Dizerner
Well-known member
I would not be surprised if you are denying hell already.
Warning bells should be going off all over the place for you, but you just don't care.
Then you slander God's Word and God's messenger.
That's not going to "fly."
PSA in the early Christian church
- Thread starter Dizerner
- Start date
I would not be surprised if you are denying hell already.
Warning bells should be going off all over the place for you, but you just don't care.
Then you slander God's Word and God's messenger.
That's not going to "fly."
Johann
Well-known member
civic
Well-known member
civic
Well-known member
Nice dodge where is hell presented in the gospel or a salvific message in Acts where people were saved ?
I won’t hold my breath
Good luck with AI it won’t help neither will google
Johann
Well-known member
Good luck promulgating God's love but shun God's justice, that is not rightly dividing God's Holy Scripture-that is civic's presuppositions and reading into the text, or selective reading-called proof-texting.
The most foundational Hebrew word for "justice" is מִשְׁפָּט (mishpat), derived from the root שָׁפַט (shaphat), meaning "to judge," "to govern," or "to rule," indicating both judicial decision and broader rectitude or right-ordering (Genesis 18:25; Deuteronomy 32:4).
Closely related is צְדָקָה (tsedaqah), often translated "righteousness," but in many contexts it carries judicial overtones of justice (especially distributive or restorative justice), emphasizing rightness in relationship to others and to God (Psalm 89:14; Isaiah 1:27).
Another connected term is צֶדֶק (tsedeq), a noun from the same root as tsedaqah, often meaning "justice" or "righteousness" particularly as a standard or principle (Deuteronomy 32:4; Isaiah 45:19).
When speaking specifically of God’s justice in the Hebrew Scriptures, the emphasis is often on His perfect mishpat (judgments) in accord with His unchanging tsedeq (righteousness) and emet (truth, אֱמֶת), together forming the basis for God's covenantal faithfulness (Psalm 89:14: "Righteousness and justice are the foundation of Your throne; steadfast love and faithfulness go before You").
Example where both terms appear side-by-side describing divine attributes: מִשְׁפָּט וּצְדָקָה (mishpat u-tsedaqah), “justice and righteousness,” as found in Genesis 18:19, describing Abraham’s expected way of life under divine covenant, reflecting God's own moral nature.
In prophetic literature, such as Isaiah, God’s justice is not merely forensic (declaring right/wrong) but restorative, aimed at putting the world back into proper order (Isaiah 1:27: “Zion shall be redeemed by justice, and those in her who repent, by righteousness”).
Importantly, in biblical Hebrew thought, justice is relational as well as legal; it binds together judicial fairness, moral uprightness, and covenantal loyalty, so that divine justice is an outworking of divine mercy and faithfulness, not their contradiction.
In rabbinic tradition, these terms are expanded further: mishpat relates to God’s strict, equitable judgment (Midrash Tehillim on Psalm 9:9), while tsedaqah can take on nuances of charity or almsgiving, emphasizing that God's justice includes provision for the needy.
Thus, in summation: God's justice in Hebrew is primarily מִשְׁפָּט (mishpat), but it is inseparably bound to צֶדֶק (tsedeq) and צְדָקָה (tsedaqah), forming a holistic vision of divine righteousness that governs, saves, restores, and judges all creation.
As you do with the preponderance of the Isaiah 53 passage.
J.
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Mercy and justice absolutely go together but if it was justice that would win each time out then we would all be toast. That’s why God’s Throne was called the Mercy Seat, not a Retribution Seat.
Of course there’s divine wrath reserved by God for sinners that refuse to repent. What I’m against is the heretical depiction of wrath being manifested within the Trinity which is the hallmark of Propitiation. That would make the Trinity a Tri-Disunity.
Did you notice the words “Mercy Seat” in Rom 3:25? If the Atonement was a Propitiation then the Throne would be called “Retribution Seat”.
I just did. See my comment above.
I don’t see any wrath being shared within the Trinity as Propitiation demands.
There is a massive difference how the LXX represents Isa 53:10 and your translation above.
Isa 53:10 (LXX) καὶ κύριος βούλεται καθαρίσαι αὐτὸν τῆς πληγῆς· ἐὰν δῶτε περὶ ἁμαρτίας, ἡ ψυχὴ ὑμῶν ὄψεται σπέρμα μακρόβιον· καὶ βούλεται κύριος ἀφελεῖν
The underlined portion of the LXX verse can be literally translated into English as such: And the Lord willingly cleanse him his wounds. It sounds awkward in English but again the thing to note is that there is no "pleased", no "crush", and no "He made Him sick".
