A question just to start things off.

[civic]

thanks

A mediator is one who mediates, that is, one who acts as an intermediary to work with opposing sides in order to bring about a settlement. A mediator attempts to influence a disagreement between two parties with the goal of resolving a dispute. There is only one Mediator between mankind and God, and that is Jesus Christ. In this article, we’ll see why God has a dispute with us, why Jesus is our mediator, and why we are doomed if we try to represent ourselves alone before God.

God has a dispute with us because of sin. Sin is described in the Bible as transgression of the law of God (1 John 3:4) and rebellion against God (Deuteronomy 9:7; Joshua 1:18). God hates sin, and sin stands between all of us and Him. “There is no one righteous, not even one” (Romans 3:10). All human beings are sinners by virtue of sin we have inherited from Adam, as well as the sin we commit on a daily basis. The only just penalty for this sin is death (Romans 6:23), not only physical death but eternal death (Revelation 20:11–15). The rightful punishment for sin is an eternity in hell.

Nothing we could do on our own would be sufficient to mediate between ourselves and God. No amount of good works or law-keeping makes us righteous enough to stand before a holy God (Isaiah 64:6; Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16). Without a mediator, we are destined to spend eternity in hell, for by ourselves salvation from our sin is impossible. Yet there is hope! “For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus” (1 Timothy 2:5). Jesus represents those who have placed their trust in Him before God’s throne of grace. He mediates for us, much as a defense attorney mediates for his client, telling the judge, “Your honor, my client is innocent of all charges against him.” That is true for us also. Some day we will face God, but we will do so as totally forgiven sinners because of Jesus’ death on our behalf. The “Defense Attorney” took the penalty for us!

We see more proof of this comforting truth in Hebrews 9:15: “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.” It is because of the great Mediator that we are able to stand before God clothed in the righteousness of Christ Himself. On the cross Jesus exchanged our sin for His righteousness (2 Corinthians 5:21). His mediation is the only means of salvation.got ?

hope this helps !!!

 

[Administrator]

I'm trying not to complain

I hope not because you know...

 

[sethproton]

A mediator is one who mediates, that is, one who acts as an intermediary to work with opposing sides in order to bring about a settlement. A mediator attempts to influence a disagreement between two parties with the goal of resolving a dispute. There is only one Mediator between mankind and God, and that is Jesus Christ. In this article, we’ll see why God has a dispute with us, why Jesus is our mediator, and why we are doomed if we try to represent ourselves alone before God.

God has a dispute with us because of sin. Sin is described in the Bible as transgression of the law of God (1 John 3:4) and rebellion against God (Deuteronomy 9:7; Joshua 1:18). God hates sin, and sin stands between all of us and Him. “There is no one righteous, not even one” (Romans 3:10). All human beings are sinners by virtue of sin we have inherited from Adam, as well as the sin we commit on a daily basis. The only just penalty for this sin is death (Romans 6:23), not only physical death but eternal death (Revelation 20:11–15). The rightful punishment for sin is an eternity in hell.

Nothing we could do on our own would be sufficient to mediate between ourselves and God. No amount of good works or law-keeping makes us righteous enough to stand before a holy God (Isaiah 64:6; Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16). Without a mediator, we are destined to spend eternity in hell, for by ourselves salvation from our sin is impossible. Yet there is hope! “For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus” (1 Timothy 2:5). Jesus represents those who have placed their trust in Him before God’s throne of grace. He mediates for us, much as a defense attorney mediates for his client, telling the judge, “Your honor, my client is innocent of all charges against him.” That is true for us also. Some day we will face God, but we will do so as totally forgiven sinners because of Jesus’ death on our behalf. The “Defense Attorney” took the penalty for us!

We see more proof of this comforting truth in Hebrews 9:15: “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.” It is because of the great Mediator that we are able to stand before God clothed in the righteousness of Christ Himself. On the cross Jesus exchanged our sin for His righteousness (2 Corinthians 5:21). His mediation is the only means of salvation.got ?

hope this helps !!!

A mediator is one who mediates, that is, one who acts as an intermediary to work with opposing sides in order to bring about a settlement. A mediator attempts to influence a disagreement between two parties with the goal of resolving a dispute. There is only one Mediator between mankind and God, and that is Jesus Christ. In this article, we’ll see why God has a dispute with us, why Jesus is our mediator, and why we are doomed if we try to represent ourselves alone before God.

