civic
Active Member
if you did not personally believed the gospel then you have not ever believed the gospel.
Is believing/faith a work ?
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
brightfame52
Active Member
One cannot personally believe the Gospel until they are saved. The Gospel is hidden to them that are lost 2 Cor 4:3-4
civic
Active Member
just the opposite is true belief in the gospel precedes salvation.
Tothalordbeallglory
Active Member
But sirs what must I DO to be saved . And paul and silas answered , BELEIVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
That is right my friend .
civic
Active Member
but wait they got it all wrong don't you know
he should of said you are already saved and so now just believe since God already gave you the belief after He saved you so whats next
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing in Jesus is a salvific blessing, it accompanies Salvation by Grace.
civic
Active Member
yes a persons own faith is necessary before one receives the gift of salvation/eternal life.
atpollard
Active Member
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him" - John 6:44 [NASB]
"My sheep listen to My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me" - John 10:27 [NASB]
"Now when they heard [this,] they were pierced to the heart" - Acts 2:37 [NASB]
"My sheep listen to My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me" - John 10:27 [NASB]
"Now when they heard [this,] they were pierced to the heart" - Acts 2:37 [NASB]
- The FATHER "draws", the SON "calls to follow" and the HOLY SPIRIT "pierces" the heart.
- We do nothing without all three ["Among them we too all previously lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the rest." - Ephesians 2:3 NASB]
brightfame52
Active Member
Salvation Faith is not of ourselves, so its not our responsibility , its given in Salvation Eph 2:8
civic
Active Member
nowhere in all of scripture does it even once say what you claim. you made that up since its salvation thats the gift.
FreeInChrist
Active Member
But YOU DO NOT believe
FreeInChrist
Active Member
@brightfame52
Are you saying that because it is said " But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
That is the reason God gives out faith to those he predetermines?
If that be the case then why?????????? the rest of that verse "for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
You keep telling us that God predetermines and elects those who will be saved and gift's them the faith to believe.
But if true.... why is it that this verse says " that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."???????
God gives it all to those who diligently seek him."???????
And who are those that diligently seek Him... for it cannot be those he already chose...... this has to be those with FREE WILL.
"
Are you saying that because it is said " But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
That is the reason God gives out faith to those he predetermines?
If that be the case then why?????????? the rest of that verse "for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
You keep telling us that God predetermines and elects those who will be saved and gift's them the faith to believe.
But if true.... why is it that this verse says " that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."???????
God gives it all to those who diligently seek him."???????
And who are those that diligently seek Him... for it cannot be those he already chose...... this has to be those with FREE WILL.
"
brightfame52
Active Member
Sure it does, I have always given scripture, All of salvation by grace through faith is the Gift of God
civic
Active Member
brightfame52
Active Member
Yes it does Eph 2:8 and Acts 18:27 and Rom 4:16 Faith in salvation isnt in the natural man. The natural man has an mjnd at enmity against God and cannot please God Rom 8:7-8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
civic
Active Member
nope the new birth comes after hearing and believing the gospel.
so we see the new birth is a result of hearing and believing the preaching of the word of God. the gospel message.
James 1:18
He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we would be a kind of firstfruits of His creation.
1 Peter 1:25
But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.
1 Peter 1:21-24
Through him you believe in God, who raised him from the dead and glorified him, and so your faith and hope are in God. 22 Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere love for each other, love one another deeply, from the heart. 23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God. 24 For,
“All people are like grass,
and all their glory is like the flowers of the field;
the grass withers and the flowers fall,
25 but the word of the Lord endures forever.”
And this is the word that was preached to you.
1 John 5:1
1Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God. Whoever loves the Father also loves the child who is born of him.
Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.
Ephesians 5:26
to sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word,
Ephesians 1:13-14
And in Him, having heard and believed the word of truth—the gospel of your salvation—you were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, / who is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession, to the praise of His glory.
1 Corinthians 4:15
Even if you have ten thousand guardians in Christ, you do not have many fathers; for in Christ Jesus I became your father through the gospel.
2 Thessalonians 2:13
But we should always thank God for you, brothers who are loved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved by the sanctification of the Spirit and by faith in the truth.
Colossians 1:5-6
the faith and love proceeding from the hope stored up for you in heaven, of which you have already heard in the word of truth, the gospel / that has come to you. All over the world this gospel is bearing fruit and growing, just as it has been doing among you since the day you heard it and truly understood the grace of God.
conclusion: the calvinists have this backwards.
hope this helps !!!
brightfame52
Active Member
No it doesnt, hearing spiritually comes with the spiritual new birth, Jn 8:47
FreeInChrist
Active Member
Once again.... as you have not seen this yet...
You just said " The natural man has an mjnd at enmity against God and cannot please God Rom 8:7-8"
Just keep in mind also " And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him." Hebrew 11:6
You are so certain that the natural man cannot please God... So I posted the following to you a bit ago.
__________________________________________
Are you saying that because it is said " But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
That is the reason God gives out faith to those he predetermines?
If that be the case then why?????????? the rest of that verse "for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
You keep telling us that God predetermines and elects those who will be saved and gift's them the faith to believe.
But if true.... why is it that this verse says " that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."???????
God gives it all to those who diligently seek him."???????
And who are those that diligently seek Him... for it cannot be those he already chose...... this has to be those with FREE WILL.
And am adding this that if it is those who diligently seek Him are the ones....
God IS expecting a lot of work.
brightfame52
Active Member
Here's another scripture that indicates faith has an element of action to it. Jesus says in Mk 11:22
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
This is an imperative that requires action
The imperative mood corresponds to the English imperative, and expresses a command to the hearer to perform a certain action by the order and authority of the one commanding. Thus, Jesus' phrase, "Repent ye, and believe the gospel" (Mk.1:15) is not at all an "invitation," but an absolute command requiring full obedience on the part of all hearers.
People try to dismiss truth by worldly arguments, the wisdom of this world.
Yes Faith here is a noun however an action is required, which is a work 13
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
This is an imperative that requires action
The imperative mood corresponds to the English imperative, and expresses a command to the hearer to perform a certain action by the order and authority of the one commanding. Thus, Jesus' phrase, "Repent ye, and believe the gospel" (Mk.1:15) is not at all an "invitation," but an absolute command requiring full obedience on the part of all hearers.
People try to dismiss truth by worldly arguments, the wisdom of this world.
Yes Faith here is a noun however an action is required, which is a work 13
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