To be "pleased" means to take pleasure. That direct relationship is undeniable. Only a Sadist takes pleasure in another's calamities. That's why there is no sadistic pleasure in the LXX for Isaiah 53:10. Instead, βούλεται denotes volition, not emotion.
The word καθαρίσαι denotes cleansing, not crushing.
The word πληγῆς denotes the wounds Jesus received at the Cross at the hands of sinners, not that God made him sick.
The rest of your comments rely heavily on Hebrew knowledge which I’m woefully deficient of. I could easily present the LXX side of things but I’ve already mapped out the battle lines at Isaiah 53:10. We can debate that verse and chapter if you wish.
civic
Well-known member
Amen
civic
Well-known member
You don’t understand Gods love. Jesus demonstrated it on the cross with the guilty condemned sinner- today you will be with Me in paradise. And there are tons of other examples. The woman caught in adultery. Gods love, mercy, forgiveness is seen way more in scripture rather than His justice. Jesus taught the opposite in the sermon on the mount. No eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth. Love, mercy , forgiveness triumphs.
civic
Well-known member
The Hebrew knowledge is from AI, google and theologians not from reading and translating Hebrew into English as one learns in seminary.
I would never trust AI in any case. Thank God we have the Greek OT to help us to understand OT verses. You do know that it was the Greek OT that the Bereans used for cross examining Paul and it was the Greek OT that was overwhelmingly appealed to when the Apostles wrote their Epistles.
civic
Well-known member
Yes the LXX is often quoted by the NT writers. The New Testament writers, who wrote in Greek, often quoted or alluded to the Septuagint rather than the Hebrew Masoretic text.
Johann
Well-known member
A defective Gospel.
A Conversation with Michael Brown
Jesus died on the cross in our place, taking the punishment that we deserve and satisfying God’s wrath toward sin. It’s a simple concept, really, but much of the world has never understood it.
Just two decades after Jesus’ death and resurrection, the Apostle Paul wrote that the idea of Christ crucified was a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles. And in all of the centuries since, not much has changed. Some deny the atonement outright, claiming that God had no reason to be wrathful in the first place. Liberal theologians have touted all kinds of alternative ideas. Decision recently asked author, scholar and radio talk show host Michael Brown to give a clear explanation of what the Bible teaches about God’s wrath and Jesus’ atoning death.
Q: In what ways do false teachings about the Atonement spring from misconceptions about the nature and character of God?
A: It seems that in our generation we’ve swung from the notion of an all-angry God who is out to get us, to this other notion of an all-nice God who just wants us to have a happy life. So we have very little concept of divine judgment. We have very little concept of the consequences of sin. We have very little concept of future punishment. Basically, we’ve got this toothless grandfather of a deity with a self-help manual.
Q: Why does the world try to act like there’s no need for God to be wrathful in the first place?
A: First, we have a hard time accepting the idea that there are consequences for our actions. We don’t even want there to be such a thing as losing. We have children’s competitions where they don’t keep score because everyone has to win. So, in many ways, we want to shield people from the reality of the serious consequences of their actions. Second, we have such a broken, fatherless generation that we have constantly emphasized God’s love, goodness and acceptance. These things are very important, but we’ve gotten out of balance with it. We’ve forgotten that there are things that deserve punishment and that sin itself is ugly and bad, and God’s judgment is good and necessary. It’s not arbitrary. It is based on a combination of God’s perfect goodness, mercy and justice.
Q: Some atheists claim that the God of the Bible is unjust and capricious—that He’s got arbitrary standards, and it’s unfair to hold us to them. They say if there is such a God, they wouldn’t want to follow Him anyway. How do you respond to that?
A: First, I would remind people that the same God we’re talking about is the One who sent His Son to die for all the vile things that we’ve done. God loved us so much that He said, “I’m going to pay for all that you’ve done. In fact, I’m going to put the punishment for all that you’ve done on my Son.”
And I would ask, “Do we have a prison system? Do we have penalties for various crimes? Do we believe it’s right if a serial killer goes to jail for life without parole? Do we believe it’s right that someone who’s raped a little girl goes to prison?” We all believe that there are certain right punishments.
Imagine if Adolf Hitler had not committed suicide in a bunker—that instead, he escaped and lived a happy life in Argentina. Would that be fair or right? No. Well, that should tell us that for God to be fair, there has to be a judgment beyond this world.
