh God is forever. Not Jesus is forever. In Hebrews it's quoted referring to Jesus having the use of that throne.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
 
1 Timothy 3:16 doesn’t mention the Trinity.


And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:
God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
1 Timothy 3:16


Who became flesh the Father or the Son according to this scripture?
The word "logos" (Word) denotes (I) "the expression of thought" as embodying a conception or idea. λόγος "logos" is something said (including the thought). So the word "logos" means an expression of thought. It makes perfect sense if we use this understanding everywhere the word "logos" is used. So in John 1:1 the Word is not Jesus, but rather it became flesh, which is God's expression of thought or plan that became flesh with the coming of Jesus Christ.
 
You can't beat Peter in a head on debate about Scripture so you slander him. They did the same sort of thing to Jesus when he was constantly silencing the arguments and questions of the opposition. You also can't win if you go low. Maybe you just need to be mature and have some class.
Be a good example for us please.
 
You can't beat Peter in a head on debate about Scripture so you slander him. They did the same sort of thing to Jesus when he was constantly silencing the arguments and questions of the opposition. You also can't win if you go low. Maybe you just need to be mature and have some class.
Peterlag has not even participated in the debates, not much at least. He likes to post ads for the unitarian dogma. He posts many of the things over and over without adding any interchange regarding his misconceptions.
 
Be a good example for us please.
Would the following be a good example...

52 Reasons why Jesus is not God...

1.) The word "Trinity" is not in the Bible.

2.) There is no clear Trinitarian formula in the Bible.

3.) The idea that "the Father is God, the Son is God, the Holy Spirit is God, and together make one God" is not found in Scripture.

4.) God is spirit, and Jesus said he was not a spirit even after his resurrection (Luke 24:39).

5.) Jesus is very plainly called a man many times in Scripture.

6.) God was not born, but is eternal.

7.) Romans 5:19 says a man had to pay for the sins of mankind.

8.) The man Jesus is the mediator between God and men (1 Timothy 2:5).

9.) Jesus called the Father "my God" both before and after his resurrection.

10.) Jesus said my Father is greater than I (John 14:28).

11.) It was God that made Jesus "Lord" (Acts 2:36).

12.) Jesus would have already been the Lord if he was God.

13.) In the future Jesus will be subject to the Father (1 Corinthians 15:28).

14.) Jesus was "sanctified" by God. God does not need to be sanctified.

15.) There is only one who is good and that is God (Luke 18:19).

16.) God is greater than Christ (1 Corinthians 3:23).

17.) It was God who did miracles and wonders through Christ.

18.) Christ was given all authority. He would have already had all authority if he were God (Matthew 28:18).

19.) The phrase "Deity" never appears in the Bible, nor is Christ ever called "Deity."

20.) Ephesians 4:5 says there is one Lord.

21.) 1 Corinthians 8:6 says there is one God.

22.) Jesus called the Father the only God (John 5:44).

23.) Christ made a distinction between speaking against him and the Holy Spirit.

24.) Christ said his doctrine was not his own (John 7:16).

25.) Jesus and God have separate wills (Luke 22:42).

26.) Jesus counted himself and his Father as two (John 8:17).

27.) The Bible always portrays God and Christ as two separate beings.

28.) The Bible makes it clear that Jesus is an "heir" of God (Romans 8:7).

29.) Jesus grew in wisdom, but God is all wise.

30.) Jesus had limited knowledge (mark 13:32).

31.) God made Jesus perfect through suffering (Hebrews 2:10).

32.) Jesus received the holy spirit at his baptism. He would have already had it if he were God.

33.) Jesus was tempted. God cannot be tempted.

34.) Angels ministered and strengthened Jesus. God does not need to be strengthened.

35.) Jesus died. God cannot die.

36.) Jesus says we are his brothers. The Bible never says or even hints that we are brothers of God.

37.) We are told to do greater works than Jesus. Nobody can do greater works than God.

38.) Jesus would have already had "all authority" if he were God and would not need to be given “all authority” (Matthew 28:18).

39.) Jesus would have already had “a name above every name”if he were God and would not need to be given “a name above every name” (Philippians 2:9).

40.) Jesus would have already had "glory" if he were God and would not need to be given "glory" (John 17:22, 24).

41.) Jesus would have already been "appointed" if he were God and would not need to be “appointed” over the Church (Ephesians 1:22).

42.) Jesus was not unoriginated. Christ was the only begotten Son of God (John 3:16).

43.) Jesus was not self-existent. “I live because of the Father” (John 6:57).

44.) Jesus was not immortal. Jesus died and God resurrected him (Acts 13:30).

45.) Jesus was not all wise. Jesus “grew in wisdom” (Luke 2:52).

46.) Jesus was not all-powerful. Christ said “the Son can do nothing by Himself” (John 5:19).

47.) Jesus was not omnipresent. Jesus said after Lazarus died “I am glad I was not there” (John 11:15).

48.) Jesus is called the "Son of God" more than 50 times. Not once is he called "God the Son."

49.) The apostles also taught Jesus was a man (Act 2:22).

50.) The Bible teaches God is the “head” of Christ (Corinthians 11:3).

51.) The supposed “dual nature” of Christ is never stated in the Bible.

52.) There's no verse in the Bible that says we should believe or confess that Jesus is God.
 
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