Yes, Calvinists—free will IS in the Bible.

But it doesn't. It all revolves around physical death.

Again. Adam and Eve are physically dead? Are their bones with us now? I know they are. You know they are.

They are dead yet still alive. However, their body is dead. One day we will experience the same condition. We are not complete without a future change Tom. That will happen for all of us at the same time with our bodies.

Physical death is what seals everything.
Those who were stated to have passed from death to life or stated as being alive while dead were not as Adam and Eve physically dead

Ephesians 2:1–5 (LEB) — 1 And you, although you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the ruler of the authority of the air, the spirit now working in the sons of disobedience, 3 among whom also we all formerly lived in the desires of our flesh, doing the will of the flesh and of the mind, and we were children of wrath by nature, as also the rest of them were. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of his great love with which he loved us, 5 and we being dead in trespasses, he made us alive together with Christ (by grace you are saved),

These are living people who were dead in their trespasses and sin

How were they dead?

Colossians 2:13 (LEB) — 13 And although you were dead in the trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he made you alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,

Again these people were dead in the trespasses and the uncircumcision of their flesh but were made alive having forgiven their trespasses

How were they dead?

1 Timothy 5:6 (LEB) — 6 But the one who lives for sensual pleasure is dead even though she lives.

This woman was currently dead

How so?
 
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Spiritual death is separation from God

Okay. Prove it. Start by explaining how death doesn't require former life. We are surrounded by things that don't have life. Dust for example. Dirt. Adam was taken from the dust of the earth.

Your bones will one day be absent life but they will still be there. Reminders of how YOU DIED. Memorials.

I've asked you before and you ignored, what did Adam and Eve lose.

You said it was irrelevant. Unlearned people like yourself always say this. Do I need to remind you of what you said?

It is essential that you explain Adam's condition before he "died" without actually "dying"....

You're fabricating this "spiritual death". It doesn't exist.

I'm going to post one more verse and demand you stop assuming your position is true without evidence. All you've done thus far is to claim "spiritual death" exists simply because you read about being "dead in sins" somewhere..... while arguing this MUST equal "spiritual death". Arguments of "how can Paul and others say we are dead and yet we are not physically dead. I mean Geesh. Really? I feel like I'm talking to a child that a parent left them a note saying they can have some candy that eats ends up eating all the candy there is while saying "you didn't define some"........

Which is delusional. I'm beginning to think you're an evil man. I'm trying not to think this. I don't see you as being any different than all these Calvinists you're bashing around here. No different at all. Just another man refusing to acknowledge what is blatantly obvious.

1Co 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1Co 15:46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

Notice verse 46 says it very clearly, Adam was only natural. Christ was Spiritual. Adam was of the earth and the second Adam was from Heaven.

Now. Tell me what Adam lost when he supposedly "died spiritually". For what you say to be true, Adam must have been Spiritually Alive. He wasn't. He was natural.

Adam required food to live. The life that was in this earth had to be consumed for Adam to sustain Himself. He ATE of the garden. Adam wasn't complete. He NEEDED Eve. There are so many things your don't understand. Just admit it. You can't change until you do.

Spiritual life is innately completely independent of death. It does not require something ELSE die for their life to continue.

Is Jesus consuming life at this moment to remain living. We take the life of other things to fill our bellies. To feed this natural life we live.

I could go on and on and on....

Yet, you're still here saying "dead in sins" must equal "spiritual death" and not "physical death" because both Adam and "US" don't immediately die.....

I how preposterous is this? It is really really silly.
 
Those who were stated to have passed from death to life or stated as being alive while dead were not as Adam and Eve physically dead

Ephesians 2:1–5 (LEB) — 1 And you, although you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the ruler of the authority of the air, the spirit now working in the sons of disobedience, 3 among whom also we all formerly lived in the desires of our flesh, doing the will of the flesh and of the mind, and we were children of wrath by nature, as also the rest of them were. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of his great love with which he loved us, 5 and we being dead in trespasses, he made us alive together with Christ (by grace you are saved),

These are living people who were dead in their trespasses and sin

How were they dead?