We also have to understand that God’s laws are good. Everything God forbids is bad for us, and everything He calls us to is good for us. When we sin, we are sinning against our Creator and against ourselves.
Q: One liberal theologian wrote, “God did not have to arrange a killing at Calvary in order to forgive sin.” And the popular novel The Shack said that God doesn’t need to punish people for sin. What do you say to those kind of views?
A: If sin is not punished, we’ll destroy ourselves. That’s why every society has punishments for certain crimes. It has to. You cannot go without it. If you allow your children to do whatever they want to do their entire lives without consequence, you will hurt them. Standards are good. Discipline is good. Punishments are necessary. God could have simply said that He was going to look the other way—but then what about justice? What about fairness? What about what’s right?
But God did not “arrange a killing” at Calvary, nor did He commit “cosmic child abuse,” as some have claimed. I think people making these statements have no clue about the love of God. They present a superficial version of love and don’t understand deeper love.
God is perfectly just and cannot simply look the other way when sin is committed, any more than a judge can look at a serial killer and rapist and say, “Hey, you’ve had a tough life; just try to do better.” There would be outrage over something like that. So, in short, God devised a way where the Son, who was perfect in every way, could say, “I will take the punishment.”
Each human being owed a debt that none of us could pay back. But the Son of God, with His infinite “credit,” said, “I will pay for all of it.” So, at one and the same time, God can be perfectly just and perfectly merciful.
And He shows us how deeply He loves us by showing us how ugly sin is. If He simply said, “I look the other way; I forgive you,” it doesn’t show us the ugliness of sin. It doesn’t show us God’s justice. It doesn’t give us a picture of the exchange that took place through the cross. We now receive what Jesus deserves, and He took what we deserve.
This produces a gratefulness far beyond what simply saying “I forgive you” could ever produce, and it produces a hatred of sin in our lives because we’ve seen the ugly consequences of it. So, without that aspect of the cross, we do not understand the love of God.
Q: But someone might say, “It’s fine to use examples of terrible crimes against humanity, but Christians say that even something like lustful thoughts will bring God’s wrath. Why would God need to punish something like that?”
A: Let’s first recognize that God is not striking us with lightning for every lustful thought we have. Otherwise, virtually the whole human race would be dead, at least those who are old enough to have those kinds of thoughts.
“The fact is, we’re a messed-up world. We’re killing each other. We’re raping each other. Torturing each other. Filling our bodies with drugs and alcohol. But if we lived by God’s principles, we’d see that they work. God didn’t design us for those other things.”
—Michael Brown
But by being patient with us, He doesn’t mean to excuse sin. It’s to give us time to repent. And we have to ask, “Are these thoughts good?” Are those the kind of thoughts your wife would want to hear? God sees how gross and wrong and sinful those thoughts are. I think our biggest problem is that we simply don’t want to recognize how holy God is and how unholy we are, because it puts us in a position where we hear that we need to change our lifestyle.
The fact is, we’re a messed-up world. We’re killing each other. We’re raping each other. Torturing each other. Filling our bodies with drugs and alcohol. But if we lived by God’s principles, we’d see that they work. God didn’t design us for those other things. When we do things His way, we find out His way is the way of life. When we stray from that, we find out we’re on the path of death.
Q: How is it possible that the Atonement can bring us to the point that there’s no condemnation for those who are in Christ?
A: It’s because the cross is the perfect and ultimate payment for every single human sin. Our worst, most horrific acts have been paid for in full. And if we will put our trust in the Lord, there’s a divine exchange. Jesus took every sin on His own shoulders, and if we look to Him, God gives us Jesus’ perfect righteousness. It’s completely an act of mercy. ©2018 BGEA
God’s wrath and atonement: Setting the record straight - The Billy Graham Evangelistic Association of Canada
Subscribe to Decision Get your own subscription, or renewal, or bless someone by giving Decision Magazine as a gift. SUBSCRIBE NOW Michael L. Brown is the founder and president of …
www.billygraham.ca
I’m not here to spar while Civic plays border patrol, surveilling his own disciples, issuing false accusations, and promoting a compromised gospel.
This discussion on penal substitutionary atonement has seriously deteriorated--anyone who challenges Civic’s position is met with threats, as though he alone were the final arbiter of Scripture.
Thanks.
J.
civic
Well-known member
Appeal to authority fallacyA defective Gospel.
