He also wants them to suffer hell fire apparently right?
Determinism in Calvinism and the Reformed Confessions
- Thread starter civic
- Start date
Where did he claim works means determines??
So you love confusion, and deliberate division and a bible that contradicts itself.
Question begging.
I will ask again, how is your position any better? He could stop it anytime right? So the must be purpose in not stopping it or determining to occur.
Where did he claim "works" means determining?
civic
Well-known member
Yep god determines you believe falsehoods and I expose them. god determined I believe calvinism then reject it.
Truly a god of confusion.
Yet the Bible declares God is not a God of Confusion- 1 Cor 14:33.
A god of disunity. Yet the bible say God is a God of Unity- Eph 3:4, be of One Mind- Phil 2:2, 1 Pet 3:8
next..................
civic
Well-known member
people behave and act out their god- a god of confusion, jihads a god of hate/war.
when one believes God is not love they do not extend love, grace, forgiveness etc.....
atpollard
Well-known member
What does "God works all things in accordance with the plan of His will" mean if God is not in control of what happens?
The OP is attempting to refute the argument that God is in control of "these things" ... and then lists things that are not "God's fault".
OK ... so YOU and HE are actually are denying "God works ALL THINGS" of 1 Corinthians12:6 and Ephesians 1:11-12.
So what then, do these scriptures mean when they claim God "works all things in accordance with the plan of His will"?
Explain to me why "the world" means "all men without exception", but "all things" really means "only a very few things ... after God asks our permission".
[... or is it time to get out that Sharpie again and add another edit to the "Free Will Bible"]?
atpollard
Well-known member
Jeremiah 17:9 [NKJV] "The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], And desperately wicked; Who can know it?"
... for example, a god that is powerless to change a heart without the prior consent of that wicked heart.
Keith
New member
God determined their thought process to be hindered.
Quote from Knowing God by J. I. Packer
“Still he shows his freedom and lordship by discriminating between sinners, causing some to hear the gospel while others do not hear it, and moving some of those who hear it to repentance while leaving others in their unbelief, thus teaching his saints that he owes mercy to none and that it is entirely of his grace, not at all through their own effort, that they themselves have found life.
civic
Well-known member
no thats a dictator, the puppeteer, the one who controls the robots every action, thought and deed.Jeremiah 17:9 [NKJV] "The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], And desperately wicked; Who can know it?"
... for example, a god that is powerless to change a heart without the prior consent of that wicked heart.
Why did you ignore the full reply
He was replying to Civic comments about determination
civic
Well-known member
exactly its the opposite of the God of the Bible. God loves all mankind. The gospel is for everyone.
John 1:29
The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, “Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!
Hebrews 2:9
But we do see Jesus, who was made lower than the angels for a little while, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.
Titus 2:11
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,
Titus 3:4
But when the kindness and the love of mankind of God our Savior appeared
John 3:16
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
1 Timothy 2:4
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
2 Peter 3:9
The Lord does not delay his promise, as some regard “delay,” but he is patient with you, not wishing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
2 Corinthians 5:14
For Christ’s love compels us, because we are convinced that one died for all, and therefore all died.
No not question begging
Your theology makes God the author of confusion, division and contradiction
Non Calvinist theology does not make God the author of confusion , division and contradiction
If you cannot see the difference that speaks to you not non calvinists
civic
Well-known member
yes we have a free will and can choose what we believe or reject. love requires the freedom and willingness to love in return. in the other system there really is no love for one was coerced/forced/preprogrammed to love.
J I Packer omits one fact . According to his theology the reason men sin is because God determined it that way.
One cannot argue God determines all things and in the next breath deny God is the cause of all sin
Yep, but he is desperate to equate God causing confusion, contraction and division with God allowing men free will
civic
Well-known member
yes that god caused the evil and sinful acts to happen by determining everything that comes to pass including the rape, murder of women , children and infants.
white, Mac, piper, rc and many others admit this is the case.
Works out could simply indicate God words to bring good from evil rather than God determining the evilWhat does "God works all things in accordance with the plan of His will" mean if God is not in control of what happens?
The OP is attempting to refute the argument that God is in control of "these things" ... and then lists things that are not "God's fault".
OK ... so YOU and HE are actually are denying "God works ALL THINGS" of 1 Corinthians12:6 and Ephesians 1:11-12.
So what then, do these scriptures mean when they claim God "works all things in accordance with the plan of His will"?
Explain to me why "the world" means "all men without exception", but "all things" really means "only a very few things ... after God asks our permission".
[... or is it time to get out that Sharpie again and add another edit to the "Free Will Bible"]?
Again works does not mean he determined all things