Colossians 2:13 (LEB) — 13 And although you were dead in the trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he made you alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,

Again these people were dead in the trespasses and the uncircumcision of their flesh but were made alive having forgiven their trespasses

How were they dead?

1 Timothy 5:6 (LEB) — 6 But the one who lives for sensual pleasure is dead even though she lives.

This woman was currently dead

How so?

So how many times have you post this now.....while pretending you haven't received an answer? 6 or 7 times now?

Why? Why do you insult me as if I can't read and don't understand what you're saying?

Hasn't sin entered this world? Sin is about more than you Tom. So what had to die today for you to live?
 
Spiritual death in Arminian theology
https://berean-apologetics.communit...YSTHEO02|ResourceVersion=2014-10-08T00:58:21Z
Chapter I: The Peril of Sin
The same thing may be said of what is called spiritual death—the separation of the soul from God. It is a deprivation in which the intercourse and communion between man and his Maker cease; the Holy Spirit is withdrawn; God refuses to manifest himself as a loving Father dispensing blessings; if manifest at all, he is a sovereign judge, executing…
Systematic Theology, Volume II, p 175
Death as the Penalty of Sin
The second consequence is, therefore, death spiritual, that moral state which arises from the withdrawment of that intercourse of God with the human soul, in consequence of its becoming polluted, and of that influence upon it which is the only source and spring of the right…
Christian Theology, Volumes I–III, V 2, p 91
2. Penalty of the Sinning
There is also a spiritual death in distinction from the spiritual life—such as man originally possessed.4 This death is inseparably connected with sin, and must have been the immediate consequence of sin in Adam.5 His spiritual life was fully realized only in union with the Holy Spirit. Sin was the…
John Miley’s Systematic Theology, Volume 1, p 431
The Punishment
The soul that sinneth is guilty of death, or of being sundered from the Holy Spirit of life: the death of the spirit separated from God, involving the separation of soul and body, and in its issue eternal. This is a hard saying, taken alone; but its mitigation will come in due time. I. Spiritual death is the departure of the Holy Spirit as the…
A Compendium of Christian Theology, V 2, p 36
Physical, Spiritual, and Eternal Death Distinguished
Grace through faith is victorious over spiritual death even in this life by means of the new birth, so that even while temporal death is occurring, it is being transformed into a spiritual blessing…
Life in the Spirit: Systematic Theology, Volume Three, p 381
§ 2. Critical Examination of 2 Cor. 5:14, 15
He thus clearly refers to the death of sin—not to death temporal or eternal, the consequence of sin, but to spiritual death, the moral state of all men who are dead in trespasses and sins—involving, of course, temporal and eternal death, unless it be removed by the salvation which Christ died to procure for all men, if they will only avail themselves…
Systematic Theology: A Complete Body of Wesleyan Arminian Divinity Consisting of Lectures on the Twenty-Five Articles of Religion, Vols. I & II, V 1, p 231
Chapter XVIII: Fall of Man—Doctrine of Original Sin
For if a state of sin in them is a state of spiritual death, then a state of sin in him was a state of spiritual death; and that both by natural consequence, the same cause producing the same effect, and also by the appointment of God, who departs from sinful men, and, withdrawing himself from all communion with the guilty, withdraws thereby the…
Theological Institutes: Or, a View of the Evidences, Doctrines, Morals, and Institutions of Christianity, p 361
 