A Conversation with Michael Brown
Jesus died on the cross in our place, taking the punishment that we deserve and satisfying God’s wrath toward sin. It’s a simple concept, really, but much of the world has never understood it.
Just two decades after Jesus’ death and resurrection, the Apostle Paul wrote that the idea of Christ crucified was a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles. And in all of the centuries since, not much has changed. Some deny the atonement outright, claiming that God had no reason to be wrathful in the first place. Liberal theologians have touted all kinds of alternative ideas. Decision recently asked author, scholar and radio talk show host Michael Brown to give a clear explanation of what the Bible teaches about God’s wrath and Jesus’ atoning death.
Q: In what ways do false teachings about the Atonement spring from misconceptions about the nature and character of God?
A: It seems that in our generation we’ve swung from the notion of an all-angry God who is out to get us, to this other notion of an all-nice God who just wants us to have a happy life. So we have very little concept of divine judgment. We have very little concept of the consequences of sin. We have very little concept of future punishment. Basically, we’ve got this toothless grandfather of a deity with a self-help manual.
Q: Why does the world try to act like there’s no need for God to be wrathful in the first place?
A: First, we have a hard time accepting the idea that there are consequences for our actions. We don’t even want there to be such a thing as losing. We have children’s competitions where they don’t keep score because everyone has to win. So, in many ways, we want to shield people from the reality of the serious consequences of their actions. Second, we have such a broken, fatherless generation that we have constantly emphasized God’s love, goodness and acceptance. These things are very important, but we’ve gotten out of balance with it. We’ve forgotten that there are things that deserve punishment and that sin itself is ugly and bad, and God’s judgment is good and necessary. It’s not arbitrary. It is based on a combination of God’s perfect goodness, mercy and justice.
Q: Some atheists claim that the God of the Bible is unjust and capricious—that He’s got arbitrary standards, and it’s unfair to hold us to them. They say if there is such a God, they wouldn’t want to follow Him anyway. How do you respond to that?
A: First, I would remind people that the same God we’re talking about is the One who sent His Son to die for all the vile things that we’ve done. God loved us so much that He said, “I’m going to pay for all that you’ve done. In fact, I’m going to put the punishment for all that you’ve done on my Son.”
And I would ask, “Do we have a prison system? Do we have penalties for various crimes? Do we believe it’s right if a serial killer goes to jail for life without parole? Do we believe it’s right that someone who’s raped a little girl goes to prison?” We all believe that there are certain right punishments.
Imagine if Adolf Hitler had not committed suicide in a bunker—that instead, he escaped and lived a happy life in Argentina. Would that be fair or right? No. Well, that should tell us that for God to be fair, there has to be a judgment beyond this world.
We also have to understand that God’s laws are good. Everything God forbids is bad for us, and everything He calls us to is good for us. When we sin, we are sinning against our Creator and against ourselves.
Q: One liberal theologian wrote, “God did not have to arrange a killing at Calvary in order to forgive sin.” And the popular novel The Shack said that God doesn’t need to punish people for sin. What do you say to those kind of views?
A: If sin is not punished, we’ll destroy ourselves. That’s why every society has punishments for certain crimes. It has to. You cannot go without it. If you allow your children to do whatever they want to do their entire lives without consequence, you will hurt them. Standards are good. Discipline is good. Punishments are necessary. God could have simply said that He was going to look the other way—but then what about justice? What about fairness? What about what’s right?
But God did not “arrange a killing” at Calvary, nor did He commit “cosmic child abuse,” as some have claimed. I think people making these statements have no clue about the love of God. They present a superficial version of love and don’t understand deeper love.
God is perfectly just and cannot simply look the other way when sin is committed, any more than a judge can look at a serial killer and rapist and say, “Hey, you’ve had a tough life; just try to do better.” There would be outrage over something like that. So, in short, God devised a way where the Son, who was perfect in every way, could say, “I will take the punishment.”
Each human being owed a debt that none of us could pay back. But the Son of God, with His infinite “credit,” said, “I will pay for all of it.” So, at one and the same time, God can be perfectly just and perfectly merciful.
And He shows us how deeply He loves us by showing us how ugly sin is. If He simply said, “I look the other way; I forgive you,” it doesn’t show us the ugliness of sin. It doesn’t show us God’s justice. It doesn’t give us a picture of the exchange that took place through the cross. We now receive what Jesus deserves, and He took what we deserve.
