What is death? Is it the absence of life?

[David Koberstein]

Subject Heading:- What is death? Is it the absence of life?



'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life;
and man became a living soul.'
(Gen 2:7)

'Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was:
and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.'
(Ecc 12:7)

Hello @David Koberstein,

I would be interested to know what scriptures you have to support this?

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

According to my Messianic Torah commentary Genesis (Berishet) 2:7
Formed in this verse is the Hebrew word , yetzer. Is the impulse or inclination with which humans
are endowed according to Jewish traditional belief. In verse 7 it is spelled with two yods. ייצר
In verse 19 where the animals are being created it loses one of its yods. יצר This teaches the twofold
nature of man: we have a body like the animals but a soul that comes from God. In Gen 2:7 When
God "breathes" into the body he has made for Adam, He is placing the soul into man, something
that was not done with the animals in verse 19.

Ecclesiastes (Kohelet) 12:7
And the dust returns to the ground as it was, and the lifebreath returns to Hashem Who bestowed it.

Shlomo (Solomon) in verses 2 thru 7 metaphorically describes the inevitable aging process. The pursuit
of Adonai should take place before the physical body deteriorates in (verses 2 thru 4) and before the
fearful years that accompany old age arrive (verse 5.)
Shalom

 

[David Koberstein]

There is no inner man. The breath of life made man a living soul, not was given a soul. (The soul goes to Sheol=the grave. Psalms 89:48)
The reference to souls under the alter in heaven in Revelation is symbolic for--in Gods remembrance.

You are severely and absolutely wrong on your interpretation. Must be the protestant indoctrination when
you were growing up. Instead of misinterpretation and taking scripture out of context to fit your false
narrative; in Psalm 89 verse 47 go with verse 48.

In Hebrew, Sheol (שָׁאוֹל‎ Šəʾōl) means the state or abode of the dead. It is different from the grave, which is where the body rests after the spirit departs. Sheol is the resting place of the departed spirits or personalities.

In the Hebrew Bible, Sheol is described as an underworld of stillness and darkness. The Book of Job describes it as the farthest place from Heaven, where the dead go regardless of who they were in life.

In Judaism, Sheol became a place of waiting, where a person's soul could be purified and sent to Gan Eden or sent for punishment in Gehenna.

In the biblical Sheol, the "Bosom of Abraham" is a place of comfort where the righteous dead await Judgment Day.

Tehillim (Psalms) 89:47-48 CJB
Remember how little time I have!
Was it for no purpose that You created all humanity?
Who can live and not see death? Who can save himself from the power of the grave?

Jewish Commentary
O remember how short my life is; why should You have created every man in vain?
What man can live and not see death, can save himself from the clutches of Sheol? Selah

You really need to study the Scriptures, and adhere to 2 Timothy 2:15 (2 טימותי 2:15)

Shalom Aleichem שלום עליכם

 

[Keiw1]

You are severely and absolutely wrong on your interpretation. Must be the protestant indoctrination when
you were growing up. Instead of misinterpretation and taking scripture out of context to fit your false
narrative; in Psalm 89 verse 47 go with verse 48.

In Hebrew, Sheol (שָׁאוֹל‎ Šəʾōl) means the state or abode of the dead. It is different from the grave, which is where the body rests after the spirit departs. Sheol is the resting place of the departed spirits or personalities.

In the Hebrew Bible, Sheol is described as an underworld of stillness and darkness. The Book of Job describes it as the farthest place from Heaven, where the dead go regardless of who they were in life.

In Judaism, Sheol became a place of waiting, where a person's soul could be purified and sent to Gan Eden or sent for punishment in Gehenna.

In the biblical Sheol, the "Bosom of Abraham" is a place of comfort where the righteous dead await Judgment Day.

Tehillim (Psalms) 89:47-48 CJB
Remember how little time I have!
Was it for no purpose that You created all humanity?
Who can live and not see death? Who can save himself from the power of the grave?

