The Potter and the Clay

I see God revealed through Christ is one who would rather die than condemn another. He would rather pay the price Himself than make His enemy pay it. He desires mercy over justice (Mt. 5:38-41; Mt. 9:13). He loves His enemies and gives Himself up for them (Mt. 5:43-48). He is like the “good Samaritan” who does not pass by on the other side of the road to avoid His enemies, but instead stops to provide for them even in their rebellion (Lk. 10:25-37).

I love Him for that. I want to brag on Him, glorify Him, because He is humble at heart and longs for all who are weak to come and find rest in Him (Mt. 11:28-29). I see Jesus as a perfect reflection of the very nature of God. I marvel and boast in the work of Christ because He is not seeking glory for Himself, but for others, and in so doing reveals Himself as the most glorious of all.

Flowers, Leighton. The Potter's Promise
 
Bassnah said:
I see God revealed through Christ is one who would rather die than condemn another. He would rather pay the price Himself than make His enemy pay it. He desires mercy over justice (Mt. 5:38-41; Mt. 9:13). He loves His enemies and gives Himself up for them (Mt. 5:43-48). He is like the “good Samaritan” who does not pass by on the other side of the road to avoid His enemies, but instead stops to provide for them even in their rebellion (Lk. 10:25-37).

I love Him for that. I want to brag on Him, glorify Him, because He is humble at heart and longs for all who are weak to come and find rest in Him (Mt. 11:28-29). I see Jesus as a perfect reflection of the very nature of God. I marvel and boast in the work of Christ because He is not seeking glory for Himself, but for others, and in so doing reveals Himself as the most glorious of all.

Flowers, Leighton. The Potter's Promise
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The true God for His Glory has made some people for heaven and some people for hell
 
brightfame52 said:
The true God for His Glory has made some people for heaven and some people for hell
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You are describing a false god.

When I call God “good” I mean that He is “recognizably good,” which is based on standards revealed to us in the Scriptures. The news about God is called the “Gospel” (good news) because God’s character is loving, kind, patient, impartial, just, right and clearly made known. In short the truth about God is good because He is good… recognizably good. Those who selflessly provide for others in need are called “good” for a reason and it is for this same reason that we call God “good.”

I'm not saying this out of obligation or fear of punishment, but because I see His goodness by what He does. The bible teaches us of His goodness and His willingness to provide for those in need. The Scriptures are consistent with His good character.

That is what God does though His Son, Jesus Christ.

The Bible clearly demonstrates the loving character of a God who treats His creation in a recognizably good way; a God who does not arbitrarily play favorites or show biased partiality; a God who makes Himself known in a clear and believable way; a God who is not most glorified at the expense of His creation, but at the expense of Himself for the sake of His creation; a God who demonstrates His love by providing the means of salvation for every individual, not because He has to, but because of who He is!
 
brightfame52 said:
@Bassnah

You wish, He is the True God, who we shall soon meet in Judgment !
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You preach a false gospel and have a false god. No wishing about it, fact. The will of God is that if anyone believes on Jesus Christ, he is saved and has eternal life. If you believe this, then you are saved. If you do not believe this, then you are calling God a liar. Please note this to be the official “record” of God. This is what God would like you to know, as a result of reading the scriptures.
 
Cosmo said:
THE POTTER AND THE CLAY

The illustration is a common one in the Old Testament, and it is reasonable that Paul’s use of it should be colored by its usage there.

It occurs in Jeremiah 18:1–10. Jeremiah, in great despondency over the demoralization of Israel, was bidden to go down to the potter’s house. The potter shaped a vessel on the wheel, but, owing to some defect in the clay, the vessel was marred. So the potter made, of the same lump, another vessel different from that which he had at first designed. He did not throw away the clay, but his skill prevailed to triumph over the defect, and to make a vessel, perhaps inferior to the first, yet still capable of use.

So God had designed Israel for a high destiny, a royal nation, a peculiar people; but Israel defeated this destiny by its idolatries and rebellions. Hence God made it another and baser vessel. “The pressure of the potter’s hand was to be harder. Shame and suffering and exile—their land left desolate, and they themselves weeping by the waters of Babylon—this was the process to which they were now called on to submit.”

