Um that is not the regeneration your theology requires.
No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes it is, it is the application of salvation that Christ saving death accomplished for them. See Salvation included application. He saved His people from their sins.
FreeInChrist
Active Member
Why? Why does He have to do that ? The drawing?
First off these people already have believing faith. So why do they need to be drawn like that?
Next These people, you speak of were already predestined by the Father before creation began... is that not your belief?... so why after having been predestined, then the Father gives them their faith. (Its a gift remember) and then they believe....
What earthly or heavenly purpose is it for Him to draw people to Himself when they already have the faith?
brightfame52
Active Member
See Jn 6:44,65
Doug Brents
Active Member
Again, you are reading into this verse words that are not there. It does not say that He died for those who believe in Him. It does not say that He will draw those who will believe in Him. It says He will draw all mankind to Himself. You have got to learn to read what Scripture says, rather than reading what you want to hear.
You have failed at answering questions in the past, but I will give you another chance:
Rom 5:6 - Who does this verse say Christ died for?
FreeInChrist
Active Member
I know was in agreement with your labeling me not standard.
I proved your John 6:45 does not mean what you have been told it means...I am giving you the benefit of not beleeing it is
by your definition that you go by.
THIS IS what we with free will experience.....
“As His child, I have this living, heart-to-heart relationship because I chose to come to the Father through Jesus. That free ‘Yes’ I gave Him was the very thing He was waiting for. He didn’t drag me or program me; He drew me with love as in your John 6:44 “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.
and when I willingly said ‘I want You,’ He ran to meet me and made me His own. Because it was my choice, the closeness feels real, personal, and mutual—not something just handed down from above, but a love I reached for and He joyfully gave.”
brightfame52
Active Member
Jesus said He will draw all unto him, that means to believe in him.
brightfame52
Active Member
I'm not interested in your experience, it's not the biblical standard
No
John 12:32 (LEB) — 32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.”
All do not believe
Doug Brents
Active Member
No, it does not mean that they will all believe in Him. It means that they CAN believe in Him. Just because someone hears the Word, doesn't mean that they will have faith and be saved. It means that they CAN have faith and be saved.
civic
Active Member
yes everyone means everyone, not some or elect.
brightfame52
Active Member
If all don't believe who Christ draws to himself then he told a lie.
FreeInChrist
Active Member
And neither is what you perch.
If you want no side comments then dont put out the feelers.
I notice you not rebutting what I posted though,
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes it does. If one comes to Christ He gives them rest Matt 11:28
28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Doug Brents
Active Member
Yes, we have to come to Him, but He gave us the ability to do so by drawing us to Him when He gave His life for us. If He had not sacrificed Himself, we would not have had the ability to come to Him (as you say from John 6:45). But because He did sacrifice Himself, He allows anyone who chooses to, to come to Him and receive salvation from Him. It takes both His sacrifice, and our willingness to surrender to Him.
brightfame52
Active Member
Well coming to Him is the equivalent to believing in Him, see look Jn 6:35
And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
So if He draws one to Him, that one shall never hunger. It's a rap, for Jesus said He will draw the all to Himself. It's a rap!
Doug Brents
Active Member
Being drawn to Him is not equal to believing. Choosing to come after having been drawn is equated to being saved.
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes it is, the drawing starts the coming and believing. Jesus said He draws them unto Himself. You make it seem like He draws them but not quite to Himself.
Doug Brents
Active Member
You are still working from the position of your preconception.
In drawing all mankind, God created a way for salvation to exist. He did not force it upon anyone, nor did He drop it on them before they were even born. Each person sins, and because each sins, each needs to come to faith in Christ to receive salvation. Read Rom 5:6. Jesus didn't die for the healthy. He didn't die for the righteous. He died for the ungodly, the dead, the sinners. And EVERYONE is a sinner. Jesus died for everyone, and those who hear His Gospel, and accept it (which they are capable of doing because He drew them through His death) will receive salvation.
brightfame52
Active Member
I'm working from the scriptures
