Loving the Son

[praise_yeshua]

John 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

A recent conversation reminded me of the Scriptures above. There were a group of individuals united in their disdain for Jesus Christ. Jesus made it abundantly clear that if you claim to love the Father then you would love Him equally to the Father. It is unmistakable in John 8:42.

If you live long enough in this life, you will realize that everyone that says they love you...... really doesn't. People will claim they love you and yet give many indications that they don't actually love you. One of those indication is found in what they desire from you.

An example of this is found in John 6. Jesus left a large group of followers without telling them where He was going. I'm certain that offended them. In fact, you see it in their questioning when they finally found Him.

Joh 6:25 When they found him on the other side of the sea, they said to him, “Rabbi, when did you come here?”
Joh 6:26 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you are seeking me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate your fill of the loaves.

Notice how Jesus recognized their motives and told them exactly why He left them to themselves. They only cared about Him for what they expected to get out of them.

May I say, I see similar things in those who seek vast amounts of power FROM God. What their heart desires is reflected in what they believe about Jesus. I can't help but recognize that Unitarians see Jesus as simply being someone they will equally become in the future. As such, being equal, what they believe has little indication of a meaningful love. It seems that some are more concerned about what they expect to receive from Christ than actually loving Christ enough to be His Eternal servant.

 

[Soyeong]

John 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.

A recent conversation reminded me of the Scriptures above. There were a group of individuals united in their disdain for Jesus Christ. Jesus made it abundantly clear that if you claim to love the Father then you would love Him equally to the Father. It is unmistakable in John 8:42.

If you live long enough in this life, you will realize that everyone that says they love you...... really doesn't. People will claim they love you and yet give many indications that they don't actually love you. One of those indication is found in what they desire from you.

An example of this is found in John 6. Jesus left a large group of followers without telling them where He was going. I'm certain that offended them. In fact, you see it in their questioning when they finally found Him.

Joh 6:25 When they found him on the other side of the sea, they said to him, “Rabbi, when did you come here?”
Joh 6:26 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you are seeking me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate your fill of the loaves.

Notice how Jesus recognized their motives and told them exactly why He left them to themselves. They only cared about Him for what they expected to get out of them.

May I say, I see similar things in those who seek vast amounts of power FROM God. What their heart desires is reflected in what they believe about Jesus. I can't help but recognize that Unitarians see Jesus as simply being someone they will equally become in the future. As such, being equal, what they believe has little indication of a meaningful love. It seems that some are more concerned about what they expect to receive from Christ than actually loving Christ enough to be His Eternal servant.

God's laws were given as a gift to teach us how to love the nature of who He is and the nature of who the Son is because the Son is the exact image of God's nature (Hebrew 1:3), which is why there many verses in both the OT and the NT that connect our love for God with our obedience to His commandments. For example, by seeing that God has given wise laws was see that God is wise and by doing what is wise in obedience to them we are believing in and expressing our love for God's wisdom, and the same is true for other aspects of God's nature. If we believe in and love God's wisdom, then we will obediently rely on His instructions even if we don't think that we are obligated to do so.

A chip off the old block is someone who has the same nature as their father expressed through doing the same works, which is the sense that Jesus is the Son if God insofar as he is the exact image of God's nature expressed through setting a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to God's law and the sense that we are children of God when we are partaking in the divine nature through following his example, which is the way to love the nature of who he is, and which is how Jesus could truthfully say that if God were their Father, then they would love him.

If we do something for someone because of what they will do for us in return, then that is making an even exchange, not love, so love must be freely given without regard to what we get in return. If someone does something for someone and is upset that they didn't even thank them, then they were doing it in order to be thanked, not because they loved them. Obedience to God's commandments has never been about getting righteousness or salvation in return, but is about expressing our love for God's nature.

 

[praise_yeshua]

God's laws were given as a gift to teach us how to love the nature of who He is and the nature of who the Son is because the Son is the exact image of God's nature (Hebrew 1:3), which is why there many verses in both the OT and the NT that connect our love for God with our obedience to His commandments. For example, by seeing that God has given wise laws was see that God is wise and by doing what is wise in obedience to them we are believing in and expressing our love for God's wisdom, and the same is true for other aspects of God's nature. If we believe in and love God's wisdom, then we will obediently rely on His instructions even if we don't think that we are obligated to do so.

