charismaticlady
Active Member
Is the Trinity a they or a He?
Jesus denied being God
- Thread starter Runningman
- Start date
Peterlag
Active Member
I use "they" because I did not know if it was the Lord or God talking to me though the spirit which is an it.
Peterlag
Active Member
I used "they" because I did not know if it was the Lord or God talking to me though the spirit which is an it.
I know a lot more now and believe it was the spirit of Christ giving me some inspiration which is an it.
dwight92070
Active Member
More confirmation. A true Christian believes the spirit of Christ is called "He". You continue to dishonor God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit.
dwight92070
Active Member
This thread really hit a nerve with you, didn't it? Everyone, beware, don't criticize Peterlag, or you'll have charismaticlady to answer to.
Peterlag
Active Member
Be nice now she's on your side as a Trinitarian. She and I have a history together. In fact, she's the one that brough me to this site.
Peterlag
Active Member
Almost every English version translates John 14:17 similarly to “even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him.” Translators capitalize “Spirit” and use “he” and “him” because of their theology. The Greek word “spirit” is neuter and the text could also be translated as “the spirit of truth” and paired with “which” and “it.” The New American Bible reads “which the world cannot accept, because it neither sees nor knows it.” Capitalizing the “H” and “S” and using the English pronoun “He” is appropriate when God is being referred to as “the Holy Spirit.” However, when we see the “h” and “s” having the lowercase such as "the holy spirit" and all the pronouns referring to that spirit being impersonal such as “it” and “which” is when the subject under discussion is the gift of God’s nature.
Although the use of "spirit" is often ambiguous, it is left to a hyperliteralist to remove God from the usage. Their almost universal reductionist view disregards the pointing to the an active Spirit working in the lives of Christians -- one who works within Christians as a helper as a voice that speaks independently of a Christian, not just being something making people sorta more like God.
There becomes sort of this Sadducean spirit underlying the unitarians.
Peterlag
Active Member
Will we have bodies that are like the body that God has?
John 4:24 says God is Spirit and yet Jesus said about himself that he was not a spirit, but flesh and bone even after his resurrection. Jesus said when he appeared to his apostles “See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have” (Luke 24:39). That Jesus is still flesh and bone today is exactly what we would expect if Jesus is a “man approved of God.” Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.
John 4:24 says God is Spirit and yet Jesus said about himself that he was not a spirit, but flesh and bone even after his resurrection. Jesus said when he appeared to his apostles “See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have” (Luke 24:39). That Jesus is still flesh and bone today is exactly what we would expect if Jesus is a “man approved of God.” Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.
Runningman
Active Member
Good point. Being transformed into the image of Jesus must mean that we will not become God if we become like Jesus. I have told them many times Jesus is our example of what is attainable. I haven't found many who like that fact yet.
Peterlag
Active Member
Jesus told his disciples that “whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do.” If Jesus was God, then his statement would be a commission for us to do greater works than God—which is not possible.
Runningman
Active Member
We can't even fathom what God is capable of, but Jesus was plain and clear we can do the same things as him - and they did! Most of Jesus' miraculous works and ministry works were repeated by others in some form or fashion; even down to weather control and resurrections of the dead.
Ah. we must bow down and worship these unitarians. Too bad Jesus was not something greater than regular people, like maybe being God's Son. It is useful in these unitarian responses to other unitarians where it can be seen where their minds are.
Runningman
Active Member
At least it is clear that you are a mocker.
So you aren't God's son? The Bible says you're supposed to be a brother to Jesus, too. If a brother to Jesus, then God's son just as Jesus is God's son. You really don't get it do you.
charismaticlady
Active Member
Anyone claiming to be a Christian and is as cruel as you and cause so much hypocritical dissension, I know whose side to be on. Sooner or later Peterlag will receive the revelation of the Spirit that Jesus is God as Titus 2:13 did for me by the same Spirit. He has already received many insights that are far from your knowledge, let alone understanding. Yes, he is blind on this issue still, but not on the most important issues of Christianity. At least this issue will not keep him out of the Kingdom of God. I know, because I was already born again of the Spirit for years before I received that revelation. He will too. As the Author of our faith, Jesus reveals the most important issues first in us, taking us from death into eternal life. He's already past that stage. Are you?
e v e
Active Member
He our Deity denied being His father and denied being good... since he was now in the substandard flesh of after the fall just like us... He having taken a huge step down , to descend to this gruesome dungeon to help us.
He was restored to His glorious body and nature at His resurrection.
What's sad today is no one gets this about the flesh nor even wants to be rescued from it and instead believe God creates this 'sin nature'.
Two beings one in nature and purpose doesn't mean He is not our deity representing us who are His remnant before God.
This flesh is not Good.. cannot enter paradise.
e v e
Active Member
That will be true , again as it was before the fall, when the sons at rapture meet Christ upon the clouds and are restored to eden nature. At the moment His souls are imprisoned in the fallen nature.. and most of jacob enjoying decorating their prison cell.. we were not ever creatures... So far we fell.......
Wow. Again you show your self-exaltation. Let me remind you that you do not have the title: Son of God. You conflate things again. I certainly get it. You follow a hyperliteralist reductionist interpretation. I help reveal these interpretation errors I find in posts by unitarians.
charismaticlady
Active Member
mikesw seems to believe you are Unitarian, but have you ever claimed to be? There are other parts of Christianity that do not claim that Jesus is God, like JW's. Then there are others that are on the other extreme like Oneness Pentecostals that only believe Jesus is God, who acts in the role as the Father at times, and acts as the Holy Spirit at other times. So that seems to be the scriptural term of Jesus embodying the Godhead.
Personally, I believe that Jesus embodies the Godhead, therefore, making all three one God, making Jesus just as much God as the Father and the Holy Spirit. I believe the controversial 1 John 5:7, the long version from the KJV. Trinitarians believe the Father, Jesus and the Spirit are three separate persons. I don't. Seeing as man is made in the likeness of Elohim, a plural word for God, I too believe that Jesus is God and embodies the whole Godhead Who is one triune being - One God made up of spirit, soul and body just like man 1 Thess. 5:23. The Father is Spirit or mind, which explains why Jesus said He doesn't do anything He doesn't see the Father doing (in His mind). The Holy Spirit is the soul which is the heart, emotions and soul that produces the fruit of the Spirit and the power to be free from sin, and Jesus is the body with the mind of the Father and the power of the Holy Spirit. All three are inseparable making One God. Just as I am one person and am inseparable from my mind and soul. Not sure if there is a name for what I see the Bible teaching. Does any of this relate to what you believe? As @Peterlag knows, it seems to me that you and he seem to be more trinitarian than I am. You've separated Jesus from the Father as if they are two separate persons. Not sure what you do with the Holy Spirit. Is It/He God, or only the Father? Not sure how you can separate the mind of Christ which is the Father, into two separate beings. What do you believe about the preexistence of the Word becoming Jesus, the Son of God? And how is an only begotten Son not be God. To me, God is the whole family. God is like our Executive Office which consists of more than the President.
@Peterlag please help explain and tell me is there is a corporate name for what you believe, like Unitarian or JW, or completely on your own like I am.
Runningman
Active Member
So you don't believe others in the Bible are sons of God too? The Bible says they are. I think I know why you would want to deny God's children their status. It must be because if God has many children then it diminishes your novel, new, gnostic doctrine about Jesus being God's son referring to deity, which it does not and with that you've been refuted again.
Romans 8
14For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God
1 John 4
7Beloved, let us love one another, because love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God.
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