Transmitting The Fallen Nature

[civic]

You are blanking out on his human nature!!!!!!!!!

You want nothing to do with it.

​

'You will eat the old supply and clear out the old because of the new. Moreover, ​

I will make My dwelling among you, and My soul will not reject you.'​

I will also walk among you and be your God, and you shall be My people." Lev 26:10-12​

That speaks of the Lord Jesus Christ during the Millennium. The Jews were waiting for God to set up his kingdom on earth.
The Lord God of Israel is God having also a Soul! Humanity is expressed through the Son.

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And they began to remove the foreign gods from their midst and to serve Jehovah, ​

so that his soul became impatient because of the trouble of Israel. Judges 10:16​

God is not impatient. The Lord God of Israel expressed impatience. Men could relate to that!

Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one, ​

and anyone loving violence his soul certainly hates." Ps 11:5​

People would just disappear with no reason given, if God did not express His intent by means of having a Soul that man can relate to.

If the Son of God had no Soul as his second nature things around us would happen without man being able to make sense of it.
The Son is God talking to us on our level in a manner we are able to relate to.

​

Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? ​

Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? John 14:9​

Jesus is God's human interpretation of God for humans to be made able to relate to God in a way man will understand.

Jesus by means of being both fully God and fully soul/human is able to perfectly exegete the Father to us.
God without having His Soul communicating to us would be incomprehensible and not able to be perceived.




Back in the 90's an excellent pastor who was always studying from the Greek and Hebrew taught me something unusual about John 1:18.
John uses a Greek word that is commanded of good pastors to be exegeting the Scriptures.

Later I found what he was saying to me when reading the Amplified Bible translation.

The following are two renderings of Joihn1:18.

First one is taken from a typical mainstream English translation.
The second is what the Greek emphasis is citing found the Amplified Bible.

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No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship ​

with the Father, has made him known. " John 1:18 (NIV)​

​

The Amplified Bible better expresses the Greek meaning and intent.

[He has revealed Him and brought Him out where He can be seen; He has interpreted Him and He has ​

made Him known]. John 1:18 (Amplified Bible)​

Without Jesus having a fully human soul to interpret God to us?
We would have no way to properly perceive God!

God would remain incomprehensible....

No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship ​

with the Father, has made him known. " John 1:18 (NIV)​

​

​

grace and peace ......................

You are blanking out on His deity promoting the Kenosis heresy .

Nothing but a bunch of random scriptures thrown together to support a false teaching, nothing but eisegesis above.

 

[civic]

A simple search here @GeneZ shows how many times you have denied the Trinity and promoted Kenosis

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/search/4289/?q=Died+spiritually&c[users]=GeneZ&o=relevance

 

[civic]

And spiritual death in Christendom means separation from God, no fellowship, no Spirit, no communication, dead.

That’s an abomination to accuse the Son of such blasphemy and to say the Father did that to the Son- the broken Trinity.

 

[GeneZ]

You espouse the same heresy as the heretic Kenneth Copeland that Jesus died spiritually and suffered hell for 3 days. Jesus did not die spiritually. That is impossible for one and secondly it’s not found in scripture. He died physically. Upon His physical death He said " Father into thy hands I commit my spirit. "

The following scriptures affirm that Jesus' relationship with the Father on the cross was still there and not broken.

Psalm 22:24 For he has not despised or scorned the suffering of the afflicted one; he has not hidden his face from him but has listened to his cry for help.

Luke 23:46 Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.

John 16:32 "A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me."

Hebrews 5:7 During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.

Jesus' promise to the thief on the cross that today you will be with Me in Paradise reaffirms Jesus went to be with the Father and not suffer in hell as some teach.

Jesus bearing God's “cup of wrath” and being despised and forsaken by the Father and Him turning His back on the Son is not found in Scripture.


hope this helps !!!

There is no truth that the word can not be wrongly deployed as to try to obscure its meaning.

Note this one verse from what you cited.

Luke 23:46 Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father, into your hands I commit my spirit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.

What took place on the Cross before Jesus declared "It is Finished!"

Note: He could not use the word Father.
He could only use the generic term "God."

My God, My God why have you forsaken me?

Note! He never said.... "My Father My Father!

He only returned to using "Father" after the salvation from sins was completed!
Before his humanity could be restored fellowship with the Father He had to bear our sins first and put them to death.

Then after the atonement was completed? No more sins to bear that separate us from God?
His humanity returned once more to being in fellowship with the Father.... That is why he began again saying.."Father."

Something to think about.


Grace and Truth.......

 

[synergy]

A simple search here @GeneZ shows how many times you have denied the Trinity and promoted Kenosis

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/search/4289/?q=Died+spiritually&c[users]=GeneZ&o=relevance

Wow! GZ's nihilism knows no bounds. Now he's promoting that "Jesus died spiritually". Only those who have sinned have died spiritually. GZ continues to desecrate our Lord God's good name.

 

[GeneZ]

And spiritual death in Christendom means separation from God, no fellowship, no Spirit, no communication, dead.

That’s an abomination to accuse the Son of such blasphemy and to say the Father did that to the Son- the broken Trinity.

What I have been saying, is not what you keep distorting it to mean.

 

[GeneZ]

Wow! GZ's nihilism knows no bounds. Now he's promoting that "Jesus died spiritually". Only those who have sinned have died spiritually. GZ continues to desecrate our Lord God's good name.

He experienced our spiritual deaths....

He did not have his own spiritual death....

 

[GeneZ]

You are blanking out on His deity promoting the Kenosis heresy .

Nothing but a bunch of random scriptures thrown together to support a false teaching, nothing but eisegesis above.