Calvinist spiritual death

Biblical Argument
In like manner, the death of the soul, or spiritual death, is only a change in the relations of the soul and its mode of existence, and not the annihilation of its substance…
Dogmatic Theology, p 888
The Bible Represents Men as Spiritually Dead
The Bible Represents Men as Spiritually Dead Another way in which the Scriptures clearly teach the doctrine of original sin is to be found in the passages in which they describe the natural state of man since the fall. Men, all men, men of every nation, of every age, and of every condition, are represented as spiritually dead. The…
Systematic Theology, V 2, p 244
II. The Punishment of Sin
We distinguish in the punishment of sin a threefold death: as “temporal” punishment, a) bodily, and b) spiritual death, and as “eternal” punishment, c) everlasting death.…
An Aid to the Heidelberg Catechism, HC Q 10, p 42
2. The Actual Penalty of Sin
B. Spiritual death,—or the separation of the soul from God, including all that pain of conscience, loss of peace, and sorrow of spirit, which result from disturbance of the normal, relation between the soul and God.…
Systematic Theology, p 656
 
Baptist systematic theology
https://berean-apologetics.communit...THEOLERK|ResourceVersion=2011-12-27T17:06:27Z
Spiritual Death
Spiritual Death Spiritual death is both connected with physical death and distinguished from it. It is the separation of the entire person from God. God, as a perfectly holy being, cannot look upon sin or tolerate…
Christian Theology, p 631




Spiritual death is the separation of a person from God, occurring because God, being perfectly holy, cannot tolerate sin, which creates a barrier in the relationship between God and humans, bringing them under judgment and condemnation.[1] Theologians have distinguished three meanings of death: physical death (cessation of bodily life), spiritual death (separation from God’s life), and eternal death (final, eternal separation from God’s life).[2] This concept is exemplified in the story of Adam and Eve, where after eating the forbidden fruit, they experienced shame, tried to hide from God, and were cursed, demonstrating the alienation that results from sin.[1] Biblically, people without Christ are described as “dead in trespasses and sins,” meaning they lack spiritual sensitivity and the ability to respond spiritually or do good.[1] The most significant consequence of sin is death—both physical and spiritual—which results in humans being shut out from God’s presence and the tree of life.[3]

[1] Millard J. Erickson, Christian Theology. (2nd ed.; Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Book House, 1998), 631.
[2] James Leo Garrett Jr., Systematic Theology: Biblical, Historical, and Evangelical (vol. 1, Fourth Edition.; Eugene, OR: Wipf & Stock, 2014), 597–598.
[3] Adam Harwood, Christian Theology: Biblical, Historical, and Systematic (Bellingham, WA: Lexham Academic, 2022), 349.
 
Ante Nicean Fathers

Spiritual death is described as a state of being alienated from God, living in wicked works, and being dead in sins. This spiritual death is contrasted with being spiritually raised with Christ through baptism and forgiveness of trespasses.[1]

Spiritual death can also be caused by leading others into sin or infidelity, which Jesus condemns severely, stating it would be better for such a person to be drowned than to cause a believer to fall.[2]

The apostle Paul provides a profound explanation of spiritual death, describing it as the “fellowship of the soul in a state of sin with the body,” in contrast to life, which is “separation from sin.” He emphasizes that while the wages of sin is death, God offers eternal life through Jesus Christ.[3]

Those without the Spirit of God are considered spiritually dead. As Jesus himself stated, “Let the dead bury their dead,” referring to those who lack the Spirit that gives life.[4]

In contrast, those who fear God, trust in Christ, and establish the Spirit in their hearts are considered “living to God.” The Spirit can overcome the weakness of the flesh, transforming a person from a carnal state to a spiritual one.[4]

[1] Tertullian, “On the Resurrection of the Flesh,” in Latin Christianity: Its Founder, Tertullian (ed. Alexander Roberts, James Donaldson, and A. Cleveland Coxe; trans. Peter Holmes; vol. 3; The Ante-Nicene Fathers; Buffalo, NY: Christian Literature Company, 1885), 3561.
[2] Philip Schaff, The Creeds of Christendom, with a History and Critical Notes: The Greek and Latin Creeds, with Translations (vol. 2; New York: Harper & Brothers, 1890), 536.
[3] Clement of Alexandria, “The Stromata, or Miscellanies,” in Fathers of the Second Century: Hermas, Tatian, Athenagoras, Theophilus, and Clement of Alexandria (Entire) (ed. Alexander Roberts, James Donaldson, and A. Cleveland Coxe; vol. 2; The Ante-Nicene Fathers; Buffalo, NY: Christian Literature Company, 1885), 2411.
[4] Irenaeus of Lyons, “Irenæus against Heresies,” in The Apostolic Fathers with Justin Martyr and Irenaeus (ed. Alexander Roberts, James Donaldson, and A. Cleveland Coxe; vol. 1; The Ante-Nicene Fathers; Buffalo, NY: Christian Literature Company, 1885), 1534–535.

