Runningman
Active Member
Would love to learn how to debunk trinitarianism more effectively and push the truth more vigorously. Thanks for helping!
Jesus Christ is the wisdom and creation of God
- Thread starter Runningman
- Start date
Contradiction.
Runningman
Active Member
Matthew 6:6,9 is the only teaching/instruction on who to pray to in the Bible and it says the Father. Now you aren't confused about who to pray to anymore.
Runningman
Active Member
That' what you're doing.
You could start by tearing out pages of your bible until only the few remain that you like. But it does not matter how much you push your view, the testimony of scriptures remains poised against you.
Runningman
Active Member
Your point is refuted by Matthew 6:6,9. Start learning with @mikesw
No proof for this.
Runningman
Active Member
The whole Bible is Unitarian. No need to remove anything. Now, if I were you, I would shelf your Bible since you cannot find even one statement about God being "three persons in one Godhead" or something similar. Even the early proto-Trinitarians are not your allys, as almost all of them were subordinationists and some didn't even believe the Holy Spirit is a third person in a Trinity. You need to fast forward to around the 3rd century to get closer to your religion, but most especially the 4th century is when they finally figured out what Trinitarianism is at the council of Nicaea and Constantinople.
You missed how Peterlag pointed out the emphasis on the triune baptism in the second century. You must have missed how Jews were trying to discern the way that two powers seemed to interact both under the name yahweh. A little more research can catch you up to all that you failed to learn while you were gone.
Runningman
Active Member
Regardless, none of them were "orthodox Trinitarians" and they would all be heretics by today's standard of Trinitarianism. The point is, the people in your group really hadn't figured out who or what their god is for a very long time. It also took them a long time to create supporting doctrines to close of (most) of the loopholes. They forgot about figuring out how a sin sacrifice works in your religion, though.
For example, Trinitarians cannot answer this question. If God cannot die, and Jesus is God in the flesh, then when Jesus died, was it actually God who died, or merely Jesus' physical body?
Maybe you can explain what your confusion is here. You are probably right that the unitarian heretics and all the other heresies claimed to hold to each step of refinement of the confessions while denying the truth. Indeed, it was useful to keep those with the heretical views by saying they hold to the confession-- i.e., the confession that did not yet expose their workaround to the confession.
It is not odd that you do not understand how the incarnated God still had a body that could suffer death. Do not use that as an excuse to deny Christ.
Selah
Active Member
Jesus is God.
Colossians 1:15-20 (NKJV) 15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. 18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. 19 For it pleased [the Father that] in Him all the fullness should dwell, 20 and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross.
—selah
Runningman
Active Member
No idea what you're talking about. The Bible says there is one God, the Father, the only true God. That's the Unitarian view of God and it is explicit and Scriptural.
Strawman argument.
Runningman
Active Member
That says Jesus is an image (visible) and that God is invisible. The only God is invisible which rules out Jesus as being The God.
Colossians 1
15The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
1 Tim 1
17Now to the King eternal, immortal, and invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.
Interesting. So you think there is someone advocating several gods? You seem to be misunderstanding what group you are talking to. Maybe have a thread denying there are many gods. See if you have anyone who disagrees with you on that concept. Maybe you will just have Hindus challenging your rejection of multiple gods.
Wecould get back to the Unitarian heresy vs Triune God.
Runningman must be proposing that Abraham did not see anything when he recognized God visiting him. So these verses was just the imagination of Abraham and was not real:
Genesis 17:1–2 (ESV)
1When Abram was ninety-nine years old the LORD appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am God Almighty; walk before me, and be blameless,
2that I may make my covenant between me and you, and may multiply you greatly.”
I'm starting to see how runningman thinks. Pretty unusual way.
Runningman
Active Member
What you have said is completely unscriptural. Jesus is a visible man in heaven mediating between God and man (1 Tim. 2:5) and when he returns every eye will see him. Means he isn't the invisible God. Unfortunately, you may be among those tribes of the earth who mourn his return.
Revelation 1
7Behold, He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see Him—even those who pierced Him. And all the tribes of the earth will mourn because of Him. So shall it be! Amen.