Jewish Commentary
O remember how short my life is; why should You have created every man in vain?
What man can live and not see death, can save himself from the clutches of Sheol? Selah

You really need to study the Scriptures, and adhere to 2 Timothy 2:15 (2 טימותי 2:15)

Shalom Aleichem שלום עליכם

There is 0 wrong about what Psalm 89:48 teaches.
Sheol= the grave-nothing more. Sheol=Hades.
Your rendition of Sheol is not taught anywhere in the bible--its twisted words of those in darkness.
Eccl 9:10= All that your hands find to do, do with your very power, for there is no work, nor devising, nor knowledge, nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.

 

[David Koberstein]

So you are the wolf in sheep's clothing that I was warned about. You are really embarrassing yourself by your
low IQ on Scripture and being totally wrong. Sheol is not the grave. I already proved that from scripture in my previous post, but I guess
the ignorant does not want to learn from their mistakes. Of course you don't know the Hebrew and that's part of your learning disability.
I will not continue to throw my pearls before swine. I will be placing you on ignore. I will not allow you to insult my intelligence with
your stupidity. Besides I am to be a good steward of the time Adonai has allotted me and not be spending it on foolish and
ignorant people. Maybe if you get to Sheol or Gehenna you can call me and let me know how it is. My interpretation is the Messianic
version not some make believe or made up interpretation you have. You live in darkness and ignorance is your friend.
Shalom

 

[e v e]

Yes it is, Jesus likened it to being asleep. All thought stops on the day of ones death.

no they do not the carnal flesh being separated from the soul only means that the flesh is not alive.

sleep is not death

 

[e v e]

the soul in eden was npsh one being with her covering from God , the gorgeous body He made for us which had life. And then was the fall.

on this earth we have a mortal flesh covering with no life and not from God.. it dies. It is death just as God warned. Only the soul here has life. It came to be in the other reality before this body on this earth and it will return to the other reality to God.

 

[Complete]

There are TWO deaths:

"Spiritual death" which is the absence of Spiritual life. It's the death that Adam, Eve, and the rest of us suffer when we SIN for the first time, and which "Spiritual life" is restored when we are "Born Again".

And then there's the less important "Physical death", which is only the absence of PHYSICAL LIFE

'It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
And so it is written,
The first man Adam was made a living soul;
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual,
but that which is natural;
and afterward that which is spiritual.
The first man is of the earth, earthy:
the second man is the Lord from heaven.
As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy:
and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy,
we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.'
(1Co 15:44-49)

Hello @Bob Carabbio,

With respect, the verses above tell us that the first man was not spiritual, but natural: so the death he died was not a spiritual death, but a natural death.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
our Lord and Head.
Chris

 

[jeremiah1five]

Yes it is, Jesus likened it to being asleep. All thought stops on the day of ones death.

All thoughts do not stop when one dies. To be absent from the body and be in God's Presence we are not vegetable. We have thoughts, we worship with our thoughts, we speak to the Lord using our thoughts. God is God of the living and not the dead.

 

[Complete]

According to my Messianic Torah commentary Genesis (Berishet) 2:7
Formed in this verse is the Hebrew word , yetzer. Is the impulse or inclination with which humans
are endowed according to Jewish traditional belief. In verse 7 it is spelled with two yods. ייצר
In verse 19 where the animals are being created it loses one of its yods. יצר This teaches the twofold
nature of man: we have a body like the animals but a soul that comes from God. In Gen 2:7 When
God "breathes" into the body he has made for Adam, He is placing the soul into man, something
that was not done with the animals in verse 19.

Ecclesiastes (Kohelet) 12:7
And the dust returns to the ground as it was, and the lifebreath returns to Hashem Who bestowed it.

