The Trinity and the Incarnation

[FreeInChrist]

I disagree - He is accused of making himself out to be God ---- Jesus constantly, repeatedly said who his Father was which made him SON OF God and Jesus constantly, repeatedly said that he was the Messiah, the Christ but Jesus did not say he was God.

When you are standng in front of God at judgement and He asked you why you denied His Son was God....
What are you going to say?

 

[amazing grace]

And the Father never said “ I am God “

Next fallacy

He didn't have to --- there are plenty of scriptures that say the Father is God....God the Father.

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ......that together you may with one voice glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.......Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.......yet for us there is one God, the Father, .......Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ......Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort,.........The God and Father of the Lord Jesus, he who is blessed forever, knows that I am not lying........Paul, an apostle—not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead—........Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ,.......who gave himself for our sins to deliver us from the present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father, ....etc., etc.

 

[charismaticlady]

So you're saying a human has the same thing the Son of God has?

Melchizedek was not human. He was a theophany of Jesus. In other words, the preexistent substance of the Word, which became Jesus, was seen in the Old Testament. He was also the Angel of the Lord. That is the only "angel" that allowed Himself to be worshipped. No created angel allowed themselves to be worshipped. Jesus was also the burning bush. The I Am. And was who Moses saw on Mt. Sinai. Only God allows worship. Therefore, Jesus is God. It's just a fact that someone must be taught not to believe.

 

[amazing grace]

When you are standng in front of God at judgement and He asked you why you denied His Son was God....
What are you going to say?

I don't think He will ask me that because His Son is not Him. Jesus, the Son of God, the Lamb of God will be right there with him.

 

[charismaticlady]

And the Father never said “ I am God “

Next fallacy

This is all I found. Exodus 3

14 And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’” 15 Moreover God said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever, and this is My memorial to all generations.’

This the name Jesus called Himself.

cc: @amazing grace

 

[civic]

He didn't have to --- there are plenty of scriptures that say the Father is God....God the Father.

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ......that together you may with one voice glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.......Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.......yet for us there is one God, the Father, .......Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ......Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort,.........The God and Father of the Lord Jesus, he who is blessed forever, knows that I am not lying........Paul, an apostle—not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead—........Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ,.......who gave himself for our sins to deliver us from the present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father, ....etc., etc.

Jesus didn’t have to either

Next fallacy

 

[amazing grace]

Jesus didn’t have to either

Next fallacy

Look unis are told all the time that they have to believe Jesus is God for salvation but yet no scripture claims that so out of approximately 31,102 scripture - I would like ONE scripture that says God is Triune.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says we must believe Jesus is God.
I want ONE scripture that actually says one must believe I that God is three persons YET ONE GOD.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says Jesus is God because if it's that important of a doctrine it should be plainly and clearly taught by SOMEONE.
I would like ONE scripture that calls Jesus God the Son.
I would like ONE scripture that says Jesus is a god-man, or 100%God 100%man.

I'm pretty sure God would have set in his word the way in which humanity should be saved and I believe he did.
Thanks.

 

[amazing grace]

This is all I found. Exodus 3

14 And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’” 15 Moreover God said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever, and this is My memorial to all generations.’

This the name Jesus called Himself.

cc: @amazing grace

No that is NOT God's NAME - no one is named 'I Am' . . . He name is Yahweh - in scripture it is distinguished by being in all caps LORD and that is his name forever to all generations. The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, the God of Jacob is Yahweh, the LORD God Almighty. And he is the Father . . . Have we not all one Father? Has not one God created us? Why then are we faithless to one another, profaning the covenant of our fathers? Malachi 2:10

I am is a statement of self identification . . . a very common statement of self identification.

 

[Peterlag]

Look unis are told all the time that they have to believe Jesus is God for salvation but yet no scripture claims that so out of approximately 31,102 scripture - I would like ONE scripture that says God is Triune.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says we must believe Jesus is God.
I want ONE scripture that actually says one must believe I that God is three persons YET ONE GOD.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says Jesus is God because if it's that important of a doctrine it should be plainly and clearly taught by SOMEONE.
I would like ONE scripture that calls Jesus God the Son.
I would like ONE scripture that says Jesus is a god-man, or 100%God 100%man.

