Transmitting The Fallen Nature

[GeneZ]

Did Paul claim that "Justice" was the bond of perfection? Did Paul declare one of the big "THREE" was justice?

Faith, Hope, and LOVE?

Where is Justice as you demand. You demand that Love is subservient to "Justice" but there is no evidence of such to be found in the Scriptures....

By the way. Love is pure......



Sentimental.....

Herod "The Great"..... killed his own children. I bet Herod loved the word "Justice"..... until he experienced it himself.

David mourned the death of Absalom. Was Absalom's death justified?

Praise Yeshua....

Let's take a break and pause please...
I already have said enough and it appears you just want to keep moving on so you can ignore what was already said.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

WTF is Nestorianism? (What The Frack, for the humor impaired) I suppose I could google it, but I'm too lazy.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Not man could say that when speaking in a divine trance of the temporary gifts! Speaking in tongues, or prophesy.

What has that one example have to do with what was before our eyes now?

And, by the way... even Kenneth Copeland and his kind have learned they must say "Jesus is Lord!"
They do so in their flesh. Not divine trance involved like with tongues.

"Many will tell me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, didn't. we prophesy in your name, in your name cast out​

demons, and in your name do many mighty works? Matthew 7:22​

Even those being condemned to Hell will be able to call Him "Lord!" See that?

​

grace and peace ..................

Have you seen me claim that Copeland is damned? Why would I claim such?

Do you not see how you've judged another condemned in the name of Christ? You're not the judge of anyone. I'm not either.

As far as Matthew 7:22..... they are appealing to their works for justification. You've never seen me do that. Never. Either way, you're not Jesus and you don't get to define who is and who isn't redeemed. Paul wouldn't even do this... I suppose you're greater than Paul....

1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

 

[praise_yeshua]

WTF is Nestorianism? (What The Frack, for the humor impaired) I suppose I could google it, but I'm too lazy.

2 Persons in the Incarnation. Think.....Split personality.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

2 Persons in the Incarnation. Think.....Split personality.

I had to peek. Split personality? That's rare. I don't have a split personality. But I do.

 

[GeneZ]

WTF is Nestorianism? (What The Frack, for the humor impaired) I suppose I could google it, but I'm too lazy.

Its a buzzword used by first year seminary students to make themselves sound educated to impress the impressionable.

Nestorius confronted the Mary loving "Mother of God" church by explaining Mary did not give birth to God.
That she could not be the "mother of God.'
He showed with Scripture how she gave birth to only the "humanity of Christ.'

He got tripped up a bit because his understanding as to how the two natures of Christ worked and interacted was still weak.
After all... He was alone and being a pioneer on a wilderness of church dogma.

He got right the part needed to explain why Mary could not be the mother of God correct.
They expelled him rather than burn him at the stake.

Nestorius moved on and is credited for many souls saved as a missionary in countries like China at that time.
https://www.encyclopedia.com/histor...s-and-books/nestorian-and-franciscan-missions

grace and peace....

 

[GeneZ]

Have you seen me claim that Copeland is damned? Why would I claim such?

Oh dear,,,,,

Maybe he is saved? And only acting like those Jesus mentioned in Matthew 7:21-23.


“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

grace and peace ..............

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Its a buzzword used by first year seminary students to make themselves sound educated to impress the impressionable.

Nestorius confronted the Mary loving "Mother of God" church by explaining Mary did not give birth to God.
That she could not be the "mother of God.'
He showed with Scripture how she gave birth to only the "humanity of Christ.'

He got tripped up a bit because his understanding as to how the two natures of Christ worked and interacted was still weak.
After all... He was alone and being a pioneer on a wilderness of church dogma.

He got right the part needed to explain why Mary could not be the mother of God correct.
They expelled him rather than burn him at the stake.

Nestorius moved on and is credited for many souls saved as a missionary in countries like China at that time.
https://www.encyclopedia.com/histor...s-and-books/nestorian-and-franciscan-missions

grace and peace....

Thanks.

EDITED TO ADD: I know a lot of Chinese Christians. They're always talking about "God's economy". In context, it makes sense, but it seemed weird to me. I forget the name, but as far as I can tell, the notion of "God's economy" was coined by some Chinese Christian writer, and apparently they use his writings.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Its a buzzword used by first year seminary students to make themselves sound educated to impress the impressionable.

Nestorius confronted the Mary loving "Mother of God" church by explaining Mary did not give birth to God.
That she could not be the "mother of God.'
He showed with Scripture how she gave birth to only the "humanity of Christ.'

He got tripped up a bit because his understanding as to how the two natures of Christ worked and interacted was still weak.
After all... He was alone and being a pioneer on a wilderness of church dogma.