A chip off the old block is someone who has the same nature as their father expressed through doing the same works, which is the sense that Jesus is the Son if God insofar as he is the exact image of God's nature expressed through setting a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to God's law and the sense that we are children of God when we are partaking in the divine nature through following his example, which is the way to love the nature of who he is, and which is how Jesus could truthfully say that if God were their Father, then they would love him.

If we do something for someone because of what they will do for us in return, then that is making an even exchange, not love, so love must be freely given without regard to what we get in return. If someone does something for someone and is upset that they didn't even thank them, then they were doing it in order to be thanked, not because they loved them. Obedience to God's commandments has never been about getting righteousness or salvation in return, but is about expressing our love for God's nature.

How is the love of God expressed in

Exo 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.

You have always failed to adequately deal with your claims. You just keep repeating them while ignoring the obvious. So please..... tell me how Exo 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death....

Shows the love of God?

The fact is, Grace that worketh by Love is often opposed to the Truth.

1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

You should be DEAD. BUT..... God who IS...

Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

God's love overcame the demands of Truth.

You have a very poor view of God's love that stands opposed to the truth of your guilt.

If Christ would have followed through with the demands of the law you cherish.... then He would have destroyed humanity in His Advent. Every single one of us would have never existed.

 

[Soyeong]

How is the love of God expressed in

Exo 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.

You have always failed to adequately deal with your claims. You just keep repeating them while ignoring the obvious. So please..... tell me how Exo 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death....

Shows the love of God?

The Bible repeatedly states in both the OT and the NT that the way to love God is by obeying His commandments.

The fact is, Grace that worketh by Love is often opposed to the Truth.

Rather, God is gracious to us and love us by teaching us the truth.

1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.

You should be DEAD. BUT..... God who IS...

Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

God's love overcame the demands of Truth.

You have a very poor view of God's love that stands opposed to the truth of your guilt.

False. Please try to stick to addressing what I've actually said.

If Christ would have followed through with the demands of the law you cherish.... then He would have destroyed humanity in His Advent. Every single one of us would have never existed.

Again false.

 

[praise_yeshua]

The Bible repeatedly states in both the OT and the NT that the way to love God is by obeying His commandments.

I didn't ask you for you to "opine". I asked you for an answer how the law that required YOUR DEATH is a show of love from God. That law represent WRATH and CONDEMNATION.

Your comments are divorced from reality.

Rather, God is gracious to us and love us by teaching us the truth.

There are many truths. Grace is opposed to the Truth that you deserve to die.

False. Please try to stick to addressing what I've actually said.

I did answer you.

Again false.

Why? Do you care to present something opposed to what I said instead of simply saying "false"? You continually do this. Your view is not based upon reason. It is simply your opinion.

Jesus said that He didn't come to condemn the world. Which is an indication HE SHOULD CONDEMN THE WORLD.....

Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Just how many "believed on Him". All but just a few abandoned Him in His misery.

There is no sense of guilt with you. Since you have no sense of guilt, you have no concept of Grace. The TRUTH is you're guilty. Grace is unmerited. Grace does not come from the Truth. It comes from compassion. Compassion frees contrary to what the truth of guilt requires.

 

[Fred]

Jesus made it abundantly clear that if you claim to love the Father then you would love Him equally to the Father.

1. Why love the Lord (Deuteronomy 6:5)?
Because He hears my voice and my supplications (Psalm 116:1).

2. How is He able to hear this?
Because He alone fully knows the hearts of all (1 Kings 8:38-39).

The Lord Jesus has this same knowledge, so He is able to hear (John 2:24-25; Acts 1:24; 1 Corinthians 4:5; Revelation 2:23).
Thus, we are to equally love the Lord in reference to Jesus (Ephesians 6:24; cf. 1 Corinthians 16:22).

