Refuting effectually caused faith

[brightfame52]

Faith is not of ourselves, it flows from the Sanctification of the Spirit, hence has purifying properties, hence we read in Acts 15:9

And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Now can we as dead unregenerate sinners claim such a Property came from ourselves ? Can they in the flesh do such a thing ? Rom 8:8

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Now Faith in and of itself doesnt purify our hearts, but gives us to apprehend, embrace, receive Him that has by His Blood purified us, Heb 9:14

How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

That word purge is the same greek word for purifying in Acts 15:9

 

[TomL]

Faith, its as plain as the noon day Sun, is the fruit /effect of the Spirit Gal 5:22 dont tell me you believe the scripture.

What is plain is that you are not capable of addressing rebuttal

One must be indwelt by the spirit to have the fruit of the Spirit

and you cannot have the spirit without faith

John 7:38 Whoever believes in me, as the Scripture has said, ‘Out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Gal. 3:2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?

Gal. 3:5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—

Gal. 3:14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.

Eph. 3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith—that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

So Gal 5:22 is not speaking of saving faith

and you simply ignore the whole council of God

 

[brightfame52]

What is plain is that you are not capable of addressing rebuttal

One must be indwelt by the spirit to have the fruit of the Spirit

and you cannot have the spirit without faith

John 7:38 Whoever believes in me, as the Scripture has said, ‘Out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Gal. 3:2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?

Gal. 3:5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—

Gal. 3:14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.

Eph. 3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith—that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

So Gal 5:22 is not speaking of saving faith

and you simply ignore the whole council of God

Faith, its as plain as the noon day Sun, is the fruit /effect of the Spirit Gal 5:22 dont tell me you believe the scripture.

 

[civic]

What is plain is that you are not capable of addressing rebuttal

One must be indwelt by the spirit to have the fruit of the Spirit

and you cannot have the spirit without faith

John 7:38 Whoever believes in me, as the Scripture has said, ‘Out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Gal. 3:2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?

Gal. 3:5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—

Gal. 3:14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.

Eph. 3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith—that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

So Gal 5:22 is not speaking of saving faith

and you simply ignore the whole council of God

yes classic case of the cart before the horse- the tail wagging the dog.

 

[TibiasDad]

You still saying something man does ultimately made the difference, now its being submissive to mercys desire, such a jacked up comment. The desire of Gods Mercy, no such animal, God sovereignly has mercy on whom He wills

1) It makes a difference, but it is not merited. You argue that it must be meritorious, thus negating grace!

2) It makes a difference, but it is only because God requires it, which makes it a God design, not a man inspired design.

3) The desire of God’s mercy = God Sovereignly having mercy on who he wills. This it cannot be a “jacked up statement” without nullifying your own argument.

Rom 9 18

Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

He has mercy on all who believe! That is the standard God sets that identifies whom he chooses to have mercy on.

Has absolutely nothing to do with mans willing Rom 9 16

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

And God shows mercy on those that believe. That is his requirement, not our demand!


Doug

 

[brightfame52]

1) It makes a difference, but it is not merited. You argue that it must be meritorious, thus negating grace!

2) It makes a difference, but it is only because God requires it, which makes it a God design, not a man inspired design.

3) The desire of God’s mercy = God Sovereignly having mercy on who he wills. This it cannot be a “jacked up statement” without nullifying your own argument.



He has mercy on all who believe! That is the standard God sets that identifies whom he chooses to have mercy on.


And God shows mercy on those that believe. That is his requirement, not our demand!


Doug

You still saying something man does ultimately made the difference, now its being submissive to mercys desire, such a jacked up comment. The desire of Gods Mercy, no such animal, God sovereignly has mercy on whom He wills

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

You still saying something man does ultimately made the difference

And if that's true, then one man has something that another does not. Which is ridiculous. What does any man have that is not given by God?

 

[TomL]

You still saying something man does ultimately made the difference, now its being submissive to mercys desire, such a jacked up comment. The desire of Gods Mercy, no such animal, God sovereignly has mercy on whom He wills

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

 

[TomL]

Faith, its as plain as the noon day Sun, is the fruit /effect of the Spirit Gal 5:22 dont tell me you believe the scripture.