He got right the part needed to explain why Mary could not be the mother of God correct.
They expelled him rather than burn him at the stake.

Nestorius moved on and is credited for many souls saved as a missionary in countries like China at that time.
https://www.encyclopedia.com/histor...s-and-books/nestorian-and-franciscan-missions

grace and peace....

It is not a "buzzword". It is simply a reference for a distinct position relative to the HU.

Interesting how your theology diverges as it does. One moment you want to defend "Christ as man" and the next you insist that Christ didn't have a human mother.

Just where did the flesh of Christ come from? Are you preaching a supernatural flesh?

 

[synergy]

You do not have to speak to such an understanding, sir.
Because, I never was denominational.

There are a few Bible teaching, non-denominational, churches in the country.
Some are good, correctable, and always spiritually maturing.
Others, can be a horror show of everyone mutating into their latest false teaching on the menu.
Denominationalism sets boundaries and restrictions as to how far one can mature in understanding.

So? Just use the Word of God to make your points. Not naming concepts and creeds.

Stay with the Word of God.

And, if are going to resort to naming creeds?
Explain what it is that the particular creed professes rather than just referring to its title.

For example. You seem real hot on using the title "Nestorianism."
When you do that? Do you know what that does?
Most Christians do not even know what Nestorianism entails.
So, just citing the name that way you may sound informed (to the uninformed).
Doing so, you never EDUCATE anyone by doing that!

If you want to banter around Arianism?
Don't just use the title leaving those who don't know what that means remaining uneducated.
Cite specific parts of the creed you are assuming I conform with.
Then allow for me to respond to what your are screwing up.

That way? We all can get an education.....

I will try to explain, as simply as I can, how Arianism and Nestorianism attacks who Christ is. I'm just an ordinary Joe Shmoe who has no theological credentials whatsoever. Nevertheless, I'll do the best I can with as few words as possible. Interrupt the conversation whenever you need more informatipn.

Arianism is the denial that the Word was God (John 1:1) and became flesh as Jesus (John 1:14). The Word of God is a Complete One God Person (Rev 19:11-16, John 1:1) who assumed flesh (human nature) and became Jesus (1 Tim 3:16). Even though he humbled himself to the level of a servant (Phil 2:5-11), he still remained the Uncreated Word of God Person (Rev 19:11-16). Jesus Himself declared that he is the Great "I Am!" God of the OT who existed before Abraham's lifetime (John 8:58). The Pharisees, as Arians, were so appauled that they sought to stone Jesus. There is alot more that can be said but this is good for a start.

Nestorianism contains multiple heresies but I'll mention its two most flagrant errors. First is that Nestorianism declares that Christ is two persons, a Divine Person and a human person. John 1:1 already establishes Jesus as One God Person so for Nestorius to add a second person to Christ means that Christ suffers from a Dual Personality Mental Condition, akin to Schizophrenia.
Second, Nestorianism fails to acknowledge that the fullness of God's Divine nature indwells Christ bodily (Col 2:9). In other words, the Divine Nature fully permeates the human nature in Christ. In that sense, Nestorians totally miss the point with the Transfiguration. Read up on how the Divine Nature permeates even matter, clothing in this case (Luke 9:29). And because of that they cannot understand Bible verses that tell us that we as humans can "partake" of Divine Nature ( 2 Pet 1:4, Eph 3:19). More can be said but this is a good start.

 

[GeneZ]

I will try to explain, as simply as I can, how Arianism and Nestorianism attacks who Christ is. I'm just an ordinary Joe Shmoe who has no theological credentials whatsoever. Nevertheless, I'll do the best I can with as few words as possible. Interrupt the conversation whenever you need more informatipn.

Arianism is the denial that the Word was God (John 1:1) and became flesh as Jesus (John 1:14). The Word of God is a Complete One God Person (Rev 19:11-16, John 1:1) who assumed flesh (human nature) and became Jesus (1 Tim 3:16). Even though he humbled himself to the level of a servant (Phil 2:5-11), he still remained the Uncreated Word of God Person (Rev 19:11-16). Jesus Himself declared that he is the Great "I Am!" God of the OT who existed before Abraham's lifetime (John 8:58). The Pharisees, as Arians, were so appauled that they sought to stone Jesus. There is alot more that can be said but this is good for a start.

