The Doctrine of the Resurrection of Christ
- Thread starter civic
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Behold
Well-known member
Your answer is the answer...regarding someone who is trusting in your behavior, to keep you saved.
This is the Legalist... who teaches..,"yes Jesus saved me....but....but.....but....NOW, its up to me to complete it, or "finish is" as you believe.".
That is not "Faith in Christ".. That is "as long as i behave, as long as i try to be good, do works... i hope God lets me in after i die".
See that?
That is SELF righteousness, vs Christ's Righteousness.
That is Legalism vs God's "Gift of Salvation".
So, you have to realize @Johann , that there are some here who have been saved a while, and they know they were not always perfect, but those who understand the Cross, know that they were always BORN AGAIN, and going to heaven.
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Okay I think we get the message.
Behold
Well-known member
Maybe you can take the lead here, and help this member understand that Self Saving, is not Salvation.
Ive tried to show him this for 24 months....
Here is the Question for you... and you dont have to answer it, but, i hope you will.
Q.) Do you believe that you can lose your Salvation?
That's actually my favorite topic. The reason it's my favorite topic is because I've dealt with it in my own life and years of studying. It's actually the reason I came to forums like this over 20 years ago.
I know that you cannot lose your salvation from my personal experience. I'm pretty passionate about it. And I understand how our human nature can become frustrated when people can't see things our way. But that's the nature of the beast...that's how it works. Some people like to debate, myself personally I just post the reasons I believe what I believe. I realized the likelihood of changing someone's mind is very slim. Although it does happen.
The enjoyment I get is doing research on various topics.
Behold
Well-known member
"Salvation" is the finished work of Jesus on the Cross.
The end.
Roll Credits.
Fade.....to .... black.
Salvation, is God taking full and eternal responsibility for the fact that each of us is born in a BAD situation, and God Himself came here as Christ on the Cross to give us the opportunity to get out of a bad situation....for Eternity.
We are born in sin, born adamic, and none of us chose it.
Who chose to be born? Let me see the hands.... .. Ah.. ok......NOBODY>.... good answer.
And, God understand this, and gave HIS ALL for us, to help us OUT of this mess. He died a horrible death for OUR SALVATiON.
Some wont have it.
Some think they have it, and dont have it.
Some have it, and understand it.
Some have it, and no longer understand it, or never really did.
And....All of THESE are on a "christian" FORUM, and that is going to CONFLICT no matter how much you try to make people have "peace" with each other.
See....Darkness, is lies, and Truth is against it, and Theology is absolutely TRUTH or its absolutely not.
= "well, behold.... who is to judge who is right or wrong"?
A.) Paul's doctrine.
Heretics, teach that Salvation, is "doing this", or "not doing that", and or "obeying this and keeping that", which has no affiliation with understanding the Cross of Christ or the Grace of God.
See, once they dig out their Moses Law, and commandment Keeping, and self effort... then they proved they are ether not born again, or have no idea what it means.. Have no idea what God as Christ on the Cross, has accomplished.
It is very possible to be born again... YET.... "fallen from Grace" and "in the Flesh" and "bewitched"... and no longer understand that Jesus is the Savior, based ONLHY on His Sacrifice.
Paul said that these LEGALISTS, (Galatians), are "in the Flesh" and "Bewitched".
Its also very possible to have never been saved, but know some theology, have some CULT training.... and teach all this as if you are saved...
= and forums are filled with these people.
2 Corinthians 11:15
So....Here is what we can know is true about "Salvation".
Being born again is the only proof you have it.., as "spiritual fruit" can be faked, by Satan's people.
"well they sure can post a lot of verses"... ... and so can the Devil.
The thing is... Reader...if you are truly BORN Again..., then God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit are become ""one"" with you, and you "one with God" and "in Christ" as "the temple of the Holy Spirit, and if you could "lose salvation">. then this means you would go to hell , BORN AGAIN, with God, Christ, and the Holy Spirit in you, for Eternity.
= IMPOSSIBLE.
