Total Depravity

[TomL]

Well in case you didn't notice the world of 2 Corinthians 5:19 does not have sin charged to it!

Yes, the world, which does not mean the elect

2 Corinthians 5:19 (NIV84) — 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

Reconciliation is the message that was committed to the apostles so that men might accept it and therefore be saved

.
John 3:31–36 (NIV) — 31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. 32 He testifies to what he has seen and heard, but no one accepts his testimony. 33 Whoever has accepted it has certified that God is truthful. 34 For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God gives the Spirit without limit. 35 The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands. 36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.

 

[Presby02]

It is always the same with you. It is either Calvinism or Universalism.

I bet you sleep good at night with such meager thoughts.....

I have never said such a thing. Poor effort

 

[praise_yeshua]

I have never said such a thing. Poor effort

Your heart says. Your theology says it. Your lips or fingers are not the only things that speak.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Well in case you didn't notice the world of 2 Corinthians 5:19 does not have sin charged to it!

Okay. Lets go there.....

What is that "world"...... you're referencing?

 

[praise_yeshua]

We'll see you on judgment Day how's that?

How will you feel that day?

 

[praise_yeshua]

Really because I said I'll see you at on judgment Day? Looking like I'm having my judgment Day right now

No authority involved now.

Are you going to cheer the destruction of who you believe the "wicked" are?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Genesis 6:5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Has mankind changed since then? How would that be possible?

Mankind has never changed, and his nature is exactly the same as it was when Adam was first created. HUman nature is the same for Adam, Me, and Jesus. the difference for Jesus was that when HE was tempted in every way AS WE ARE, HE NEVER allowed his "Lust" (deep human desires) conceive, and birth SIN.

 

[brightfame52]

As was seen


The elect are not all people, all human beings, or the world.

You need to start believing what the scripture clearly shows.

All just means all the elect, its meaning ethnicity doesnt have anything to do with it. Gentiles are included in Gods Salvation purpose to save His People from their sins. I tell you the words all, and world has been a terrible stumbling block for many many folk.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Mankind has never changed, and his nature is exactly the same as it was when Adam was first created. HUman nature is the same for Adam, Me, and Jesus. the difference for Jesus was that when HE was tempted in every way AS WE ARE, HE NEVER allowed his "Lust" (deep human desires) conceive, and birth SIN.

Lust is sin. There is no context of lusting without committing sin.

The very thought of desire relative to your own experience is sin. Desiring what you do not know, is another thing entirely. Lust comes from experience.

This "conceived" nonsense you're referencing is just giving yourself "a get out of jail free card".

 

[praise_yeshua]

All just means all the elect, its meaning ethnicity doesnt have anything to do with it. Gentiles are included in Gods Salvation purpose to save His People from their sins. I tell you the words all, and world has been a terrible stumbling block for many many folk.

It isn't difficult to understand all or world. Both are contextual.

What you can't do is ignore the times that "all" literally means "all" humanity. Sure. "All" doesn't always have the context of literally "all" things but many times it does.

This nonsense rule that "Calvinists" have is just more examples of their self serving theology. For example.....

Christ died for every single human being that ever was or ever will be because He literally became FLESH in likeness to ALL humanity. You're not special when it comes to flesh. You never have been. You never will be. The Priestly work of Christ includes every single individual relative to the class of human being.

Limited Atonement has no limitations relative to flesh. ZERO.

This very aspect of Limited Atonement destroys Calvinism so completely, there isn't anything left.....

 

[praise_yeshua]

Yes, the world, which does not mean the elect

2 Corinthians 5:19 (NIV84) — 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

Reconciliation is the message that was committed to the apostles so that men might accept it and therefore be saved

.
John 3:31–36 (NIV) — 31 The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. 32 He testifies to what he has seen and heard, but no one accepts his testimony. 33 Whoever has accepted it has certified that God is truthful. 34 For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God gives the Spirit without limit. 35 The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands. 36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them.

Correct. The offering of Jesus Christ once for all of humanity is not trifle. It is an offer of relationship that must be answered. It both frees and condemns.

 

[brightfame52]

@TomL

Yes, the world, which does not mean the elect

Yes it does, Paul said they were the called and chosen earlier 1 Cor 1:24-28

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26 ;For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

And besides that only a remnant of the entire world doesnt have sinned charged to it. You can never apply the world of 2 Cor 5:19 to the entire world of mankind, if that was so, dont need Judgement day

 

[brightfame52]

Okay. Lets go there.....

What is that "world"...... you're referencing?

The world in 2 Cor 5:19 duh

 

[brightfame52]

It isn't difficult to understand all or world. Both are contextual.

What you can't do is ignore the times that "all" literally means "all" humanity. Sure. "All" doesn't always have the context of literally "all" things but many times it does.

This nonsense rule that "Calvinists" have is just more examples of their self serving theology. For example.....

Christ died for every single human being that ever was or ever will be because He literally became FLESH in likeness to ALL humanity. You're not special when it comes to flesh. You never have been. You never will be. The Priestly work of Christ includes every single individual relative to the class of human being.

Limited Atonement has no limitations relative to flesh. ZERO.

This very aspect of Limited Atonement destroys Calvinism so completely, there isn't anything left.....

The word all, world, everyone is just emphasizing ethnicity, it was alway supposed Gods Salvation interest among men was only for jews.

 

[praise_yeshua]

The world in 2 Cor 5:19 duh

Can you elaborate without repeating your last statement again. That is what you do when you can't give a meaningful answer of any sort. Be different this time please!

 

[praise_yeshua]

The word all, world, everyone is just emphasizing ethnicity, it was alway supposed Gods Salvation interest among men was only for jews.

So... all ethnicities?

How does that leave anyone out?

 

[brightfame52]

Can you elaborate without repeating your last statement again. That is what you do when you can't give a meaningful answer of any sort. Be different this time please!

I already elaborated, maybe 1000 times

 

[praise_yeshua]

I already elaborated, maybe 1000 times

Not to me. I'm not reading everything you previous wrote. I think we know one another better than this.

Your last response was better. I appreciate it.

 

[brightfame52]

So... all ethnicities?

How does that leave anyone out?

Yeah, you may not have noticed, in scripture, the jews thought God only had a saving interest and loved only them, But Jesus said to Nicodemus, Jn 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

The emphasis is on Gentiles when a jew heard that. Do you know what Gentiles mean ?

 

[brightfame52]

Not to me. I'm not reading everything you previous wrote. I think we know one another better than this.

Your last response was better. I appreciate it.

Well its to you if you ever read a post of mine.