Open Debate on the "Eternal Sonship vs Incarnate Sonship which is biblical?"

[101G]

So there is an end with God? Or is there an end with man?

LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh My, did you not read 101G's post carefully? guess not... Oh well God has no beginning nor End do that answer your question there.

I do think. I can't think like you anymore. I pay attention to what I read.

apparently not. but that's ok, re-education takes some time.

Okay. If you've been paying attention to what I said in the Predestination thread, I've been dealing with this. Predestination involves the Eternal nature of the Son and His Eternal qualities/character.

LOL, there is no Predestination in God, Oh my, can't believe how untrained some are. listen, listen, pre anything is none existence in eternity. that's for us in TIME... oh my, my, my.

I'm glad you asked. I actually believe in the preincarnate bodily form of the Eternal Son. It wasn't flesh but it is a tangible material construct that Jesus revealed in the Transfiguration.

see above.

can't believe this...

101G

 

[praise_yeshua]

LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh My, did you not read 101G's post carefully? guess not... Oh well God has no beginning nor End do that answer your question there.

I did. There were question marks at the end of those sentences. I wasn't saying that God ends.

apparently not. but that's ok, re-education takes some time.

LOL, there is no Predestination in God, Oh my, can't believe how untrained some are. listen, listen, pre anything is none existence in eternity. that's for us in TIME... oh my, my, my.

see above.

can't believe this...

101G

I have debated this subject for several decades among peers. Eternal isn't the absence of time it is time without duration. Endless time. I've said this many times here and spent countless words to defend my position among peers throughout my life. You're not adding anything to me. I'm way ahead of you.

Now. If you really want to understand what I believe, ask. You should. I will offer something to begin the teaching lesson for you....

Is Glory immaterial?

 

[Red Baker]

I can say the same things about your religion. You make many assumptions. Maybe you are the one who is deceived and do not know it.

One word for you @civic : "Beware of playing with snakes...................... they will bite you"!

You should debate an actual Trinitarian who is a Calvinist , and we have several good ones on the forum.

And you do a good job defending what you believe even though you know I disagree.

Do not say I did not warned you! You well earned what you just received! Selah.

 

[101G]

To that end, I want to state publicly that I have abandoned the doctrine of "incarnational sonship." Careful study and reflection have brought me to understand that Scripture does indeed present the relationship between God the Father and Christ the Son as an eternal Father-Son relationship. I no longer regard Christ's sonship as a role He assumed in His incarnation.

My earlier position arose out of my study of Hebrews 1:5, which appears to speak of the Father's begetting the Son as an event that takes place at a point in time: "This day have I begotten thee"; "I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son" (emphasis added).

That verse presents some very difficult concepts. "Begetting" normally speaks of a person's origin. Moreover, sons are generally subordinate to their fathers. I therefore found it difficult to see how an eternal Father-Son relationship could be compatible with perfect equality and eternality among the Persons of the Trinity. "Sonship," I concluded, bespeaks the place of voluntary submission to which Christ condescended at His incarnation (cf. Phil. 2:5-8; John 5:19).

question to Civic, you said, "This day have I begotten thee"; "I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son" " and " I concluded, bespeaks the place of voluntary submission to which Christ condescended at His incarnation (cf. Phil. 2:5-8; John 5:19)".
one question, did he condescended his "POWERS", or his "NATURE"? your reply please.

101G.

 

[praise_yeshua]

question to Civic, you said, "This day have I begotten thee"; "I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son" " and " I concluded, bespeaks the place of voluntary submission to which Christ condescended at His incarnation (cf. Phil. 2:5-8; John 5:19)".
one question, did he condescended his "POWERS", or his "NATURE"? your reply please.

101G.

Condescending doesn't even imply removal.

 

[101G]

Now. If you really want to understand what I believe, ask. You should. I will offer something to begin the teaching lesson for you....

Is Glory immaterial?

Good, your answer no.

now my question to your understanding 101G's beliefs. "Who sits on the throne in Revelation chapter 4 and 5?" identify by title, Father or Son? your answer please.