Nestorianism contains multiple heresies but I'll mention its two most flagrant errors. First is that Nestorianism declares that Christ is two persons, a Divine Person and a human person. John 1:1 already establishes Jesus as One God Person so for Nestorius to add a second person to Christ means that Christ suffers from a Dual Personality Mental Condition, akin to Schizophrenia.
Second, Nestorianism fails to acknowledge that the fullness of God's Divine nature indwells Christ bodily (Col 2:9). In other words, the Divine Nature fully permeates the human nature in Christ. In that sense, Nestorians totally miss the point with the Transfiguration. Read up on how the Divine Nature permeates even matter, clothing in this case (Luke 9:29). And because of that they cannot understand Bible verses that tell us that we as humans can "partake" of Divine Nature ( 2 Pet 1:4, Eph 3:19). More can be said but this is a good start.

Good... I am neither.

If you would like to delve into either one? Please start a new thread.

 

[GeneZ]

It is not a "buzzword". It is simply a reference for a distinct position relative to the HU.

When it remains undefined to the uninformed? Its only a buzzword.

If nothing specific is addressed? Ditto.


.........

 

[civic]

I've been battling a sickness of some sort. I've been a little disoriented. My grammar has been very poor....

I'm not a grammar checker lol. But I hope you feel better soon. Happy New Year.

 

[civic]

It is not a "buzzword". It is simply a reference for a distinct position relative to the HU.

Interesting how your theology diverges as it does. One moment you want to defend "Christ as man" and the next you insist that Christ didn't have a human mother.

Just where did the flesh of Christ come from? Are you preaching a supernatural flesh?

If you read few the last couple of days in this thread you will see kenosis and nestorious in many comments. Also some have their god being mutable, peccable, divided etc.......

 

[civic]

He would stop and walk away, or they would depart seeing they were unable to get anywhere with Him.

He could walk away leaving them basting in their own stupidity.
Yes... The Bible calls those who refuse correction "stupid."

Whoever loves discipline loves knowledge,
but whoever hates correction is stupid."

Proverbs 12:1

Then why don't you take correction on the Trinity in this discussion since I'm 100% orthodox, creedal and biblical on the Trinity and 2 natures in Christ.

 

[civic]

Its a buzzword used by first year seminary students to make themselves sound educated to impress the impressionable.

Nestorius confronted the Mary loving "Mother of God" church by explaining Mary did not give birth to God.
That she could not be the "mother of God.'
He showed with Scripture how she gave birth to only the "humanity of Christ.'

He got tripped up a bit because his understanding as to how the two natures of Christ worked and interacted was still weak.
After all... He was alone and being a pioneer on a wilderness of church dogma.

He got right the part needed to explain why Mary could not be the mother of God correct.
They expelled him rather than burn him at the stake.

Nestorius moved on and is credited for many souls saved as a missionary in countries like China at that time.
https://www.encyclopedia.com/histor...s-and-books/nestorian-and-franciscan-missions

grace and peace....

Its no buzzword its a well known heresy in the early church just like gnosticism, and arianism is a well known heresy in the early church. Kenosis is a recent heresy from the 1800's.

 

[GeneZ]

Its no buzzword its a well known heresy in the early church just like gnosticism, and arianism is a well known heresy in the early church.

When it remains undefined to the uninformed?

Its only a buzzword.

If nothing specific is addressed from within the creed? Ditto.

I have no idea how you understand what it is saying to you.

I suggested before.

Start a new thread so a creed can be discussed in detail.

Then we can iron out what is not being understood.

 

[civic]

When it remains undefined to the uninformed?

Its only a buzzword.

If nothing specific is addressed from within the creed? Ditto.

I have no idea how you understand what it is saying to you.

I suggested before.

Start a new thread so a creed can be discussed in detail.

When I say Deity of Jesus does it need defining for you ?

When I say Trinity does it need defining everytime for you ?

When I say Chalcedon do I need to define it everytime ?

Or Athanasian, or Nicene ?

 

[GeneZ]

When I say Deity of Jesus does it need defining for you ?

When I say Trinity does it need defining everytime for you ?

No,,,,

But as I learned years ago in Bible college from a pastor teaching a doctrinal class....

"The same word when used, can hold a different meaning to someone else using the word. "

Do you want to stop this thread and morph it into another thread?

Or... start a new thread where these issues can be discussed in detail?

grace and peace .................

 

[civic]

No,,,,

But as I learned years ago in Bible college from a pastor teaching a doctrinal class....

"The same word when used, can hold a different meaning to someone else using the word. "

Do you want to stop this thread and morph it into another thread?

Or... start a new thread where these issues can be discussed in detail?

grace and peace .................

In this thread and discussion we have been talking about the 2 natures in Christ and that Christ is only a Divine Person ( Historic Orthodoxy/Biblical view ) over and against the heresy of Nestorious who taught He was both a human person and a divine person.

I have mentioned his heresy in several posts and what it consisted of in this very thread the past few days.