Epistle XX
And therefore I ask that you will grant my desire, and that you will grieve with me at the (spiritual) death of my sister, who in this time of devastation has fallen from Christ; for she has sacrificed and provoked our Lord, as seems manifest to us. And for her deeds I in this day of paschal rejoicing,3 weeping day and night, have spent the days…
Ante-Nicene Fathers 5: Fathers of the Third Century: Hippolytus, Cyprian, Novatian, Appendix, Cyp., Ep. (ANF) 20, p 298
Chapter XXIII
Now, since he makes us spiritually dead—in such a way, however, as to allow that we shall one day have to undergo a bodily death,—so, considering indeed that we have been also raised in a like spiritual sense, he equally allows that we shall further have to undergo a bodily resurrection…
Ante-Nicene Fathers 3: Latin Christianity: Its Founder, Tertullian, Tert., De res. 23, p 561
 
Church Fathers

Spiritual death is a profound theological concept that encompasses several key dimensions. According to scriptural teachings, death is understood to be threefold:
1. Dying to sin and living to God
2. Departing from physical life
3. A spiritual death where not only the flesh but the soul dies, falling away from the Lord through guilt1
Specifically, spiritual death is characterized by ungodliness and sin. It represents a state where souls are disconnected from God, and the path to restoration involves hearing God’s voice, believing, and persevering. The ultimate goal is to transition from the “death of sin” to the “life of grace”.2
This concept of spiritual death is universal, affecting all individuals through original sin or personal sin. The redemptive solution is Christ’s sacrificial death, which provides forgiveness and enables believers to be “quickened out of death” and belong to the “first resurrection”.2
Interestingly, this spiritual death can be understood as a process of putting away former habits and ways of life through repentance. The ultimate hope is that, just as the soul can be renewed, the body will also be transformed into a better form, free from corruption and experiencing unbroken peace.3
The consequences of not addressing spiritual death are severe: those who do not die to worldly ways and conform to truth will face a more terrible death, not transitioning to a heavenly existence but enduring the penalty of their sins.3
1
Ambrose of Milan, “The Two Books on the Decease of His Brother Satyrus,” in St. Ambrose: Select Works and Letters, ed. Philip Schaff and Henry Wace, trans. H. de Romestin, E. de Romestin, and H. T. F. Duckworth, A Select Library of the Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers of the Christian Church, Second Series (New York: Christian Literature Company, 1896), 10:179.
2
Angelo Di Berardino and Thomas C. Oden, eds., We Believe in One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, Ancient Christian Doctrine (Downers Grove, IL: IVP Academic, 2010), 5:150–151.
3
Augustine of Hippo, “On Christian Doctrine,” in St. Augustin’s City of God and Christian Doctrine, ed. Philip Schaff, trans. J. F. Shaw, A Select Library of the Nicene and Post-Nicene Fathers of the Christian Church, First Series (Buffalo, NY: Christian Literature Company, 1887), 2:527.
 
So how many times have you post this now.....while pretending you haven't received an answer? 6 or 7 times now?

Why? Why do you insult me as if I can't read and don't understand what you're saying?

Hasn't sin entered this world? Sin is about more than you Tom. So what had to die today for you to live?
I still have not seen you separate one death from another.

There is no pretension here.

Many scriptures were posted where death and physical life contemporaneously existed.

As for the future of physical death all face it but there is another form of death all will not face.
 
