Is the word all ever used in a restricted sense ?

[brightfame52]

@dwight92070

There might be SOME times when all refers to less than ALL,

It always means all, just not all without exception. It might mean all without exception 1% of the time, if that. It mostly 99.9% of time means all of a group of some particulars.

 

[brightfame52]

@TibiasDad

For instance, 1 John 2:1-2 “He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for our sins, but the sins of the whole world.” “Our sins” refers to those of us who have already believed; so the other sins are those of the rest of humanity (the world).

False, this is also the whole world of the elect, not only out of the jews, but out of all nations. In fact 99.9% of the time, world in a salvaic context means , the scope of the salvation focus is not only in israel, but the entire world.

 

[TibiasDad]

@TibiasDad



False, this is also the whole world of the elect, not only out of the jews, but out of all nations. In fact 99.9% of the time, world in a salvaic context means , the scope of the salvation focus is not only in israel, but the entire world.

That is your premise to defend! But who in the world needs salvation if not all of humanity?


Doug

 

[brightfame52]

That is your premise to defend! But who in the world needs salvation if not all of humanity?


Doug

i have defended it b4. That doesnt mean you can believe it. Salvation isnt about who needs it, its about Gods Glory, and so is His Damnation of the non elect. You projecting humanism now, Salvation has absolutely nothing to do with human need. Can you defend that concept from scripture ?

 

[TibiasDad]

i have defended it b4.

If this is what a defense looks like, well, it’s not very convincing.

That doesnt mean you can believe it.

No, that is true; I cannot believe it!

Salvation isnt about who needs it, it’s about Gods Glory, and so is His Damnation of the non elect.

For the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost. Matt 18:11

For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” Luke 19:10

John 3:16For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

You projecting humanism now, Salvation has absolutely nothing to do with human need. Can you defend that concept from scripture ?

Mark 2:17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”

Matt6:8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him…
32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them.

Luke 11:8 I tell you, even though he will not get up and give you the bread because of friendship, yet because of your shameless audacity he will surely get up and give you as much as you need.

2 Pet 1:3His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness.

Rev 3:17 You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.


On the other hand God needs nothing, for he is self sufficient and self fulfilling. His Aseity demands his lack of need. As early as Gen 3:15, the need of man was addressed and provided for. All of history is about the needs of men and how they seek to fulfill them.

To say that it isn’t about our need is the most humanistic statement of bravado! That we don’t need God and the gospel isn’t about our God addressing our needs denies the very foundation of the gospel and impunes the very character of God!


Doug

 

[brightfame52]

If this is what a defense looks like, well, it’s not very convincing.


No, that is true; I cannot believe it!

For the Son of Man has come to save that which was lost. Matt 18:11

For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” Luke 19:10

John 3:16For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.


Mark 2:17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”

Matt6:8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him…
32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them.

Luke 11:8 I tell you, even though he will not get up and give you the bread because of friendship, yet because of your shameless audacity he will surely get up and give you as much as you need.

2 Pet 1:3His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness.

Rev 3:17 You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.


On the other hand God needs nothing, for he is self sufficient and self fulfilling. His Aseity demands his lack of need. As early as Gen 3:15, the need of man was addressed and provided for. All of history is about the needs of men and how they seek to fulfill them.

To say that it isn’t about our need is the most humanistic statement of bravado! That we don’t need God and the gospel isn’t about our God addressing our needs denies the very foundation of the gospel and impunes the very character of God!


Doug

Salvation has absolutely nothing to do wth human need,Its all about Gods Glory as well as Damnnation

 

[TibiasDad]

Salvation has absolutely nothing to do wth human need,Its all about Gods Glory as well as Damnnation

Not according to scripture. It was God’s love for us that motivated his actions, not needing to be glorified. Again, God needs nothing outside of himself. In other words, God has no need to be glorified in and of itself. We need to glorify him in recognition of who he is; not because he needs it, but because he is worthy of it!

Doug

 

[brightfame52]

Not according to scripture. It was God’s love for us that motivated his actions, not needing to be glorified. Again, God needs nothing outside of himself. In other words, God has no need to be glorified in and of itself. We need to glorify him in recognition of who he is; not because he needs it, but because he is worthy of it!