God has a dispute with us because of sin. Sin is described in the Bible as transgression of the law of God (1 John 3:4) and rebellion against God (Deuteronomy 9:7; Joshua 1:18). God hates sin, and sin stands between all of us and Him. “There is no one righteous, not even one” (Romans 3:10). All human beings are sinners by virtue of sin we have inherited from Adam, as well as the sin we commit on a daily basis. The only just penalty for this sin is death (Romans 6:23), not only physical death but eternal death (Revelation 20:11–15). The rightful punishment for sin is an eternity in hell.

Nothing we could do on our own would be sufficient to mediate between ourselves and God. No amount of good works or law-keeping makes us righteous enough to stand before a holy God (Isaiah 64:6; Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16). Without a mediator, we are destined to spend eternity in hell, for by ourselves salvation from our sin is impossible. Yet there is hope! “For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus” (1 Timothy 2:5). Jesus represents those who have placed their trust in Him before God’s throne of grace. He mediates for us, much as a defense attorney mediates for his client, telling the judge, “Your honor, my client is innocent of all charges against him.” That is true for us also. Some day we will face God, but we will do so as totally forgiven sinners because of Jesus’ death on our behalf. The “Defense Attorney” took the penalty for us!

We see more proof of this comforting truth in Hebrews 9:15: “For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that He has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.” It is because of the great Mediator that we are able to stand before God clothed in the righteousness of Christ Himself. On the cross Jesus exchanged our sin for His righteousness (2 Corinthians 5:21). His mediation is the only means of salvation.got ?

hope this helps !!!

I agree with much of what you say as being Biblical.
1. I don't see original sin in the Bible, as least in the way that adam sinned and I am guilty
2. You say Jesus represents those who place their faith in Him. I belive the result of the one time medition was for all humanity
3. You say a mediator tells the judge, "My client is innocent." That's not mediaton. A mediator brings the two litgants to an agreement and presents the agreement to the judge. By your reading the mediator condemns one and frees the other: this is not mediation

 

[Diserner]

What are you saying here brother?

I'm saying the OT sacrifice system was a picture of Jesus being punished for our sins on our behalf.

That really should be very clear...


And to the "fun loving" people, I suggest you read Scriptures again.

It's not all "making a joyful noise" like there is nothing to fight for, or stand for, or die for, or sacrifice for.

Too many Christians just want to have a fun loving life with no sacrifice!

Is that what Jesus died for, you to have fun?!

 

[Diserner]

Do you consider that you are noy yet reconciled to God, that Jesus is still working on that?

Jesus "work" of redemption was done before we accept it.

The mediation is on-going, present tense in real-time.

That is why if you deny Christ, you lose the benefit of his mediation.

We only realize the full inheritance in heaven...


And of course you never did once give any proof, past or present, of your unique idea of a one-and-done mediator.

I'd be interested to see your arguments.

 

[Johann]

The mediation is on-going, present tense in real-time.

Any Scripture references?
Thanks brother
J.

 

[Johann]

Seriously, today is my first day and I was hoping to be around some fun-loving Christians. We should be making a Joyful Noise not murmuring and complaining. This is the day that the Lord has made I will rejoice and be glad in it. God loves me!!!

Seriously, today is my first day and I was hoping to be around some fun-loving Christians. We should be making a Joyful Noise not murmuring and complaining. This is the day that the Lord has made I will rejoice and be glad in it. God loves me!!!

I think it's time to see who is serious about their salvation.
J.

 

[Johann]

Jesus stop saying such serious stuff all the time, we signed up to have fun!

Stop talking about taking up our cross and being willing to die and loving you more than our lives!

Let's just play golf, drink coffee, watch movies, and have food, fun and fellowship!

What's all this stuff about being loving not our life?!


Let us listen to what Jesus says and really take it seriously...

I fully concur here.
J.

 

[Diserner]

Any Scripture references?
Thanks brother
J.

7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. (1 Jn. 1:7 NKJ)

The idea is a present tense continuing action:

As we [continue to] walk in the light, the blood of Jesus [continues to] cleanse us from all sin.

19 Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh,
21 and having a High Priest over the house of God,
22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. (Heb. 10:19-23 NKJ)

Again I see it like:

Let us [continue to] draw near with a true heart having our hearts [continued to be] sprinkled from an evil conscience.

