Much suffering, including death, but at no point did the son suffer retributive wrath from the Father
Why we naturally HATE penal substitution
- Thread starter Dizerner
- Start date
Nope. Colossians 2:14 says different.
synergy
Active Member
Nope. Just 2 verses earlier, faith is mentioned as an integral part of us receiving forgiveness and being made alive. By reading the verses around whatever Calvinists offer as proof texts, you can always always squash calvinism.
12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,
14 having wiped out the https://biblehub.com/nkjv/colossians/2.htm#footnoteshandwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.
Nope. Colossians 2:14 has a time stamp. "At the cross". That is when He had taken it out of the way.
So much for "always squashing Calvinists".
synergy
Active Member
What time stamp do you understand is applied to the following verse:
Rev 13:8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Besides, that doesn't nullify the fact that faith is an integral part of receiving forgiveness and being made alive.
Conclusion: Calvinism keeps getting squashed right before your very eyes.
Marvelloustime
Active Member
@TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY
SPOTTED!!
SPOTTED!!
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
Jesus did not pay any ransom to the devil .
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
sister got me . To the trenches dear sister .
civic
Active Member
After one believes then is born again their sins were cancelled at the cross. my sins were not removed until I believed the gospel and was born again. Read the context.
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
People try and twist many things my friend and they do so unto their own destruction .
In order to RECIEVE a gift , ONE must beleive , if one rejects , NO GIFT , NO FORGIVENSS of sins .
People can be real ignorant at times .
Imagine mr Kno
And mr Knonott
Both men are on trial for their evil deed done .
The judge has determined death for their sentence for the evil they did .
An intercessor who paid the price for the sins of the world
comes in and says , Mr KNO i can FREE you from this sentence of death you so rightly earned and deserved .
And only I CAN DO THIS FOR YOU .
So MR KNO beleives HIM and says YES .
MR KNO NOT is asked the same thing
only HE says I DONT beleive that , I Dont beleive you can .
ONE WILL BE FREED
but the OTHER WILL BE SENTENCED TO DEATH .
JESUS IS THE ONLY WAY and GOD has already chosen
by the preaching to save those WHO DO BELEIVE . its that simple .
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
For it pleased GOD by the preaching to SAVE those who do BELEIVE .
that was THE WILL of the FATHER .
Many think they been sealed by the SPIRIT and that even false religoins are under the working of the SPIRIT
FORGETTING that AFTER ONE BELEIVED is when one was SEALED .
By the preaching of the gospel , by which YE ARE SAVED
IF YE BELEIVE . BELEIVE .
lest ye have beleived in vain . Many do the work of darkness and specially in these last and very late hour .
MANY within even christendom are calling THE FATHER A LIAR
and yet realize NOT they do so .
WHO calls GOD a liar .
Well lets see . What did john write .
HE who BELIEVES NOT the testimony that GOD gave of the SON calls GOD a liar .
SO THEN , how can so many so called christains
listen to a false love lie , inclusive interfaith interreligious lie
and believe other religoins are okay as long as they loved . BECAUSE that would be calling GOD a liar
HE SAID THEY MUST
JUST cause one can cliam to BELIEVE IN JESUS THE CHRIST
its quite obvious many dont BELEIEVE HIM , HIS WORDS , or the words of even the apostels .
SOMETHING is dead wrong civic . And this sheep does all it can
to POINT to JESUS , to all sound doctrine , to warn and to expose that which is of anti christ
but it sure falls deaf on many ears . OH I KNOW some hear , for we have sheep scattered all over the world
BUT MANY reject , many had rather go with the ever growing , ever broadning flow
of the RIVER of great delusoin and have no idea they headed right to a massive waterfall of total destruction .
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
Mark my words . THEY COMING after the gospel , THEY have been .
THEY have been at work to recreate another lovespel which darn sure aint no gospel or LOVE of GOD .