Okay. Prove it. Start by explaining how death doesn't require former life. We are surrounded by things that don't have life. Dust for example. Dirt. Adam was taken from the dust of the earth.
What in the world do dust and dirt have to do with this

Adam was given life before he died



Your bones will one day be absent life but they will still be there. Reminders of how YOU DIED. Memorials.
Yes but your spirit will not be there.

I've asked you before and you ignored, what did Adam and Eve lose.
When?

How does such a question explain how one type of life can exist in opposite forms at the same time?


You said it was irrelevant. Unlearned people like yourself always say this. Do I need to remind you of what you said?
That is funny

I posted Arminian, Calvinist , Baptist, Church Fathers views on the subject

Seeing your response as rather irrelevant does nothing at all to make me unlearned




It is essential that you explain Adam's condition before he "died" without actually "dying"....

You're fabricating this "spiritual death". It doesn't exist.
You are posting your opinion, which does nothing whatsoever to explain how physical living people were dead at the same time.


I'm going to post one more verse and demand you stop assuming your position is true without evidence. All you've done thus far is to claim "spiritual death" exists simply because you read about being "dead in sins" somewhere..... while arguing this MUST equal "spiritual death". Arguments of "how can Paul and others say we are dead and yet we are not physically dead. I mean Geesh. Really? I feel like I'm talking to a child that a parent left them a note saying they can have some candy that eats ends up eating all the candy there is while saying "you didn't define some"........
Multiple verses of scripture, Systematic theologies from multiple forms of Christianity, Church fathers, commentaries

can hardly be called a lack of evidence

and your statement

Arguments of "how can Paul and others say we are dead and yet we are not physically dead. I mean Geesh. Really? I feel like I'm talking to a child that a parent left them a note saying they can have some candy that eats ends up eating all the candy there is while saying "you didn't define some"........

is proof of nothing and a rather desparate attempt at avoiding the argument.



Which is delusional. I'm beginning to think you're an evil man. I
And I think you provide the delusional statement here.

You have continually invoked nastiness and character assassination.

Oh and BTW I have not called a single Calvinist evil or dishonnest

Doctrine not personal character is my focus.
 
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@Tom @Selah
Have you never considered the possibility that the "giving" or the "granting" here may not be speaking of your belief in the effectual instilling of faith?
Tom, there cannot be any other ~ and the reason being is this: When a sinner is born of God, God creates a new man within him, which man is created after the image of Jesus Christ, which man has the power to see, hear, and believe! Faith does not come our flesh, or, the old man, that's "impossible" according to many scriptures, but must come from our new man!

If any does not understand the new birth and what takes place when one is born of God, then they have no clue as to how one can believe and does believe once they hear the gospel message. Not from our old man, but new!

Romans 7:18​

“For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.”

Truly you tell me what is one's flesh taht could enable them to believe? Not ONE THING! To believe otherwise, is to call God a liar, and I do not think your truly desire to do that, nor @Selah.
 
@Tom @Selah

Tom, there cannot be any other ~ and the reason being is this: When a sinner is born of God, God creates a new man within him, which man is created after the image of Jesus Christ, which man has the power to see, hear, and believe! Faith does not come our flesh, or, the old man, that's "impossible" according to many scriptures, but must come from our new man!

Why can there not be an effort by God to cause us to freely believe

And actually scripture points to such

Deuteronomy 30:11–19 (LEB) — 11 “For this commandment that I am commanding you today is not too wonderful for you, and it is not too far from you. 12 It is not in the heavens so that you might say, ‘Who will go up for us to the heavens and get it for us and cause us to hear it, so that we may do it?’ 13 And it is not beyond the sea, so that you might say, ‘Who will cross for us to the other side of the sea and take it for us and cause us to hear it, so that we may do it?’ 14 But the word is very near you, even in your mouth and in your heart, so that you may do it. 15 “See, I am setting before you today life and prosperity and death and disaster; 16 what I am commanding you today is to love Yahweh your God by going in his ways and by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his regulations, and then you will live, and you will become numerous, and Yahweh your God will bless you in the land where you are going. 17 However, if your heart turns aside and you do not listen and you are lured away and you bow down to other gods and you serve them, 18 I declare to you today that you will certainly perish; you will not extend your time on the land that you are crossing the Jordan to go there to take possession of it. 19 I invoke as a witness against you today the heaven and the earth: life and death I have set before you, blessing and curse. So choose life, so that you may live, you and your offspring,