Doug

Yes according to scripture. Gods Glory is principal, even though sinners will be saved from their sinful plight, but jjust as much to Gods Glory is the damnation of sinners for His Glorious Justice, their need wasn't important, His Glory was and is!

 

[TibiasDad]

Yes according to scripture. Gods Glory is principal, even though sinners will be saved from their sinful plight, but jjust as much to Gods Glory is the damnation of sinners for His Glorious Justice, their need wasn't important, His Glory was and is!

If God needs anything outside of himself then he is not God! Sin is the damnation of sinners, not God's glory.

Doug

 

[TibiasDad]

Yes according to scripture. Gods Glory is principal, even though sinners will be saved from their sinful plight, but jjust as much to Gods Glory is the damnation of sinners for His Glorious Justice, their need wasn't important, His Glory was and is!

God is Love; thus God is not self-seeking in his motives. His concern is always focused on the needs of others, not on himself. If memory serves, @civic realized this fact and it changed his perspective from Calvinistic to a non-Calvinistic view.

Again God needs nothing outside of himself.

Doug

 

[brightfame52]

God is Love; thus God is not self-seeking in his motives. His concern is always focused on the needs of others, not on himself. If memory serves, @civic realized this fact and it changed his perspective from Calvinistic to a non-Calvinistic view.

Again God needs nothing outside of himself.

Doug

Gods Love is limited to His elect, and if you dont preach that, you preach a false god and Gospel. And again, Gods Salvation has nothing to do with peoples needs, its all about Himself, His Glory Prov 16:4

4 The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

Thats a dumb idol you talking about

 

[TibiasDad]

Gods Love is limited to His elect, and if you dont preach that, you preach a false god and Gospel. And again, Gods Salvation has nothing to do with peoples needs, its all about Himself, His Glory Prov 16:4

4 The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

Thats a dumb idol you talking about

God loved the world in this way; he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting life.

There is no mention, hint, or implication of ἐκλογή, or any limitation to the scope of κόσμος.

Doug

 

[brightfame52]

God loved the world in this way; he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting life.

There is no mention, hint, or implication of ἐκλογή, or any limitation to the scope of κόσμος.

Doug

Thats false teaching, God Loved the world of the elect, as set forth with jacob and esau Rom 9:13

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

There is a world Christ as Mediator High Priest did not pray for Jn 17:9, He didn't love it nor sacrifice Himself for it

And if this counsel of Gods word is omitted, its not rightly dividing the Truth

 

[TibiasDad]

Gods Love is limited to His elect, and if you dont preach that, you preach a false god and Gospel.

And the God you preach deliberately hates the large majority of those he created. I have no gospel if I believe that! If I can’t say with complete honesty that the person with whom I am sharing the gospel is truly capable of receiving eternal life, it is not really good news, it’s just a crapshoot!

Doug

 

[TibiasDad]

Thats false teaching, God Loved the world of the elect, as set forth with jacob and esau Rom 9:13

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

The purpose of Rom 9 is to say that God does things as he sees fit, not according to human standards or tradition. The specific reference in 9:13 is the tradition that the first born is the most important of the children, receiving 2/3’s of the estate; but God chose the younger son to be the leader over the older.

God is sovereign and he plays by his own rules, not ours!

There is a world Christ as Mediator High Priest did not pray for Jn 17:9, He didn't love it nor sacrifice Himself for it

Jesus was praying specifically for his disciples, the twelve, minus Judas. Not the rest of the world.

And if this counsel of Gods word is omitted, its not rightly dividing the Truth

This counsel of God’s Word is not omitted, just properly read and interpreted.


Doug

 

[brightfame52]

And the God you preach deliberately hates the large majority of those he created. I have no gospel if I believe that! If I can’t say with complete honesty that the person with whom I am sharing the gospel is truly capable of receiving eternal life, it is not really good news, it’s just a crapshoot!

Doug

Yes God does hate a large portion of people, and He Loves a Large portion as well

 

[Johann]

Yes God does hate a large portion of people, and He Loves a Large portion as well

Any Scripture references as to this?

J.

 

[brightfame52]

Any Scripture references as to this?

J.

Its spiritually discerned

 

[Johann]

Its spiritually discerned

Any Scripture reference as to your statement that God hates people created in His Imago Dei?

J.

 

[TibiasDad]

Its spiritually discerned

In other words, you make it up as you go along. No need for the biblical language needed!

Doug