The potter exercised his power by making the vessel unto dishonor which he originally designed unto honor. Side by side with the potter’s power over the clay, there goes, figuratively speaking, in the prophet’s representation, the power of change and choice in the lump. “Ye are in my hand as this clay in the hand of the potter. If, when I am about to degrade the nation, they turn from their evil, I will repent of the evil. On the contrary, when I am planning for an honorable and powerful kingdom, if the people turn to evil, then I will repent of the good wherewith I said that I would benefit them.”

Israel has a power of choice. If it is made into a vessel unto dishonor, the fault is its own, but repentance and submission may change the issue.


Marvin Richardson Vincent, Word Studies in the New Testament
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Nice
 
brightfame52 said:
No that would be you with the man of sin who exalts man over God in salvation
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nope Jesus is my only source for TRUTH- He is the WAY, the TRUTH and the LIFE- His teaching contradicts your beliefs. He taught the exact opposite of your doctrines. I have proven that with His teaching with numerous parables proving TULIP is false.

Matthew 13- The Parable of the Sower


1The same day went Jesus out of the house, and sat by the sea side.
2 And great multitudes were gathered together unto him, so that he went into a ship, and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the shore.
3 And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow;
4 And when he sowed, some seeds fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up:
5 Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth:
6 And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away.
7 And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them:
8 But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold.
9 Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.


10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.


18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.


19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.

20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.

23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

T- man can choose to hear, see and receive the gospel
U- all can choose to believe and receive as demonstrated in the parable of the 4 soils
L- all soils received the seed without exception
I- 3 soils resisted all but 1 soil remained faithful and did not resist
P- 3/4 soils ( minds/hearts )did not preserver in the faith

1- Only something alive can be choked. You cannot choke the dead. And as we can see they all had life to begin with in each soil.
2- Only something alive can be scorched by the Sun and withered.
3- Only someone alive can receive the word in the heart and have it snatched away
4- Only someone alive can receive the word with Joy and endure for a while

Luke 14:23 And the master said to the servant, ‘Go out to the highways and hedges and compel (αναγκασον) people to come in, that my house may be filled. 24 For I tell you, none of those men who were invited shall taste my banquet.’” @synergy. Remember this from the old forum :) The Greek word αναγκασον is to urge or compel, not irresistibly draw.

There are 4 major Calvinist pillars that fall with the Parable of the Wedding Feast which is connected to the Parable of the Sower above.
  1. Monergism (Total Depravity),
  2. Preservation of Saints (many called by God but few chosen by God),
  3. Irresistible Grace (many called by God but few chosen by God),
  4. and even Limited Atonement because as many as could possibly be found were invited

Some O.T. light shed upon the N.T. :)

Jeremiah 4:3, and Hosea 10:12 say the following,

For thus saith the LORD to the men of Judah and Jerusalem, Break up your fallow ground, and sow not among thorns.
Jeremiah 4:3

Sow to yourselves in righteousness, reap in mercy; break up your fallow ground: for it is time to seek the LORD, till he come and rain righteousness upon you. Hosea 10:12

Both of these verses say that WE are to prepare the soil of our hearts! It is WE who do the plowing.


Resistible Grace

Acts 7:51
“You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.

Matthew 22:3
And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

Matthew 23:37
Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets and stoning those having been sent to her! How often would I have gathered together your children, the way in which a hen gathers together her chicks under the wings, and you were not willing!

Proverbs 1:24
Because I have called and you refused to listen, have stretched out my hand and no one has heeded,

Isaiah 65:12
I will destine you for the sword, and you will all kneel down to be slaughtered, because I called and you did not answer, I spoke and you did not listen; you did evil in My sight and chose that in which I did not delight."

Isaiah 66:4
So I will choose their punishment and I will bring terror upon them, because I called and no one answered, I spoke and no one listened. But they did evil in My sight and chose that in which I did not delight."


The Atonement has no limits

John 1:29
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!

Hebrews 2:9
But we do see Jesus, who was made lower than the angels for a little while, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.

Titus 2:11
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,

Titus 3:4
But when the kindness and the love of mankind of God our Savior appeared

John 3:16
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord does not delay his promise, as some regard “delay,” but he is patient with you, not wishing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Corinthians 5:14
For Christ’s love compels us, because we are convinced that one died for all, and therefore all died.

conclusion: Jesus , the prophets and Apostles taught the opposite of tulip

hope this helps !!!
 

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