An honest inquiry into the nature of Christology by a Trinitarian

synergy said:
Here are excerpts discussing Apollinarianism from the link below. Dr Craig made a new version called neo-Apollinarianism but both versions fundamentally fail by saying that Jesus had a Divine soul, not a human soul.

Apollinarianism

When we read in John 1:14 that “the Word became flesh,” we recognize that Jesus took on a human body. But did Christ take on a human soul too? Today, Barry Cooper discusses a fourth-century heresy that seems slightly off but actually makes a world of difference.
www.ligonier.org www.ligonier.org

When we read in John 1:14 that “the Word became flesh,” we recognize that Jesus took on a human body. But did Christ take on a human soul too? Today, Barry Cooper discusses a fourth-century heresy that seems slightly off but actually makes a world of difference.

Perhaps you’ve heard the phrase “the Word became flesh” in John chapter 1. So clearly, Jesus had a human body. But let me ask you: Did He have a human soul too?
If your answer to that is no, and you imagine Jesus as being a divine soul in a human body, that’s actually a heresy called Apollinarianism.
This teaching originated with a man called Apollinaris way back in the fourth century. (The early church condemned him as a heretic in 381.) Apollinaris was the bishop of Laodicea, a city which is name-checked in Colossians and Revelation, in the country we now call Turkey.
In an attempt to explain exactly how Jesus Christ could be both God and man, Apollinaris taught that the physical body of Christ was truly man, but that His mind wasn’t human at all, but divine. So in other words, the body and mind of Jesus were not both truly God and truly man. The body was truly man, and the mind was truly God.
Now, why does any of this matter? Well, if Jesus actually were as Apollinaris described Him, then Jesus would not be able to save anyone. He can save human beings precisely because He is a human being Himself. Only a human being can mediate on behalf of human beings. If He’s only partially human, then He can’t mediate for us, and He can’t die for us either. Hebrews chapter 10 reminds us that nonhuman sacrifices (for example, animal sacrifices) are powerless to atone for human sin. So if Jesus is only partly human, which would be the case if He lacked a human mind and soul, He can’t bear the punishment humans deserve on our behalf. Neither can He be the last Adam, sent to succeed where the first Adam failed. And so on. But thankfully, we have a great Savior: truly God and truly man.
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Thanks for the reference
 
civic said:
Thanks for the reference
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Goes to show you that we are all in desperate need of a comprehensive standard manual that codifies and details spiritual ailments (heresies). Otherwise, we have to hunt down and find information like that. I don't mind doing that but the ailments are so extensive that a manual like that would save everyone massive amounts of time.
 
synergy said:
Goes to show you that we are all in desperate need of a comprehensive standard manual that codifies and details spiritual ailments (heresies). Otherwise, we have to hunt down and find information like that. I don't mind doing that but the ailments are so extensive that a manual like that would save everyone massive amounts of time.
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Let’s work on one , I’m sure several of us can collaborate on the project
 
civic said:
Let’s work on one , I’m sure several of us can collaborate on the project
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Sure. It won't be easy because we'll all have to agree on what is and what isn't heresy. For example, do we agree on the Christological statements of the main ecumenical councils? That's an excellent start. From Christology we can get into other related avenues such as Pneumatology. I don't want to get too far ahead of myself...
 
synergy said:
Goes to show you that we are all in desperate need of a comprehensive standard manual that codifies and details spiritual ailments (heresies). Otherwise, we have to hunt down and find information like that. I don't mind doing that but the ailments are so extensive that a manual like that would save everyone massive amounts of time.
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The Scriptures themselves are the 'Codified' Official Documents that Magnify the Truth and thereby exposing EVERY falsehood that ever existed.

When you KNOW God, you KNOW His words you can easily spot the falsehood(s).
 
DavidTree said:
The Scriptures themselves are the 'Codified' Official Documents that Magnify the Truth and thereby exposing EVERY falsehood that ever existed.

When you KNOW God, you KNOW His words you can easily spot the falsehood(s).
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The Protestants have the same Bible. How's that working out for them?