This produces a gratefulness far beyond what simply saying “I forgive you” could ever produce, and it produces a hatred of sin in our lives because we’ve seen the ugly consequences of it. So, without that aspect of the cross, we do not understand the love of God.
Q: But someone might say, “It’s fine to use examples of terrible crimes against humanity, but Christians say that even something like lustful thoughts will bring God’s wrath. Why would God need to punish something like that?”
A: Let’s first recognize that God is not striking us with lightning for every lustful thought we have. Otherwise, virtually the whole human race would be dead, at least those who are old enough to have those kinds of thoughts.
“The fact is, we’re a messed-up world. We’re killing each other. We’re raping each other. Torturing each other. Filling our bodies with drugs and alcohol. But if we lived by God’s principles, we’d see that they work. God didn’t design us for those other things.”
—Michael Brown
But by being patient with us, He doesn’t mean to excuse sin. It’s to give us time to repent. And we have to ask, “Are these thoughts good?” Are those the kind of thoughts your wife would want to hear? God sees how gross and wrong and sinful those thoughts are. I think our biggest problem is that we simply don’t want to recognize how holy God is and how unholy we are, because it puts us in a position where we hear that we need to change our lifestyle.
The fact is, we’re a messed-up world. We’re killing each other. We’re raping each other. Torturing each other. Filling our bodies with drugs and alcohol. But if we lived by God’s principles, we’d see that they work. God didn’t design us for those other things. When we do things His way, we find out His way is the way of life. When we stray from that, we find out we’re on the path of death.
Q: How is it possible that the Atonement can bring us to the point that there’s no condemnation for those who are in Christ?
A: It’s because the cross is the perfect and ultimate payment for every single human sin. Our worst, most horrific acts have been paid for in full. And if we will put our trust in the Lord, there’s a divine exchange. Jesus took every sin on His own shoulders, and if we look to Him, God gives us Jesus’ perfect righteousness. It’s completely an act of mercy. ©2018 BGEA
God’s wrath and atonement: Setting the record straight - The Billy Graham Evangelistic Association of Canada
Subscribe to Decision Get your own subscription, or renewal, or bless someone by giving Decision Magazine as a gift. SUBSCRIBE NOW Michael L. Brown is the founder and president of …
I’m not here to spar while Civic plays border patrol, surveilling his own disciples, issuing false accusations, and promoting a compromised gospel.
This discussion on penal substitutionary atonement has seriously deteriorated--anyone who challenges Civic’s position is met with threats, as though he alone were the final arbiter of Scripture.
Thanks.
J.
Last edited by a moderator:
Johann
Well-known member
The gospel you promote is diluted, defective, and devoid of the Spirit-stripped of power-and your conduct reflects the character of your gospel, not the gospel of Christ.
Edit by Admin
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J.
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civic
Well-known member
no thats your false gospel which you cannot prove from the bible being persuaded by calvinists in your videos.
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Johann
Well-known member
The gospel you promote is diluted, defective, and devoid of the Spirit-stripped of power-and your conduct reflects the character of your gospel, not the gospel of Christ.
Your forum, your rules, your gospel.
J.
civic
Well-known member
Find hades mentioned with the gospel from the Apostles in Acts or the epistles. The only mention of hades in Acts was a fulfillment of OT prophecy that the Holy One's soul would not be abandoned to hades not His body see corruption/decay.
Nothing but adding to the gospel message preached by the Apostles. I know the gospel they preached and obviously you do not.
next fallacy.
hope this helps !!!
civic
Well-known member
Readers there are 10 times it is used.
Strong's Lexicon
hadés: Hades, the realm of the dead
Original Word: ᾅδης
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: hadés
Pronunciation: hah'-dace
Phonetic Spelling: (hah'-dace)
Definition: Hades, the realm of the dead
Meaning: Hades, the unseen world.
Matthew 11:23 N-GMS
GRK: ὑψωθήσῃ ἕως ᾅδου καταβήσῃ ὅτι
NAS: will you? You will descend to Hades; for if
KJV: shalt be brought down to hell: for if
INT: have been lifted up to Hades will be brought down for
Matthew 16:18 N-GMS
GRK: καὶ πύλαι ᾅδου οὐ κατισχύσουσιν
NAS: and the gates of Hades will not overpower
KJV: and the gates of hell shall not
INT: and [the] gates of hades not will prevail against
Luke 10:15 N-GMS
GRK: ἕως τοῦ ᾅδου καταβήσῃ
NAS: will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
KJV: shalt be thrust down to hell.