You keep trying. But keep failing to grasp what is said, and keep throwing what you think I seem to be saying.

There is a difference.

 

[synergy]

He experienced our spiritual deaths....

He did not have his own spiritual death....

No. No. No. As God, Jesus cannot experience any "spiritual death" whatsoever. God cannot die spiritually. That's blasphemy.

In an attempt to cure you of your Kenosis Heresy please answer me this: Is Christ a Divine Person, a Human Person, or both?

 

[civic]

No. No. No. As God, Jesus cannot experience any "spiritual death" whatsoever. God cannot die spiritually. That's blasphemy.

In an attempt to cure you of your Kenosis Heresy please answer me this: Is Christ a Divine Person, a Human Person, or both?

Amen

 

[GeneZ]

No. No. No. As God, Jesus cannot experience any "spiritual death" whatsoever. God cannot die spiritually. That's blasphemy.

In an attempt to cure you of your Kenosis Heresy please answer me this: Is Christ a Divine Person, a Human Person, or both?

Jesus as God did not experience spiritual death....

It was the other nature.
You know him?
His humanity.

Once you guys stop raving and settle down, maybe it can dawn on you two that Jesus actually consists of two Natures.
Not one nature as you keep seeing Him as being.
Two DISTINCT natures.
Fully God and Fully Man.

One nature can never be separated from fellowship with God. = The Deity of Christ.
And, so far. That is all you know....

And, possibly and sadly...
That's all you want to know.

 

[civic]

Jesus as God did not experience spiritual death....

It was the other nature.
You know him?
His humanity.

Once you guys stop raving and settle down, maybe it can dawn on you two that Jesus actually consists of two Natures.
Not one nature as you keep seeing Him as being.
Two DISTINCT natures.
Fully God and Fully Man.

One nature can never be separated from fellowship with God. = The Deity of Christ.
And, so far. That is all you know....

And, possibly and sadly...
That's all you want to know.

Neither did He as a man suffer spiritual death, experience spiritual death or any separation or wrath from the Father.

 

[sawdust]

And yet, being forsaken by God is exactly what Jesus said was happening to Him. Go figure.

 

[GeneZ]

Neither did He as a man suffer spiritual death, experience spiritual death or any separation or wrath from the Father.

I can see that.

And, so can millions of others ... when they read...

About the ninth hour Jesus cried out with a loud [agonized] voice, ​

“Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani?” that is, “My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?”​

Its simple.... Jesus was lying.

Civic said so.

Civic knows dogmas.

 

[synergy]

Jesus as God did not experience spiritual death....

It was the other nature.
You know him?
His humanity.

Once you guys stop raving and settle down, maybe it can dawn on you two that Jesus actually consists of two Natures.
Not one nature as you keep seeing Him as being.
Two DISTINCT natures.
Fully God and Fully Man.

One nature can never be separated from fellowship with God. = The Deity of Christ.
And, so far. That is all you know....

And, possibly and sadly...
That's all you want to know.

You are forgetting the Personhood of Christ.
The Personhood of Christ cannot be split into two (human and Divine).
That's because to spilt his Personhood into two is Nestorianism.
Nor can Christ's Personhood be fully two persons (human and Divine) because then Christ can be accused of Dual Personality Illness.

So answer me this question:
Is Christ a Divine Person, a Human Person, or both?

 

[GeneZ]

You are forgetting the Personhood of Christ.
The Personhood of Christ cannot be split into two (human and Divine).
To spilt his Personhood into two is Nestorianism.
Nor can Christ's Personhood be two (human and Divine) because then Christ could be accused of Dual Personality Illness.

So answer me this question:
Is Christ a Divine Person, a Human Person, or both?

Jesus Christ is Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is a union of Deity and Humanity.
That is what He is...

The labels are not important, and only used as tinder to start fights and quarrels.

Sadly...

Some people like fights and quarrels more than they like being humbled into a deeper understanding of truth.

 

[sawdust]

I will give you a few below that disproves He functioned only as a man.

1- He forgave sin, only God can forgive a man of their sins
2- He said to believe in Me to have salvation- only God can save
3- He said eternal life is found in Him- Only God can give eternal life
4- He had power over satan,demons, sea, wind, sickness, disease, the dead etc..... only God has the power over them
5- He was worshiped by men and angels- only God is to be worshiped.

I could list a few dozen more examples but this is enough to suffice. You are espousing the kenosis heresy. That teaches Jesus was only a man during His earthly life.

hope this helps !!!

Doh!

On whose authority did Jesus speak and act?

John 14:10
Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.

Jesus had both the power and the authority to function as God because He is God. He chose not to function as God but relied on the authority of the Father in all He said and did.

 

[synergy]

Jesus Christ is Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is a union of Deity and Humanity.
That is what He is...

The labels are not important, and only used as tinder to start fights and quarrels.

Sadly...

Some people like fights and quarrels more than they like being humbled into a deeper understanding of truth.

Christ asks the most profound question that can be asked of anyone:

(Matt 16:15) “But what about you?” he asked. “Who do you say I am?”

If your Nestorianism makes you evade that question with accusations of "labels", then that's on you.

 

[civic]

Doh!

On whose authority did Jesus speak and act?

John 14:10
Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.

Jesus had both the power and the authority to function as God because He is God. He chose not to function as God but relied on the authority of the Father in all He said and did.

1-Where does Jesus say He chose not to function as God ?

2-Can the Father or Holy Spirit not function as God ? yes or no

3-Is Jesus a Divine Person ? yes or no

 

[GeneZ]

I will give you a few below that disproves He functioned only as a man.

1- He forgave sin, only God can forgive a man of their sins.

Jesus who was functioning in his humanity as a prophet knew our sins were forgiven.