I'm pretty sure God would have set in his word the way in which humanity should be saved and I believe he did.
Thanks.

May I add ...

If there is a trinity then why not just come out and say it? Why do we have to jump all over the Bible cutting and pasting pieces of words that are scattered all over the Bible? Why not just teach it? I know enough about how the Bible is written in the New Testament and in the Gospels to know if there was a trinity it would have been taught. The Gospels would have clearly said...

Verily, verily I say unto you that I am Jesus and I'm also God.

The Epistles would have writings like...

Yay, I Paul do testify that Jesus who is God came down from heaven to be a man for us. And we do know and testify that this same Jesus who you crucified is God. And so let us bow our knee to the one and only true God-Man Jesus Christ.

And yet there's nothing like that anywhere. Not in the Old or New Testament. Not even one complete verse like that.

P.S. Im going to post what you wrote above elsewhere. Thanks.

 

[civic]

Look unis are told all the time that they have to believe Jesus is God for salvation but yet no scripture claims that so out of approximately 31,102 scripture - I would like ONE scripture that says God is Triune.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says we must believe Jesus is God.
I want ONE scripture that actually says one must believe I that God is three persons YET ONE GOD.
I would like ONE scripture that actually says Jesus is God because if it's that important of a doctrine it should be plainly and clearly taught by SOMEONE.
I would like ONE scripture that calls Jesus God the Son.
I would like ONE scripture that says Jesus is a god-man, or 100%God 100%man.

I'm pretty sure God would have set in his word the way in which humanity should be saved and I believe he did.
Thanks.

Not one scripture says I have to believe " the Father is God" to be saved.

next fallacy

 

[Runningman]

Melchizedek was not human. He was a theophany of Jesus. In other words, the preexistent substance of the Word, which became Jesus, was seen in the Old Testament. He was also the Angel of the Lord. That is the only "angel" that allowed Himself to be worshipped. No created angel allowed themselves to be worshipped. Jesus was also the burning bush. The I Am. And was who Moses saw on Mt. Sinai. Only God allows worship. Therefore, Jesus is God. It's just a fact that someone must be taught not to believe.

I am going to have to put you on pause.

First of all, if Melchizedek was a theophany of Jesus then Hebrews 7 would not say: "without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like the Son of God, remains a priest continually."

A theophany would be an audible or visible manifestation of God appearing. Hebrews 7:3 says Mel is "like" Jesus on the point of having an eternal priest because of Mel's absence of a genealogical record. Playing on a technicality, if Mel doesn't have a record of his birth or death then, wow, he must be alive forever, but not literally. Mel is also said to be a real person who Abraham interacted with in Genesis 14.

Secondly, there is no mention or reason why Jesus would be the angel of the Lord unless you are attempting to make the argument that Jesus is not God. If that's what you are trying to do then I agree, but pre-existing as a messenger of God doesn't help your case either.

Sorry, everything you are saying is just your belief and opinion, not something the Bible is explicit about.

 

[amazing grace]

May I add ...

If there is a trinity then why not just come out and say it? Why do we have to jump all over the Bible cutting and pasting pieces of words that are scattered all over the Bible? Why not just teach it? I know enough about how the Bible is written in the New Testament and in the Gospels to know if there was a trinity it would have been taught. The Gospels would have clearly said...

Verily, verily I say unto you that I am Jesus and I'm also God.

The Epistles would have writings like...

Yay, I Paul do testify that Jesus who is God came down from heaven to be a man for us. And we do know and testify that this same Jesus who you crucified is God. And so let us bow our knee to the one and only true God-Man Jesus Christ.

And yet there's nothing like that anywhere. Not in the Old or New Testament. Not even one complete verse like that.

P.S. Im going to post what you wrote above elsewhere. Thanks.

Yea, why keep something so important as a means for our salvation hidden, secret, mysterious! It seems sort of cruel.