Shlomo (Solomon) in verses 2 thru 7 metaphorically describes the inevitable aging process. The pursuit
of Adonai should take place before the physical body deteriorates in (verses 2 thru 4) and before the
fearful years that accompany old age arrive (verse 5.)
Shalom

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'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; (neshamah)
and man became a living soul.'
(Gen 2:7)

https://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/gen6.pdf
'And, behold, I, even I,
do bring a flood of waters upon the earth,
to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, (ruach)
from under heaven;
and every thing that is in the earth shall die.'
(Gen. 6:17)

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'And they went in unto Noah into the ark,
two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.'(ruach)
(Gen.7:15)

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'All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, (neshamah)
of all that was in the dry land, died.'
(Gen.7:22)

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www.scripture4all.org

'The Spirit of God hath made me,
and the breath of the Almighty hath given me life.'(neshamah)
(Job 33:4)

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www.scripture4all.org

'Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was:
and the spirit (ie., breath of life) shall return unto God who gave it.'
(Ecc 12:7)

Hello @David Koberstein,

As these verses above show, the breath of life (ie., spirit), is translated from two Hebrew words, 'neshamah' and 'ruach'. All of God's creation, in which was the breath of life (i.e., 'spirit') are referred to, not just mankind.

The soul is described perfectly in Genesis 2:7. 'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.'
The breath of life, when breathed by God into man, produced a living soul: the whole person therefore is a soul. It is not immortal, but mortal, because it is spoken of in Scripture as dying. (Ezekiel 18:4 & 20).

The verses above show also that ''the breath of life energizes both Animal and Human,

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[Complete]

All thoughts do not stop when one dies. To be absent from the body and be in God's Presence we are not vegetable. We have thoughts, we worship with our thoughts, we speak to the Lord using our thoughts. God is God of the living and not the dead.

Hello @jeremiah1five,

To be absent from the body and present with the Lord requires the return of Christ, for only then will this mortal put on immortality, and corruption put on in-corruption, at the resurrection of the dead. There is no consciousness in death, for the brain is dead, and the means of communication the body has are no longer able to function. Only the resurrection power of God can raise the dead to life again, and He will do so at a time of His choosing. The breath of life returns to God Who gave it at the death of the body.

God reckons the believer who has died to be 'asleep in Christ', for they have the promise of life in Christ Jesus.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[jeremiah1five]

Hello @jeremiah1five,

To be absent from the body and present with the Lord requires the return of Christ, for only then will this mortal put on immortality, and corruption put on in-corruption, at the resurrection of the dead. There is no consciousness in death, for the brain is dead, and the means of communication the body has are no longer able to function. Only the resurrection power of God can raise the dead to life again, and He will do so at a time of His choosing. The breath of life returns to God Who gave it at the death of the body.

God reckons the believer who has died to be 'asleep in Christ', for they have the promise of life in Christ Jesus.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Christ, the Spirit is here with us right now. The second coming requires Jesus the Man to return. Until then in death we go to be with Jesus and when He returns He's bringing back everyone who died and was absent from the body in death. There is no brain dead for God is God of the living not the dead.

 

[Keiw1]

no they do not the carnal flesh being separated from the soul only means that the flesh is not alive.

sleep is not death

I showed you psalms-the soul goes into Sheol= the grave.

 

[Keiw1]

All thoughts do not stop when one dies. To be absent from the body and be in God's Presence we are not vegetable. We have thoughts, we worship with our thoughts, we speak to the Lord using our thoughts. God is God of the living and not the dead.

You are twisting that. God knows the righteous who will be resurrected( not until the last day( rev 20) are alive to him still because he knows they will live again. The bible says all thought stops-God inspired those words-your words are in opposition to God.