A.) You can't stop being born again, as a BIRTH can't be undone, and being born again is a Spiritual BIRTH of a "new Creation" "in Christ".
So, Reader....Let me show you what STUPID looks like as "theology".
It looks like This.... A person goes to their mother and says....>" Hey YOU.....i am not born anymore of you. I reject that i was born of you, i lost faith that im your child, born of you..., so, consider me no longer BORN at all".
See that? That is "stuck on Stupid".
Now, how does the Christian prove they are that very one?
A.) " I can lose my Salvation"... = I am no longer BORN..... again......""
See that one?
Its the same "dumb" ........ yet this one has severe Theological ignorance...... and the other is just some crazy person, whose mother is very sad that they birthed that one.
The question is now what do we do with so great a salvation?
Grace ambassador
Well-known member
I'm puzzled - should this be:
The question is now what do we do with what is called 'so great salvation'?:
"How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be
spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard Him" (Hebrews 2:3)
Thanks...
yes, I fixed it. Thanks for pointing it out.
You have provided a good study on the resurrection and the gospel in this forum for my studies civic.Without the bodily resurrection which was permanent one has no Savior and you are still dead in your sins according to the Apostle Paul. 1 Corinthians 15:17
Many deny Jesus was Resurrected and Ascended into heaven bodily( a human body with real flesh and bones) and are still dead in their sins even though they might claim to be a christian. That is an oxymoron.
Luke 24:37-43
37 But they were startled and frightened and thought that they were seeing a spirit. 38 And He said to them, "Why are you troubled, and why do doubts arise in your hearts? 39 "See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have." 40 And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet. 41 While they still could not believe it because of their joy and amazement, He said to them, "Have you anything here to eat?" 42 They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish; 43 and He took it and ate it before them.
John 20:24-25
24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. 25 So the other disciples were saying to him, "We have seen the Lord!" But he said to them, "Unless I see in His hands the imprint of the nails, and put my finger into the place of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe."
John 20:27-28
27 Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see My hands. Reach out your hand and put it into My side. Stop doubting and believe." 28 Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"
There is one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. (1Timothy 2:5) post ascension.
Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.(Hebrews 13:5) Changeless, Immutable. Jesus was a man when He walked this earth, when He Ascended and when He will return again at His 2nd Coming.
1 Corinthians 15:1-8
Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6 After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7 then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8 and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also.
1 Corinthians 15:14-18
14 and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain. 15 Moreover we are even found to be false witnesses of God, because we testified against God that He raised Christ, whom He did not raise, if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, not even Christ has been raised; 17 and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins.
2 Corinthians 5:1-10
For we know that when this earthly tent we live in is taken down (that is, when we die and leave this earthly body), we will have a house in heaven, an eternal body made for us by God himself and not by human hands. 2 We grow weary in our present bodies, and we long to put on our heavenly bodies like new clothing. 3 For we will put on heavenly bodies; we will not be spirits without bodies. 4 While we live in these earthly bodies, we groan and sigh, but it's not that we want to die and get rid of these bodies that clothe us. Rather, we want to put on our new bodies so that these dying bodies will be swallowed up by life. 5 God himself has prepared us for this, and as a guarantee he has given us his Holy Spirit.6 So we are always confident, even though we know that as long as we live in these bodies we are not at home with the Lord. 7 For we live by believing and not by seeing. 8 Yes, we are fully confident, and we would rather be away from these earthly bodies, for then we will be at home with the Lord. 9 So whether we are here in this body or away from this body, our goal is to please him.
In Heaven.... Hebrews 8:1 Now of the things which we have spoken [this is] the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;
8:2 A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.
Look up the meaning of the word soma below, it always means a physical body in relation to anthropos(man).
His Body.....Philippians 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
Matthew 27:52-53
52 The tombs broke open and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. 53 They came out of the tombs, and after Jesus' resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many people.
Philippians 3:20-21
And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body.
1 Corinthians 15:44-45
44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.
Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15 that if Christ be not risen your faith is in vain and you are still dead in your sins- an unbeliever who is lost. Those who deny the physical bodily resurrection of Jesus such as the JW's who teach that Jesus is now a spirit based being fit into this camp. They deny the resurrection.