What is plain is that you are not capable of addressing rebuttal

One must be indwelt by the spirit to have the fruit of the Spirit

and you cannot have the spirit without faith

John 7:38 Whoever believes in me, as the Scripture has said, ‘Out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.’” 39 Now this he said about the Spirit, whom those who believed in him were to receive, for as yet the Spirit had not been given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Gal. 3:2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?

Gal. 3:5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith—

Gal. 3:14 so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.

Eph. 3:17 so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith—that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

So Gal 5:22 is not speaking of saving faith

and you simply ignore the whole council of God

 

[brightfame52]

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

Thats saving mercy limited to the elect. All mankind isnt saved.

 

[TomL]

Thats saving mercy limited to the elect. All mankind isnt saved.

Hardly

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

 

[civic]

Hardly

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

Don't you know ALL means sheep/elect.

Can't you see that in the text ?

 

[TomL]

Don't you know ALL means sheep/elect.

Can't you see that in the text ?

I forgot to put on the calvinist lens



Oh now I see it

 

[brightfame52]

Hardly

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

Thats saving mercy limited to the elect. All mankind isnt saved. In fact thats mercy that saves from unbelief

 

[TomL]

Thats saving mercy limited to the elect. All mankind isnt saved. In fact thats mercy that saves from unbelief

fraid not

He wills to have mercy on all

Romans 11:30–32 (KJV 1900) — 30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Mercy was God sending his son to die for all.

 

[brightfame52]

Faith in Salvation is not of ourselves since even the saved converted believer admits that of himself he cant even generate a Spiritual thought II Cor.3:5
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
The word sufficiency is the word hikanotēs:
ability or competency to do a thing,

And Salvation Faith is a greater act than thinking,

But yet the arminian freewillers tell us that their Saving Faith is of themselves, for they have greater spiritual ability being dead in sin, alienated from the life of God, without the Spirit unregenerate, than the regenerate converted believer.

 

[TomL]

Faith in Salvation is not of ourselves since even the saved converted believer admits that of himself he cant even generate a Spiritual thought II Cor.3:5
5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
The word sufficiency is the word hikanotēs:
ability or competency to do a thing,

Context
2 Corinthians 3:5–6 (UASV) — 5 Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6 who also makes us adequate as ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter, but of the Spirit, for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

show this has nothing to do with saving faith but service in the ministry

And Salvation Faith is a greater act than thinking,

But yet the arminian freewillers tell us that their Saving Faith is of themselves, for they have greater spiritual ability being dead in sin, alienated from the life of God, without the Spirit unregenerate, than the regenerate converted believer.

Oranges and apples

You ignore context and equate unlike things

 

[brightfame52]

Context
2 Corinthians 3:5–6 (UASV) — 5 Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6 who also makes us adequate as ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter, but of the Spirit, for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

show this has nothing to do with saving faith but service in the ministry


Oranges and apples

You ignore context and equate unlike things

Faith in Salvation is not of ourselves since even the saved converted believer admits that of himself he cant even generate a Spiritual thought II Cor.3:5

5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
The word sufficiency is the word hikanotēs:

ability or competency to do a thing,

 

[TomL]

Faith in Salvation is not of ourselves since even the saved converted believer admits that of himself he cant even generate a Spiritual thought II Cor.3:5

5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
The word sufficiency is the word hikanotēs:

ability or competency to do a thing,

Context
2 Corinthians 3:5–6 (UASV) — 5 Not that we are adequate in ourselves to consider anything as from ourselves, but our adequacy is from God, 6 who also makes us adequate as ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter, but of the Spirit, for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

show this has nothing to do with saving faith but service in the ministry


Oranges and apples

You ignore context and equate unlike things

 

[brightfame52]

Faith is a Covenant Blessing !

Faith is one of the laws that God in the New Covenant promised to write in the hearts of His Elect People, for instance Jer 31:31-33

Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Which law includes the law of Faith Rom 3:27

27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

Faith is the Covenant Gift of God Eph 2:8-9 22