brightfame52
Active Member
Yes its talking about giving salvation and conversion which includes believing in and following Christ
No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !
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brightfame52
Active Member
Man is Dead in sin until Drawing begins by regeneration
civic
Active Member
nope not what Jesus said at all. He gave the following 2 reasons
1- those who listen and learn from the Father are the ones who are drawn and come
2- those who do not believe are the ones who are not drawn and do not come.
conclusion: those who believe will come just like those who believe the gospel become saved. belief is always the condition for salvation, for those who are drawn and those who come to the Son.
next fallacy
Except man must first believe to gain salvation, and you ignored the verses.
Rather, it is the giving of his word, By which men may believe and come unto/believe in Jesus Christ
John 6:45 (KJV 1900) — 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
Those who believe Moses
John 5:46 (LEB) — 46 For if you had believed Moses, you would believe me, for that one wrote about me.
Those who had God as their father
John 8:42 (LEB) — 42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your father, you would love me, for I have come forth from God and have come. For I have not come from myself, but that one sent me.
Those desiring the will of God
John 7:17 (LEB) — 17 If anyone wants to do his will, he will know about my teaching, whether it is from God or I am speaking from myself.
Charles Spurgeon recognized the folly of saying that the sinner must be regenerated before he can believe:
brightfame52
Active Member
You must have been salvation to believe in Christ
brightfame52
Active Member
Yea he was inconsistent at times, the Gospel as a word of salvation is to the saved regenerate to give them to know about their salvation.
If Im not mistaken, that same Spurgeon said that calvinism is the Gospel.
Now do you believe that ?
Of course!!
...limited to the people who by their free will accepted YHWH as their GOD and Saviour and who also accepted HIS marriage proposal...but alas they also then rebelled against HIS call for the damnation of those who repudiated HIM as a liar and therefore a false god as the history of the Israelites and the Amorites portrayed for us in real time, Gen 15:16...
Yes, believers who are never condemned for their sins NOT those who have never believed so are condemned already, Jn 3:18.
FreeInChrist
Active Member
Why Calvinism (TULIP) is not supported by Scripture? - BibleAsk
The five fundamental beliefs of Calvinism can be summarized by the acronym TULIP. Here is what the letters stand for:The first belief is “Total ...
bibleask.org
Why Calvinism (TULIP) is not supported by Scripture?
brightfame52
Active Member
Thats opposition to the truth. SeeWhy Calvinism (TULIP) is not supported by Scripture? - BibleAsk
The five fundamental beliefs of Calvinism can be summarized by the acronym TULIP. Here is what the letters stand for:The first belief is “Total ...Why Calvinism (TULIP) is not supported by Scripture?
So even a Calvinist recognized the folly of putting regeneration before faith.
Not according to scripture
John 3:16For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.
Acts 16:31And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household!”
Rom 10:9–10that if you confess with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses, resulting in salvation.
Eph 2:8–9For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God; it is not from works, so that no one can boast.
Mark 16:16The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who refuses to believe will be condemned.
1 John 5:13These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, in order that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 5:24Truly, truly I say to you that the one who hears my word and who believes the one who sent me has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.
John 6:47Truly, truly I say to you, the one who believes has eternal life.
civic
Active Member
yep
brightfame52
Active Member
Do you believe what he says about Calvinism being the Gospel?
brightfame52
Active Member
You have to be saved to believe in Christ. The Gospel is hid to the lost 2 Cor 4:3
Not if you believe scripture.
John 3:16For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.
Acts 16:31And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household!”
Rom 10:9–10that if you confess with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses, resulting in salvation.
Eph 2:8–9For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God; it is not from works, so that no one can boast.
Mark 16:16The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who refuses to believe will be condemned.
1 John 5:13These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, in order that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 5:24Truly, truly I say to you that the one who hears my word and who believes the one who sent me has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.
John 6:47Truly, truly I say to you, the one who believes has eternal life.
brightfame52
Active Member
Salvation is before Faith
Again, not if you believe scripture.
John 3:16For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.
Acts 16:31And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household!”
Rom 10:9–10that if you confess with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses, resulting in salvation.
Eph 2:8–9For by grace you are saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God; it is not from works, so that no one can boast.
Mark 16:16The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who refuses to believe will be condemned.
1 John 5:13These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, in order that you may know that you have eternal life.
John 5:24Truly, truly I say to you that the one who hears my word and who believes the one who sent me has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.
John 6:47Truly, truly I say to you, the one who believes has eternal life.
Why do you replace the word of God with the word of man?
Theophilus
Administrator
That ridicules
“Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved.” Acts 16:31.
Believe in the Lord Jesus is to have faith in Him
In Christianity, the belief that faith comes before salvation is a central tenet; it posits that an individual's belief and trust in Jesus Christ are the necessary, albeit insufficient, human means through which God grants salvation. This perspective emphasizes faith as an act of receiving salvation and trusting in Christ, rather than a means of earning it, with good works being a subsequent manifestation of that genuine faith. AI