This is why we are seeing such an uptick and specially as of late
of so many people beginning to try and plant ideas about how its okay EVEN if one didnt bleieve ON HIM .
SOON , however , this will worsen
and it even now already has been . We have men already beginning to speak up and out
and say that evangelizing the need to beleive on JESUS
IS IN the way of GODS true plan for world peace n safety .
EVEN going as far as to say those who do prolestyzie that gospel are not EVEN TRUE CHRISTAINS .
and friend some are even beginning to buy into that .
Many think men like me DO NOT KNOW GOD OR LOVE
so its increasing big time my friend .
NOW WE STAND FIRM for CHRIST NOW and do all to contend for the true faith .
Fearing not man or what he can do . WE will be hated and hated even more with whatever time
we even have left in this world .
WHICH by the signs of the times AINT MUCH TIME AT ALL .
Fellow Traveler
Active Member
Right He did not. He crushed his head. It's in Genesis 3.
Can you address the time stamp in Colossians 2:14 or not? When were your sins nailed to the cross being taken out of the way?
So you were born again in the first century?
When were the handwriting of requirements against you taken out of the way according to the text?
synergy
Active Member
You're the one who brought up Col 2:14, not me. I see that your presuppositions got thrown for a 100 yard loss with Rev 13:8. Let's see how your calvinism gets you out of the mess that it made for you.
The discussion is about Colossians 2:14. I understand you wish to divert attention away from said text. One has nothing to do with the other. If you wish to discuss Rev. 13 start another thread. TOUCHDOWN! Calvinism with a insurmountable lead!
civic
Active Member
Nope sins paid for but they did not take effect until I believed the gospel and became a child of God and no more condemnation. Jesus spells this out clearly in John 3:16-18.So you were born again in the first century?
Your view contradicts Jesus teaching in John 3:16-18. You need to realign your beliefs with Jesus teaching since He is the Truth.
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
Civic you know i love ya , but i have to admit something worried me a bit .
I need to hear you say
he who beleives NOT that JESUS is the CHRIST
is actually calling GOD a liar . THERE is reason for this .
I know how they try and slip us into the rabbit hole .
ANY one that can say JESUS is not the CHRIST is truly calling GOD a liar .
In fact i will also remind us of what john also wrote .
WHO IS a liar . ITS he that DENIES JESUS is the CHRIST , HE is anti christ .
ONLY BY THE SPIRIT does one call HIM LORD
but NO MAN by the SPIRIT could deny HE IS CHRIST . they are still trapped in darkness
of satan and in deadly dire danger .
ITs far more serious what i speak of my friend . WE being groomed my friend .
THEY know how to slip things in at the first . WE must come to the fully persauded mind
and let not an arrow one , a thought one , try and convince us otherwise . THEY are slick my friend .
BUT we must stand FIRM my friend .
People can holler all day long at me , IF they so desire
and holler You aint perfect , YOU aint this or that
BUT I CAN PROMISE US ALL ONE THING .
MY DIRE DETERMINATION to PREACH JESUS THE CHRIST
and allow not a single thought contrary to be taught ,
WELL GOD DARN SURE AINT angry at me , NOR is that a fault .
I KNOW WHO SAVES . And i simply cannot allow even the smallest bit of leaven
to try and lead anyone into any kind of false hope . ITS JESUS For me my friend .
I KNOW no man can save themselves , MOST OF ALL this wicked thing i once was .
I DIDNT SAVE ME . And I like anyone else FELL FAR SHORT of the righteousness and GLORY OF GOD .
BUT EVERONE else just like me , HAS DONE THE SAME .
WE WERE ALL UNDER THE SENTANCE OF DEATH . SOMEONE FREED US . HIS NAME IS JESUS .
i wont allow a false love to offer up any kind of false hope . And i know how slick the enemy is
HE always picks and pecks with the tiniest amount of falsehood to bring folks right into THE LIE .
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