The opposite of "going on to perfection" (Hebrews 6) is "drawing back."

Then the Blood no longer "speaks better things than Abel's".

 

[Diserner]

I think it's time to see who is serious about their salvation.
J.

It makes my flesh feel bad, I want everyone to like me and say how fun I am, it sucks in the natural to always be "that guy."

22 Blessed are you when men hate you, And when they exclude you, And revile you, and cast out your name as evil, For the Son of Man's sake.
23 Rejoice in that day and leap for joy! For indeed your reward is great in heaven, For in like manner their fathers did to the prophets.

26 Woe to you when all men speak well of you, For so did their fathers to the false prophets.
(Lk. 6:22-26 NKJ)

 

[Johann]

7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. (1 Jn. 1:7 NKJ)

The idea is a present tense continuing action:

As we [continue to] walk in the light, the blood of Jesus [continues to] cleanse us from all sin.

19 Therefore, brethren, having boldness to enter the Holiest by the blood of Jesus,
20 by a new and living way which He consecrated for us, through the veil, that is, His flesh,
21 and having a High Priest over the house of God,
22 let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful. (Heb. 10:19-23 NKJ)

Again I see it like:

Let us [continue to] draw near with a true heart having our hearts [continued to be] sprinkled from an evil conscience.

The opposite of "going on to perfection" (Hebrews 6) is "drawing back."

Then the Blood no longer "speaks better things than Abel's".

Correct-
"we have fellowship with Him" The heretics claimed that fellowship was based on knowledge only. This was an aspect of Greek philosophy from Plato. However, John asserts that Christians must live Christlike lives (cf. 1 John 1:7; Lev. 11:44; 19:2; 20:7; Matt. 5:48; Rom. 8:28-29).

"yet walk in the darkness" "Walk" is a PRESENT ACTIVE SUBJUNCTIVE. This is a biblical metaphor expressing a moral lifestyle (cf. Eph. 4:1,17; 5:2,15). God is light with no darkness. His children should be like Him (cf. Matt. 5:48; 1 Pet. 1:16).

"we lie and do not practice the truth" These are both PRESENT TENSE VERBS. John calls several types of religious people liars (cf. 1 John 2:4,22; 4:20; Isa. 29:13). Lifestyle actions truly reveal the heart (cf. Matthew 7).



1:7 "but if we walk in the Light" This is another PRESENT TENSE which emphasizes continuing action. "Walk" is a biblical metaphor for the Christian life (i.e., Eph. 4:1,17; 5:2,15).

Notice how often "walk" and PRESENT TENSE VERBS are related to the Christian life. Truth is something we live, not just something we know! Truth is a key concept in John.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

10:22 "let us draw near" This is a present middle (deponent) subjunctive. Believers' confidence is based on Jesus' finished work, but this benefit and privilege must be embraced! The "drawing near" is used of worshipers' approaching God. Notice the progression:

1. let us draw near with a sincere heart (Heb. 10:22)

2. let us hold fast the confession of our hope (Heb. 10:23)

3. let us consider how to stimulate one another (Heb. 10:24)

The new covenant (cf. Jer. 31:31-34) is a new heart and a new spirit; an internal love and an external law; a free gift in the finished work of Christ, but it also has requirements, expected fruit, observable consequences! Confidence of salvation issues in godly living! It is not primarily a creed to affirm, nor a theology to embrace, but a Christlikeness (not sinlessness) which is evident to all!

Notice the lists of requirements for "drawing near."

1. with a sincere heart

2. in full assurance of faith

3. having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience

4. our bodies washed with pure water



"sincere heart" An appropriate attitude is the key to the new faith covenant (positive, cf. Ezek. 36:22-36; negative, Isa. 29:13).

"in full assurance of faith" Full assurance is linked to faith! Assurance is based on

1. a life of faith as the evidence of conversion (cf. James 2:14-26)

2. the finished work of Christ (cf. 2 Cor. 5:21)

3. the witness of the Spirit (cf. Rom. 8:16)

Human effort cannot bring salvation or assurance. However, a changed and changing life of faith is the evidence that one has truly been redeemed. The normal result of meeting a Holy God is a holy life of service.

Biblical assurance was never meant to be turned into a doctrine to be affirmed, but a life to be lived! For those who claim to know Christ but live apathetic, indifferent, worldly, self-centered, unfruitful, non-productive, godless lives—there is no assurance!


