brightfame52
Active Member
If God commands people to search for Him its because they are already found and saved by Him. The act of searching presupposes life.
"Works Salvation"
- Thread starter Seabass
- Start date
brightfame52
Active Member
Rom 10:9-10 is directed towards them who already believe. Rom 10:9-14
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
civic
Active Member
And God has made Himself known to everyone even the reprobate as as Romans 1 so that all are without excuse.
hope this helps !!!
brightfame52
Active Member
False teaching
civic
Active Member
Yes when you add the words eternal , elect and predestined to passages where those words are missing then you are correct it’s false teaching.
So why are you doing that ?
Frank Russell
Active Member
God says this, therefore obey. However, circumstances only add up to people obeying the person speaking.
Doug Brents
Active Member
No. Paul is speaking to pagan, non-believing, idol worshiping, Gentiles. He is not speaking to members of the Church, nor to Jews. Read what the Holy Spirit says through Paul:
"and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, 27 that they would seek God, if perhaps they might feel around for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28 for in Him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said, ‘For we also are His descendants.’" Acts 17:26-28
God made all the nations, and put them where He wanted them to be so that they (all of humanity) would seek Him, and find Him, even though He is not far from each one of us (US, not just the saved, but all mankind).
Doug Brents
Active Member
That is your preconception speaking again. In Rom 10:9-14, the Holy Spirit is speaking TO believers, but He is speaking ABOUT them when they did not yet believe, and about all the rest of humanity that has not yet believed.
civic
Active Member
Correct
brightfame52
Active Member
People cant and dont seek God naturally, they dead to God Rom 3:11
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
It doesnt matter if they are pagans or refined, religious jews
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes Rom 10:9-10 is to saved regenerated jews to be exact, but it applies to whosoever
Doug Brents
Active Member
You are taking that passage literally, but it should not be. First off, it is a psalm. Psalms is not a good place to gather our doctrine for several reasons. First, it is man speaking to God at the height of emotions (both gratitude and praise, and sorrow and despair). In these extremes, feelings are expressed through exaggerations that are not intended to be doctrinaly accurate.
The passage in Psalm 53 is similar to Elisha's comment in 1 Kings 19:14 where he claims to be the last of the followers of the One true God. Yet God tells him that He still has 7000 other followers who have not gone away after Baal.
Doug Brents
Active Member
Correct, Rom 10:9-10 does apply to everyone. And its command to believe the Gospel and confess Jesus as Lord make those things conditions for receiving salvation. "for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation." Notice that belief results in righteousness (not being made righteous results in belief), and confession brings about salvation (not receiving salvation brings about confession).
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes, men dont seek after the True God naturally. They seek after a god, but not the True God Rom 3:11
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
brightfame52
Active Member
So Rom 10:9-10 is in regards to saved born again people.
Doug Brents
Active Member
No, bright, that is wrong. The Psalm is not a doctrinal statement. It is hyperbole. And the quote of it in Rom 3 is not pointing out that we CANNOT seek God, but that we DO NOT seek God; we have all fallen into sin. There is not a single person other than Jesus who ever lived his whole life without sin.
Doug Brents
Active Member
No, it is in regards to all people. All people, not just the people to whom the letter was originally addressed.
brightfame52
Active Member
Oh yes, none understands or seeks the True God
brightfame52
Active Member
Its in regards to all people who are already saved, regenerated
Rockson
Active Member
Exactly and well said. The Psalms are full of hyperbolic statements. It doesn't mean they're not true but they're true in a hyperbolic sense. Some will quote Ps 5 which states God hates all workers of iniquity. So some jump up and say "See there! God hates sinners!" But we use hyperbolic statements in our day. I've seen some parents who have been horribly hurt by their adult offspring. They might in a burst of emotion say they just hate their kid. Do they REALLY though? No. They still love them very much.
If something happened to them they would be hurt, weeping and upset. Why? Because they GENUINELY care about them and want the best for them! In other words the parent does love their kid. In a similar way God loves all sinners. They may displease him yes make him mad but still doesn't mean he doesn't love them,
We could maybe say the Father of the prodigal son in Lk 15 hated his son for leaving. It hurt him deeply. But did he really hate him? NO. It even says he saw him coming from afar off. This tells us his heart was longing for the one who hurt him to come home.....HE LOVED HIM. So does God the sinner.
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