101G.

 

[101G]

Condescending doesn't even imply removal.

well then answer the question.... (smile).

101G

 

[praise_yeshua]

well then answer the question.... (smile).

101G

I did. You're implying removal in your question. The question is flawed from the beginning.

 

[civic]

One word for you @civic : "Beware of playing with snakes...................... they will bite you"!

Do not say I did not warned you! You well earned what you just received! Selah.

I'm a snake handler but not a religious one but an expert who use to breed snakes and also catch rattlesnakes bear handed and feed them to kingsnakes.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Good, your answer no.

now my question to your understanding 101G's beliefs. "Who sits on the throne in Revelation chapter 4 and 5?" identify by title, Father or Son? your answer please.

101G.

I've already answered you several times already. You have a broken clock.....

Now answer mine. Is Glory immaterial?

 

[praise_yeshua]

I'm a snake handler but not a religious one but an expert who use to breed snakes and also catch rattlesnakes bear handed and feed them to kingsnakes.

That must of been fun. I had a childhood friend that did this. When we first started to drive he would slam on the brakes in the middle of the road and jump out to chase a snake and capture it.

 

[101G]

I did. You're implying removal in your question. The question is flawed from the beginning.

so, we can take this as you cannot answer? thought so.... next

101G

 

[civic]

That must of been fun. I had a childhood friend that did this. When we first started to drive he would slam on the brakes in the middle of the road and jump out to chase a snake and capture it.

lol I raised my sons and daughters that way, they learned not to fear snakes. My wife is a different story

 

[101G]

I've already answered you several times already. You have a broken clock.....

Now answer mine. Is Glory immaterial?

LOL, LOL, LOL, 101G did, now 101G's answer again, NO

101G

 

[praise_yeshua]

lol I raised my sons and daughters that way, they learned not to fear snakes. My wife is a different story

Mine too but my daughter will literally knock you off a cliff to get away from a camel cricket or fly. Everything that moves is a snake or spider to her.

 

[praise_yeshua]

LOL, LOL, LOL, 101G did, now 101G's answer again, NO

101G

Okay. Now that I read back through your responses, I see how it can be taken that way. I didn't take it that way.

So if Glory is material, and Glory is a central characteristic of God, then what does that tell you about your position?

 

[civic]

Mine too but my daughter will literally knock you off a cliff to get away from a camel cricket or fly. Everything that moves is a snake or spider to her.

ya bugs/ spiders are another story all my kids are afraid of them

 

[101G]

Okay. Now that I read back through your responses, I see how it can be taken that way. I didn't take it that way.

So if Glory is material, and Glory is a central characteristic of God, then what does that tell you about your position?

in Good standing with the BIBLE, and here's why, is not God's ARM glorious? and is not the Lord Jesus the "ARM" of God....... YES, LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh my this is too easy.

now, mind answering 101G's question? "who sits on the throne in Revelation chapter 4 and 5, title only" the one whom you calls the Father, or the Son, your answer please.

101G.

 

[civic]

in Good standing with the BIBLE, and here's why, is not God's ARM glorious? and is not the Lord Jesus the "ARM" of God....... YES, LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh my this is too easy.

now, mind answering 101G's question? "who sits on the throne in Revelation chapter 4 and 5, title only" the one whom you calls the Father, or the Son, your answer please.

101G.

There are TWO/ 2 sitting on the one throne.

So much for oneness eh ?

next fallacy

 

[praise_yeshua]

in Good standing with the BIBLE, and here's why, is not God's ARM glorious? and is not the Lord Jesus the "ARM" of God....... YES, LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh my this is too easy.

now, mind answering 101G's question? "who sits on the throne in Revelation chapter 4 and 5, title only" the one whom you calls the Father, or the Son, your answer please.

101G.

I like you. I really do. However, it is hard for me to communicate with you. I don't think you understand much of any of this. That is okay. You don't have to. You should consider what I said and make your own decision. Like I've told you before, I take solace in the fact you honor Jesus Christ more than many.