I appreciate your pathos for Christ Jesus.
Johann.

 

[civic]

I agree with much of what you say as being Biblical.
1. I don't see original sin in the Bible, as least in the way that adam sinned and I am guilty
2. You say Jesus represents those who place their faith in Him. I belive the result of the one time medition was for all humanity
3. You say a mediator tells the judge, "My client is innocent." That's not mediaton. A mediator brings the two litgants to an agreement and presents the agreement to the judge. By your reading the mediator condemns one and frees the other: this is not mediation

original sin was brought into the church from augustine so I'm not holding that against you
mediator for all humanity but that doesn't mean there will no be some in hell/lake of fire correct ?
and you make a valid 3rd point.

 

[sethproton]

Jesus "work" of redemption was done before we accept it.

The mediation is on-going, present tense in real-time.

That is why if you deny Christ, you lose the benefit of his mediation.

We only realize the full inheritance in heaven...


And of course you never did once give any proof, past or present, of your unique idea of a one-and-done mediator.

I'd be interested to see your arguments.

First off I gave you a suggesstion to fnd the word mediator, mediation and look at the context, can I conlude you never did that? I don't see you referring to mentioning any of the vereses and giving an explanattion about these words in context. That should be where we start or else are we just mouthing someone else's doctrine. There are six NT verses which speak on mediation, so your doctrine needs to come from those six verse.
Gal 3:19-20. 1 Ti 2.5. Hebrews 8:6, 9:15 and 12:24 and their contexts.
Would you like to talk about those verses?

 

[sethproton]

original sin was brought into the church from augustine so I'm not holding that against you
mediator for all humanity but that doesn't mean there will no be some in hell/lake of fire correct ?
and you make a valid 3rd point.

we are largely agreeing here?!

 

[sethproton]

we are largely agreeing here?!

Civic, by the way you seem to know your way around here, are the 5 threads below all there are? or is there some way to get to other threads
I remember a detailed list of all the categories, but cant find

 

[civic]

Civic, by the way you seem to know your way around here, are the 5 threads below all there are? or is there some way to get to other threads

You should be able to navigate this forum now like any other forum . Which threads ?

 

[Aeliana]

thanks, lust like when we say some lady is the architect of a building.

According to Easton's Bible Dictionary, Lust is sinful longing; the inward sin which leads to the falling away from God (Romans 1:21). "Lust, the origin of sin, has its place in the heart, not of necessity, but because it is the center of all moral forces and impulses and of spiritual activity." In Mark 4:19 "lusts" are objects of desire.

Bible Verses about Lust​

Matthew 5:28
But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Proverbs 6:25
Do not lust in your heart after her beauty or let her captivate you with her eyes.

1 John 2:16
For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride in possessions—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Galatians 5:16
But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

Colossians 3:5
Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.

2 Timothy 2:22
So flee youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.

1 Peter 2:11
Beloved, I urge you as sojourners and exiles to abstain from the passions of the flesh, which wage war against your soul.

James 1:14-15
But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

 

[sethproton]

You should be able to navigate this forum now like any other forum . Which threads ?

i don;t see C and A forum or many that used to be present, though they showed up when I signed up first time
What tab or button brings up the other level topic?

 

[sethproton]

According to Easton's Bible Dictionary, Lust is sinful longing; the inward sin which leads to the falling away from God (Romans 1:21). "Lust, the origin of sin, has its place in the heart, not of necessity, but because it is the center of all moral forces and impulses and of spiritual activity." In Mark 4:19 "lusts" are objects of desire.

Bible Verses about Lust​

Matthew 5:28
But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Proverbs 6:25
Do not lust in your heart after her beauty or let her captivate you with her eyes.

1 John 2:16
For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride in possessions—is not from the Father but is from the world.

Galatians 5:16
But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

Colossians 3:5
Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.

2 Timothy 2:22
So flee youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.

1 Peter 2:11
Beloved, I urge you as sojourners and exiles to abstain from the passions of the flesh, which wage war against your soul.

James 1:14-15
But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

my goodness, i mistype lust instead of just and you make your whole post about my mistype?

 

[civic]

i don;t see C and A forum or many that used to be present, though they showed up when I signed up first time
What tab or button brings up the other level topic?

It’s under this area , section.

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/#discussion-of-controversial-topics.16