 

[Keiw1]

So you are the wolf in sheep's clothing that I was warned about. You are really embarrassing yourself by your
low IQ on Scripture and being totally wrong. Sheol is not the grave. I already proved that from scripture in my previous post, but I guess
the ignorant does not want to learn from their mistakes. Of course you don't know the Hebrew and that's part of your learning disability.
I will not continue to throw my pearls before swine. I will be placing you on ignore. I will not allow you to insult my intelligence with
your stupidity. Besides I am to be a good steward of the time Adonai has allotted me and not be spending it on foolish and
ignorant people. Maybe if you get to Sheol or Gehenna you can call me and let me know how it is. My interpretation is the Messianic
version not some make believe or made up interpretation you have. You live in darkness and ignorance is your friend.
Shalom

Every scholar on earth knows Sheol is the grave-and Sheol=Hades. Twisted darkness says different.

 

[TomL]

'It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
And so it is written,
The first man Adam was made a living soul;
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual,
but that which is natural;
and afterward that which is spiritual.
The first man is of the earth, earthy:
the second man is the Lord from heaven.
As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy:
and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy,
we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.'
(1Co 15:44-49)

Hello @Bob Carabbio,

With respect, the verses above tell us that the first man was not spiritual, but natural: so the death he died was not a spiritual death, but a natural death.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
our Lord and Head.
Chris

He is talking separation from God as a result of sin - spiritual death

 

[Bob Carabbio]

so the death he died was not a spiritual death, but a natural death.

Read it again. Adam died PHYSICALLY at 930 years old. But his spiritual death happened when he tossed God under the bus, and sided with satan, giving over to satan his delegated earthly authority, and making satan "the prince of the POWER of the AIR".

God's warning Gen 2:37 indicated that Adam's DEATH would occur IN THE DAY that he ate the fruit, and his SPIRITUAL DEATH occurred immediately when Adam did exactly that. His Physical death came much later.

 

[TomL]

You are severely and absolutely wrong on your interpretation. Must be the protestant indoctrination when
you were growing up. Instead of misinterpretation and taking scripture out of context to fit your false
narrative; in Psalm 89 verse 47 go with verse 48.

In Hebrew, Sheol (שָׁאוֹל‎ Šəʾōl) means the state or abode of the dead. It is different from the grave, which is where the body rests after the spirit departs. Sheol is the resting place of the departed spirits or personalities.

In the Hebrew Bible, Sheol is described as an underworld of stillness and darkness. The Book of Job describes it as the farthest place from Heaven, where the dead go regardless of who they were in life.

In Judaism, Sheol became a place of waiting, where a person's soul could be purified and sent to Gan Eden or sent for punishment in Gehenna.

In the biblical Sheol, the "Bosom of Abraham" is a place of comfort where the righteous dead await Judgment Day.

Tehillim (Psalms) 89:47-48 CJB
Remember how little time I have!
Was it for no purpose that You created all humanity?
Who can live and not see death? Who can save himself from the power of the grave?

Jewish Commentary
O remember how short my life is; why should You have created every man in vain?
What man can live and not see death, can save himself from the clutches of Sheol? Selah

You really need to study the Scriptures, and adhere to 2 Timothy 2:15 (2 טימותי 2:15)

Shalom Aleichem שלום עליכם

No he is a Jehovah Witness

 

[David Koberstein]

No he is a Jehovah Witness

Oh my apology. I thought he might have been a Baptist. Thanks for the information.
Toda Raba. Thank You
Shalom

 

[Keiw1]

'It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
And so it is written,
The first man Adam was made a living soul;
the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual,
but that which is natural;
and afterward that which is spiritual.
The first man is of the earth, earthy:
the second man is the Lord from heaven.
As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy:
and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
And as we have borne the image of the earthy,
we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.'
(1Co 15:44-49)

Hello @Bob Carabbio,

With respect, the verses above tell us that the first man was not spiritual, but natural: so the death he died was not a spiritual death, but a natural death.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
our Lord and Head.
Chris

God told Adam on the day they ate from the tree they would positively die. Adam lived a few centuries past that event physically, he did die spiritually that first day.

 

[TomL]

Oh my apology. I thought he might have been a Baptist. Thanks for the information.
Toda Raba. Thank You
Shalom

No, far from it.