Too bad we haven't interacted much together. I'm sure that you can find some heresy in me just as much as I can find some heresy in you. Are you Trinitarian for starters? What's your view of the Hypostatic Union of Christ. You might ask what's the big deal with that? Well, I believe that the most important question you will ever answer in your life is "Who do you say Christ is?"
 
synergy said:
The Protestants have the same Bible. How's that working out for them?

Too bad we haven't interacted much together. I'm sure that you can find some heresy in me just as much as I can find some heresy in you. Are you Trinitarian for starters? What's your view of the Hypostatic Union of Christ. You might ask what's the big deal with that? Well, I believe that the most important question you will ever answer in your life is "Who do you say Christ is?"
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Well, if we love each other as Christ commanded and we are willing to submit to "It is written" then we can find teh Door that leads us OUT from the many falsehoods.

Keep at the forefront of your mind that satan has 2,000 years of deception plotted against the Gospel and if you go back to the Garden tha would be at least 6,000 years.

The KEY is = are you WILLING to LET GO of ANYTHING that contradicts His Word???

@civic clings to pre-trib which is a complete falsehood = never once came out of the Mouth of God.
i BELIEVE that @civic is MATURE enough to AGREE that at the very least there does not exist a direct declaration of a pre-trib rapture.
We KNOW that Christ is Coming and at His Coming the Resurrection takes Place FIRST.
AFTER the Resurrection is the Rapture = 1 Thess 4:13-18

ANY heresy or ignorance of scripture that i may have is OPEN for EXPOSURE so that i can be BLESSED.
 
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synergy said:
"Who do you say Christ is?"
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Try:

"The second person of three in a united single nature of God shared in perichoresis fully sharing all divine attributes, which person has actually two natures in a hypostatic union which does not actually communicate the attributes between the natures but cannot possibly be divided, and whose human nature is attributed to the divine person by enhypostasis, but not being a human person itself, only the addition of a human nature in time described as an emptying and humbling, and which impersonal nature's actions are attributed to deity by divine association."

If you disagree at any point you are heretic and cannot be saved, I'm sorry.

And you definitely can't say "God became a man to die for our sins," oh the blasphemy.

Or even worse, "The Christ, the Son of the Living God."
 
dizerner said:
Try:

"The second person of three in a united single nature of God shared in perichoresis fully sharing all divine attributes, which person has actually two natures in a hypostatic union which does not actually communicate the attributes between the natures but cannot possibly be divided, and whose human nature is attributed to the divine person by enhypostasis, but not being a human person itself, only the addition of a human nature in time described as an emptying and humbling, and which impersonal nature's actions are attributed to deity by divine association."

If you disagree at any point you are heretic and cannot be saved, I'm sorry.

And you definitely can't say "God became a man to die for our sins," oh the blasphemy.

Or even worse, "The Christ, the Son of the Living God."
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Mormons say the same thing. How are you different from them, or are you not different from them?
 
DavidTree said:
Well, if we love each other as Christ commanded and we are willing to submit to "It is written" then we can find teh Door that leads us OUT from the many falsehoods.

Keep at the forefront of your mind that satan has 2,000 years of deception plotted against the Gospel and if you go back to the Garden tha would be at least 6,000 years.

The KEY is = are you WILLING to LET GO of ANYTHING that contradicts His Word???

@civic clings to pre-trib which is a complete falsehood = never once came out of the Mouth of God.
i BELIEVE that @civic is MATURE enough to AGREE that at the very least there does not exist a direct declaration of a pre-trib rapture.
We KNOW that Christ is Coming and at His Coming the Resurrection takes Place FIRST.
AFTER the Resurrection is the Rapture = 1 Thess 4:13-18

ANY heresy or ignorance of scripture that i may have is OPEN for EXPOSURE so that i can be BLESSED.
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I haven't invested much time in ironing out the Tribulation questions. They're sort of ironing themselves out as I learn more about Christology and what awaits us in the afterlife.
 
dizerner said:
Mormons say they believe the Bible.

So do you.

YOU ARE THEREFORE A MORMON!!!!

Busted.
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You just made my point! Thank you!

Heretics have hijacked Christian words and terms and we need to clear them of heretical content.

That's exactly why we need in depth definitions of Christian words and terms many of which the ecumenical councils gifted to us.
 

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