If we look at what Paul is saying in this passage, it is that corruptible flesh and blood shall not enter the kingdom. Paul says corruptible does not inherit the incorruptible. Paul is not saying the resurrection body will not have flesh but what he declares is that the resurrected body will not have perishable flesh. Remember in Luke Jesus said see here My hands and feet, touch Me a spirit/ghost does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have. Peter, Paul and John all agree that Jesus still had flesh well after His ascension. 1 John being the last of the books of the three Apostles declared that Jesus having come in the flesh and those who deny this are the spirit of antichrist. John makes it clear that the Incarnation was permanent. Jesus is forever both God and man. This is what Paul teaches in the whole 15th chapter of 1 Corinthians. The glorious physical bodies that we will have in the resurrection. We will have incorruptible bodies just as Jesus now has in heaven.
hope this helps !!!
View on our blog
The Bodily Resurrection & Ascension of Jesus
Without the bodily resurrection which was permanent one has no Savior and you are still dead in your sins according to the Apostle Paul. 1 Corinthians 15:17 Many deny Jesus was Resurrected and…wordsofjesus68538540.wordpress.com
civic
Well-known member
I pray you will grow in Christ through your studies my friend. May Christ open your mind and heart as you seek Him in your pursuit of Him bringing glory to His Holy Name as your Savior, Lord, God and Creator.
charismaticlady
Active member
The resurrection shows that His death as a sacrifice for all sin was accepted.Without the bodily resurrection which was permanent one has no Savior and you are still dead in your sins according to the Apostle Paul. 1 Corinthians 15:17
Many deny Jesus was Resurrected and Ascended into heaven bodily( a human body with real flesh and bones) and are still dead in their sins even though they might claim to be a christian. That is an oxymoron.
Luke 24:37-43
37 But they were startled and frightened and thought that they were seeing a spirit. 38 And He said to them, "Why are you troubled, and why do doubts arise in your hearts? 39 "See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have." 40 And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet. 41 While they still could not believe it because of their joy and amazement, He said to them, "Have you anything here to eat?" 42 They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish; 43 and He took it and ate it before them.
John 20:24-25
24 But Thomas, one of the twelve, called Didymus, was not with them when Jesus came. 25 So the other disciples were saying to him, "We have seen the Lord!" But he said to them, "Unless I see in His hands the imprint of the nails, and put my finger into the place of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe."
John 20:27-28
27 Then he said to Thomas, "Put your finger here; see My hands. Reach out your hand and put it into My side. Stop doubting and believe." 28 Thomas said to him, "My Lord and my God!"
There is one Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. (1Timothy 2:5) post ascension.
Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.(Hebrews 13:5) Changeless, Immutable. Jesus was a man when He walked this earth, when He Ascended and when He will return again at His 2nd Coming.
1 Corinthians 15:1-8
Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6 After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7 then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8 and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also.
1 Corinthians 15:14-18
14 and if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is vain, your faith also is vain. 15 Moreover we are even found to be false witnesses of God, because we testified against God that He raised Christ, whom He did not raise, if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, not even Christ has been raised; 17 and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless; you are still in your sins.
2 Corinthians 5:1-10
For we know that when this earthly tent we live in is taken down (that is, when we die and leave this earthly body), we will have a house in heaven, an eternal body made for us by God himself and not by human hands. 2 We grow weary in our present bodies, and we long to put on our heavenly bodies like new clothing. 3 For we will put on heavenly bodies; we will not be spirits without bodies. 4 While we live in these earthly bodies, we groan and sigh, but it's not that we want to die and get rid of these bodies that clothe us. Rather, we want to put on our new bodies so that these dying bodies will be swallowed up by life. 5 God himself has prepared us for this, and as a guarantee he has given us his Holy Spirit.6 So we are always confident, even though we know that as long as we live in these bodies we are not at home with the Lord. 7 For we live by believing and not by seeing. 8 Yes, we are fully confident, and we would rather be away from these earthly bodies, for then we will be at home with the Lord. 9 So whether we are here in this body or away from this body, our goal is to please him.