Romans 10:5–8 (LEB) — 5 For Moses writes about the righteousness that is from the law: “The person who does this will live by it.” 6 But the righteousness from faith speaks like this: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down), 7 or “Who will descend into the abyss?” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near to you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim),


Romans 10:17 (LEB) — 17 Consequently, faith comes by hearing, and hearing through the word about Christ.

John 20:31 (LEB) — 31 but these things are recorded in order that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.



If any does not understand the new birth and what takes place when one is born of God, then they have no clue as to how one can believe and does believe once they hear the gospel message. Not from our old man, but new!

Romans 7:18​

“For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.”

Truly you tell me what is one's flesh taht could enable them to believe? Not ONE THING! To believe otherwise, is to call God a liar, and I do not think your truly desire to do that, nor @Selah.
Misses the point one must believe before

John 1:12–13 (LEB) — 12 But as many as received him—to those who believe in his name—he gave to them authority to become children of God, 13 who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of a husband, but of God.

being born of God

Galatians 3:26–27 (LEB) — 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27 for as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

and man is proclaimed enabled

Deuteronomy 30:11–19 (LEB) — 11 “For this commandment that I am commanding you today is not too wonderful for you, and it is not too far from you. 12 It is not in the heavens so that you might say, ‘Who will go up for us to the heavens and get it for us and cause us to hear it, so that we may do it?’ 13 And it is not beyond the sea, so that you might say, ‘Who will cross for us to the other side of the sea and take it for us and cause us to hear it, so that we may do it?’ 14 But the word is very near you, even in your mouth and in your heart, so that you may do it. 15 “See, I am setting before you today life and prosperity and death and disaster; 16 what I am commanding you today is to love Yahweh your God by going in his ways and by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his regulations, and then you will live, and you will become numerous, and Yahweh your God will bless you in the land where you are going. 17 However, if your heart turns aside and you do not listen and you are lured away and you bow down to other gods and you serve them, 18 I declare to you today that you will certainly perish; you will not extend your time on the land that you are crossing the Jordan to go there to take possession of it. 19 I invoke as a witness against you today the heaven and the earth: life and death I have set before you, blessing and curse. So choose life, so that you may live, you and your offspring,

Romans 10:8–10 (LEB) — 8 But what does it say? “The word is near to you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith that we proclaim), 9 that if you confess with your mouth “Jesus is Lord” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses, resulting in salvation.
BTW does your theology not insist willingness is not present in man, contrary to Romans 7:18 which you quoted

In any case however the issue here is the law

Romans 7:25 (LEB) — 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself with my mind am enslaved to the law of God, but with my flesh I am enslaved to the law of sin.

It seems the mind can be directed toward God.
 