INT: to Hades you will be brought down
Luke 16:23 N-DMS
GRK: ἐν τῷ ᾅδῃ ἐπάρας τοὺς
NAS: In Hades he lifted up his eyes,
KJV: And in hell he lift up his
INT: in Hades having lifted up the
Acts 2:27 N-AMS
GRK: μου εἰς ᾅδην οὐδὲ δώσεις
NAS: MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR
KJV: soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer
INT: of me in Hades nor will you give
Acts 2:31 N-AMS
GRK: ἐνκατελείφθη εἰς ᾅδην οὔτε ἡ
NAS: ABANDONED TO HADES, NOR
KJV: left in hell, neither his
INT: was left in Hades nor the
Revelation 1:18 N-GMS
GRK: καὶ τοῦ ᾅδου
NAS: the keys of death and of Hades.
KJV: have the keys of hell and of death.
INT: and of Hades
Revelation 6:8 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἠκολούθει μετ'
NAS: Death; and Hades was following
KJV: was Death, and Hell followed with
INT: and Hades follows with
Revelation 20:13 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἔδωκαν τοὺς
NAS: which were in it, and death and Hades gave
KJV: death and hell delivered up the dead
INT: and Hades gave up the
Revelation 20:14 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἐβλήθησαν εἰς
NAS: death and Hades were thrown
KJV: death and hell were cast into
INT: and Hades were cast into
Strong's Greek 86
10 Occurrences
Strong's Lexicon
hadés: Hades, the realm of the dead
Original Word: ᾅδης
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: hadés
Pronunciation: hah'-dace
Phonetic Spelling: (hah'-dace)
Definition: Hades, the realm of the dead
Meaning: Hades, the unseen world.
Matthew 11:23 N-GMS
GRK: ὑψωθήσῃ ἕως ᾅδου καταβήσῃ ὅτι
NAS: will you? You will descend to Hades; for if
KJV: shalt be brought down to hell: for if
INT: have been lifted up to Hades will be brought down for
Matthew 16:18 N-GMS
GRK: καὶ πύλαι ᾅδου οὐ κατισχύσουσιν
NAS: and the gates of Hades will not overpower
KJV: and the gates of hell shall not
INT: and [the] gates of hades not will prevail against
Luke 10:15 N-GMS
GRK: ἕως τοῦ ᾅδου καταβήσῃ
NAS: will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
KJV: shalt be thrust down to hell.
INT: to Hades you will be brought down
Luke 16:23 N-DMS
GRK: ἐν τῷ ᾅδῃ ἐπάρας τοὺς
NAS: In Hades he lifted up his eyes,
KJV: And in hell he lift up his
INT: in Hades having lifted up the
Acts 2:27 N-AMS
GRK: μου εἰς ᾅδην οὐδὲ δώσεις
NAS: MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR
KJV: soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer
INT: of me in Hades nor will you give
Acts 2:31 N-AMS
GRK: ἐνκατελείφθη εἰς ᾅδην οὔτε ἡ
NAS: ABANDONED TO HADES, NOR
KJV: left in hell, neither his
INT: was left in Hades nor the
Revelation 1:18 N-GMS
GRK: καὶ τοῦ ᾅδου
NAS: the keys of death and of Hades.
KJV: have the keys of hell and of death.
INT: and of Hades
Revelation 6:8 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἠκολούθει μετ'
NAS: Death; and Hades was following
KJV: was Death, and Hell followed with
INT: and Hades follows with
Revelation 20:13 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἔδωκαν τοὺς
NAS: which were in it, and death and Hades gave
KJV: death and hell delivered up the dead
INT: and Hades gave up the
Revelation 20:14 N-NMS
GRK: καὶ ὁ ᾅδης ἐβλήθησαν εἰς
NAS: death and Hades were thrown
KJV: death and hell were cast into
INT: and Hades were cast into
Strong's Greek 86
10 Occurrences
civic
Well-known member
James uses gehenna once and it has nothing to do with the gospel and its not used in Acts of any other epistles. Its used 12 times in the N.T.
So the Apostles never preached the gospel or taught the gospel in their writings connecting it( hades/gehenna) with the gospel message.
People are so gullible they believe everything taught in the pulpits without studying it for themselves or questioning them.
hope this helps !!!
So the Apostles never preached the gospel or taught the gospel in their writings connecting it( hades/gehenna) with the gospel message.
People are so gullible they believe everything taught in the pulpits without studying it for themselves or questioning them.
hope this helps !!!