 

[civic]

1. Why love the Lord (Deuteronomy 6:5)?
Because He hears my voice and my supplications (Psalm 116:1).

2. How is He able to hear this?
Because He alone fully knows the hearts of all (1 Kings 8:38-39).

The Lord Jesus has this same knowledge, so He is able to hear (John 2:24-25; Acts 1:24; 1 Corinthians 4:5; Revelation 2:23).
Thus, we are to equally love the Lord in reference to Jesus (Ephesians 6:24; cf. 1 Corinthians 16:22).

Its really hard to deny Christ equality with God and that He is God if one leaves all presuppositions at the door and reads his Bible. It shouts Christ is God everywhere. Not only does it say He is God in many places but He alone in Scripture is the only one who says and does the things that only God can say in do. No man as mentioned in Scripture ever said or did the things Jesus said and did without being God. And that is finally why the Jewish leadership put Him to death for Him being a mere man makes Himself to be God.

 

[Fred]

Its really hard to deny Christ equality with God and that He is God if one leaves all presuppositions at the door and reads his Bible. It shouts Christ is God everywhere.

Amen!

 

[Soyeong]

I didn't ask you for you to "opine". I asked you for an answer how the law that required YOUR DEATH is a show of love from God. That law represent WRATH and CONDEMNATION.

Your comments are divorced from reality.

God's law came with instructions for what to do when the people sinned, so your comments are divorced from reality.

There are many truths. Grace is opposed to the Truth that you deserve to die.

God's law is truth (Psalms 119:142) and God is gracious to us by teaching us to obey it (Psalms 119:29).

I did answer you.

You spoke in regard to something that had nothing to do with anything that I've said.

Why? Do you care to present something opposed to what I said instead of simply saying "false"? You continually do this. Your view is not based upon reason. It is simply your opinion.

Jesus said that He didn't come to condemn the world. Which is an indication HE SHOULD CONDEMN THE WORLD.....

Joh 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Jesus coming not to condemn the world is an indication that he she not condemn the world, which is contrary to you saying that he should condemned it

There is no sense of guilt with you. Since you have no sense of guilt, you have no concept of Grace. The TRUTH is you're guilty.

That is again divorced from reality.

Grace is unmerited. Grace does not come from the Truth. It comes from compassion. Compassion frees contrary to what the truth of guilt requires.

Gd is gracious to us by teaching us truth (Psalms 119:29, 142). Compassion is in accordance with truth, not contrary to it.

 

[praise_yeshua]

God's law came with instructions for what to do when the people sinned, so your comments are divorced from reality.

Yes. They should die. Specifically be killed by those who had broken God's law themselves. Those just like yourself. I've told you over and over, that you're not self aware. The challenge of discerning the "law of God" properly to rooted in empathy. If you see yourself in the condemnation of the law, you will act differently. Your theology will change. You don't see yourself guilty and deserving of death. You don't actually practice the law because you do not follow through with the demands of the law. That is being divorced from reality. I have tried over and over again to deal with you on this. Once AGAIN.... You deny the obvious.

Gd is gracious to us by teaching us truth (Psalms 119:29, 142). Compassion is in accordance with truth, not contrary to it.

You continually post references to Scripture that do not corresponding with the demands of the law requiring your own personal death. You're ignoring and denying the specific aspect of the law that shows no mercy. The aspects of the law that are opposed to mercy.

Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

You don't realize it... but you're just trying to comfort yourself. That is why you seek me out in the forum. Don't listen to me. Have it your way. I've told you that many times now. Yet, you keep engaging me because you are seeking comfort for your own conscience. You don't need to fight against me. I'm not worth the time nor effort. You're fight against Grace. Grace you know is there. Grace you crave. Grace that will comfort your soul. Grace that will bring you peace that you do not have. The solution isn't to keep trying to fight against Grace. Salvation is as much an denial of ourselves as it is an embrace of what you hope to be true. Denying ourselves puts us in a place of repentance that pleases God. It is not an embrace of our potential abilities. It is embracing the reality of our inabilities. I pray you find that young man.