Early church history

Spiritual death refers to a state of separation from God, characterized by sin and a lack of spiritual vitality. Death can be understood as “the fellowship of the soul in a state of sin with the body,” while life is the “separation from sin”1. This concept encompasses several key aspects:
1. Spiritual murder occurs when someone causes another to fall into infidelity or sin, subjecting their soul to spiritual death. Jesus emphasized the severity of this, stating it would be better for such a person to be drowned with a millstone around their neck2.
2. The soul is not inherently immortal, but can choose not to die. If it fails to know the truth, it dies and dissolves with the body. However, if it acquires knowledge of God, it does not truly die3.
3. Fundamentally, the soul is darkness with no light of its own. It naturally inclines towards matter and death when left alone. However, when united with the Divine Spirit, it can rise above its limitations3.
4. Faith and salvation are not automatic or permanent. They must be preserved, as grace can forsake those who abandon the Lord’s discipline. Historical examples like Solomon and Saul demonstrate how individuals can lose grace when they stray from God’s ways4.
5. The apostle Paul articulated this concept powerfully, explaining that when people were servants of sin, they were free from righteousness. The end of such a path is death. But by becoming servants of God, they can bear fruit leading to holiness and eternal life1.
Ultimately, God desires that sinners repent and return to life4, offering a path of redemption from spiritual death.
1
Clement of Alexandria, “The Stromata, or Miscellanies,” in Fathers of the Second Century: Hermas, Tatian, Athenagoras, Theophilus, and Clement of Alexandria (Entire), ed. Alexander Roberts, James Donaldson, and A. Cleveland Coxe, The Ante-Nicene Fathers (Buffalo, NY: Christian Literature Company, 1885), 2:411.
2
Philip Schaff, The Creeds of Christendom, with a History and Critical Notes: The Greek and Latin Creeds, with Translations (New York: Harper & Brothers, 1890), 536.
3
John Mee Fuller and G. T. Stokes, “Tatianus (1),” in A Dictionary of Christian Biography, Literature, Sects and Doctrines, ed. William Smith and Henry Wace (London: John Murray, 1877–1887), 4:787.
4
David W. Bercot, ed., “Salvation,” in A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs: A Reference Guide to More than 700 Topics Discussed by the Early Church Fathers (Peabody, MA: Hendrickson Publishers, 1998), 588.

Epistle XX
And therefore I ask that you will grant my desire, and that you will grieve with me at the (spiritual) death of my sister, who in this time of devastation has fallen from Christ; for she has sacrificed and provoked our Lord, as seems manifest to us. And for her deeds I in this day of paschal rejoicing,3 weeping day and night, have spent the days…
Ante-Nicene Fathers 5: Fathers of the Third Century: Hippolytus, Cyprian, Novatian, Appendix, Cyp., Ep. (ANF) 20, p 298

The recondite pattern of concepts that is set out in the text is still grounded in the fact that the church has learnt to encounter God liturgically in one way rather than another, and its ‘damnatory’ clause is a way of saying that the absence of this practice and the experience that accompanies it is spiritual death. We may dislike the absolutism of this; but it is more than an idolatry of formulae.

Rowan Williams, “Introduction: On Studying the Early Church,” in T&T Clark Handbook of the Early Church (ed. Ilaria L. E. Ramelli, John Anthony McGuckin, and Piotr Ashwin-Siejkowski; T&T Clark Handbooks; London; New York; Oxford; New Delhi; Sydney: T&T Clark, 2022), 11.
 
Which is delusional. I'm beginning to think you're an evil man. I'm trying not to think this. I don't see you as being any different than all these Calvinists you're bashing around here. No different at all. Just another man refusing to acknowledge what is blatantly obvious.
Not to worry, Tom is far from being a evil man. I wish I was as patient and kind as he is.
 
I still have not seen you separate one death from another.

There is no pretension here.

Many scriptures were posted where death and physical life contemporaneously existed.

As for the future of physical death all face it but there is another form of death all will not face.

Oh. So you decide to move on by stating "another form of death"....

Why not say this before?
 
Not to worry, Tom is far from being a evil man. I wish I was as patient and kind as he is.

So is it kind to tell me that I'm not answering when I have?

So is it kind to repeat yourself over and over again without clearly defining what you're presenting? While telling others meaningful aspects of "life" is irrelevant?

Then still insist I'm wrong? How about a "false witness"?
 
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What in the world do dust and dirt have to do with this

Gen 18:27 And Abraham answered and said, Behold now, I have taken upon me to speak unto the Lord, which am but dust and ashes:

So was Abraham alive? Was Abraham spiritual alive?

Why dust and ashes? If I were to take your position, then I must claim that Abraham was spiritual dust.
 
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