In Heaven.... Hebrews 8:1 Now of the things which we have spoken [this is] the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;
8:2 A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.
Look up the meaning of the word soma below, it always means a physical body in relation to anthropos(man).
His Body.....Philippians 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
Philippians 3:21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
Matthew 27:52-53
52 The tombs broke open and the bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. 53 They came out of the tombs, and after Jesus' resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many people.
Philippians 3:20-21
And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who, by the power that enables him to bring everything under his control, will transform our lowly bodies so that they will be like his glorious body.
1 Corinthians 15:44-45
44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.
Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15 that if Christ be not risen your faith is in vain and you are still dead in your sins- an unbeliever who is lost. Those who deny the physical bodily resurrection of Jesus such as the JW's who teach that Jesus is now a spirit based being fit into this camp. They deny the resurrection.
If we look at what Paul is saying in this passage, it is that corruptible flesh and blood shall not enter the kingdom. Paul says corruptible does not inherit the incorruptible. Paul is not saying the resurrection body will not have flesh but what he declares is that the resurrected body will not have perishable flesh. Remember in Luke Jesus said see here My hands and feet, touch Me a spirit/ghost does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have. Peter, Paul and John all agree that Jesus still had flesh well after His ascension. 1 John being the last of the books of the three Apostles declared that Jesus having come in the flesh and those who deny this are the spirit of antichrist. John makes it clear that the Incarnation was permanent. Jesus is forever both God and man. This is what Paul teaches in the whole 15th chapter of 1 Corinthians. The glorious physical bodies that we will have in the resurrection. We will have incorruptible bodies just as Jesus now has in heaven.
hope this helps !!!
View on our blog
The Bodily Resurrection & Ascension of Jesus
Without the bodily resurrection which was permanent one has no Savior and you are still dead in your sins according to the Apostle Paul. 1 Corinthians 15:17 Many deny Jesus was Resurrected and…
civic
Well-known member
I’m thankful for your prayers.I pray you will grow in Christ through your studies my friend. May Christ open your mind and heart as you seek Him in your pursuit of Him bringing glory to His Holy Name as your Savior, Lord, God and Creator.
civic
Well-known member
Is it a true teaching that Jesus did not rise from the dead ?
Is it a false teaching that Jesus did not rise from the dead ?
or
Is it a true teaching that Jesus Rose from the dead bodily ?
Is the Resurrection of Jesus a true teaching ?
One of the above pair of statements are true and the other is false.
When a person denies the resurrection and teaches it didn’t happen is that a false teaching or a true teaching ?Agreed, my friend. But I caution you not to waste time on the negative. If you devote yourself to false teachings, that is all you'll do. I think it is better to wait for someone to propose a true teaching that is actually false. Then the fruit of your labor will be ripe.
Make a Blessed Day!
Wrangler
Well-known member
What an idolatrous post. Jesus never asked such questions. Can you summarize Christianity in a single, short sentence?
Let’s start and end with the basics. Love: God and others.
To add to that, Love: God and others through acceptance that his Anointed son Jesus is your master and rescuer.
civic
Well-known member
1 Cor 15:17- And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins.
I am learning some new things myself that I have not thought of before reading this study on the resurrection and its importance and how everything ties in together.
civic
Well-known member
I enjoy studying and learning every day new things about God, His word, important doctrines and last but not least how to improve living for Christ in a fallen world. Study without application for me is doing it for the wrong reasons. I study now these days to become a new creation in Christ, to reflect Him demonstrated in how I'm loving others. So studying Gods character has been my passion the past few years. I have learned God never asks us to be or do anything that He doesn't say about Himself. All we need to do is examine the life of Christ to see how God lives among men, how He treated them, how He had compassion, mercy, forgiveness, patience, kindness, longsuffering etc....... with the lost. His life reflected the fruit of the spirit, 1 cor 13 which describes love in action.
Whosoever
Member
I was just talking to my next door neighbor about this very thing. I think I will do some more reflecting on the topic.
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