@Jim
So then, you claim that Jesus was saying in John 3:5, "truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born physically and born spiritually, he cannot enter the kingdom of God". Is that about right? Why would you think Jesus would make being born physically a requirement? Who do you think would fail to meet that requirement? That wouldn't even be a restriction for all the rest of the animals. Interesting concept. Stupid I think, but interesting.
I say that the entire exchange with Nicodemus was the spritual side of being born again and that was the emphasis that Jesus was making....
Jn 3:5 -6
5, Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6, “That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
This seems to definitely be calling attention to the water and Spirit in vs. 5, and flesh and Spirit in vs. 6
5 and 6 followed by
7“Do not be amazed that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’
8“The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going;
so is everyone who is born of the Spirit.”
He was not instructing Nicodemus about a water baptism at all..... especially when he went on at this point and said
9Nicodemus said to Him, “How can these things be?”
10Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel and do not understand these things?
From a link I have been reading from recently.... I am only posting part as it is extremely long.
But has meaning for this subject.
https://afaithfulversion.org/appendices-p/
What Does It Mean to Be “Born Again”?
It is apparent that the early Latin church fathers made a deliberate alteration of the text in
John 3:5 that, to this day, has obscured the true meaning of the phrase “born again.” This alteration has remained a part of the
Latin Vulgate and is the basis of the Catholic doctrine of the “sacrament of baptism.” During the Reformation, Protestants rejected the Catholic sacrament and developed a slightly different doctrine regarding “born again.” The teachings of what it means to be “born again” and “born of God” are perhaps some of the most misunderstood teachings of the New Testament. Tragically, this has resulted in millions of false conversions.
The Latin Vulgate: When examining
John 3:3-5 in the
Latin Vulgate Bible—originally translated by Jerome in 383 AD—one finds
a deliberate insertion of the word “again” into verse 5, making it read “born
again of water.”
No Greek manuscript has the word “again” added to the phrase “born of water.” What follows is the
Latin Vulgate with an English translation. Note that the Latin syntax must be reordered into English syntax most of the time and punctuation added:
3.
Respondit Iesus et dixit ei amen amen dico tibi nisi quis natus fuerit denuo non potest videre regnum Dei
3. Jesus responded and said to him, “Amen, amen, I say to you unless anyone be
born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”
4.
Dicit ad eum Nicodemus quomodo potest homo nasci cum senex sit numquid potest in ventrem matris suae iterato introire et nasci
4. Nicodemus says to him, “How can a man be
born already being old? Can he enter into his own mother’s belly again and be
born?”
5.
Respondit Iesus amen amen dico tibi nisi quis renatus fuerit ex aqua et Spiritu non potest introire in regnum Dei
5. Jesus answered, “Amen, amen, I say to you unless one is
reborn [born again] of water and Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.”
In verse 3 the Latin natus means “born” and denuo means “anew” or “again.” But, denuo is not found in verse 5, which reads differently. Instead, the prefix re has been added to natus, making it read renatus, which means “reborn” or “born again.” This addition makes the phrase read, “born
again of water and Spirit.” This phrase is not found in any of the Greek manuscripts, which universally read:
γ∈ννηθη ∈ξ υδοτος και πν∈υµατος, correctly translated, “born of water and of spirit.” Moreover, the Greek word
ανωθ∈ν anothen “again” or “anew,” found in the Greek text in verse 3, is not found in verse 5.
Since the Greek word
ανωθ∈ν anothen does not appear in verse 5 in any Greek manuscript, the Latin text is not an accurate translation from the Greek. Also, the addition of the prefix re to natus changes the entire meaning of verse 5. It is likely that these changes were made in order to substantiate the mistaken belief that when one is baptized, one is “
reborn of water,” or “born
again of water.” From this doctrine the practice of infant baptism was developed.
The True Scriptural Meaning of “Born Again”
In order to fully comprehend the true scriptural meaning of when one is born again, Jesus’ teachings in
John 3:1-12 must be examined. The context of these verses proves that being born again does not mean a conversion or baptismal experience. Rather, it means a literal transformation from flesh to spirit:
A Comparison of Other Early English
Translations of John 3:3, 5
William Tyndale, a Bible scholar and the first man to translate the New Testament from the Greek into English, translated
John 3:3, 5 correctly. However, in his other writings, he taught that when one is converted and receives the Holy Spirit, one has been born again. Perhaps he carried this misunderstanding from the
Latin Vulgate into his theology, while rendering the correct translation of “born again” and “born anew” in John 3.
Tyndale rendered the Greek words
γ∈νναω ανωθ∈ν gennao anothen in
John 3:3 as “born from above” and “born anew.” The Greek word
γ∈νναω gennao means: Of a man, “to beget, to become a father”; of a woman, “to conceive, to bear.” In some cases, according to the context,
gennao does mean “born.” However,
gennao predominantly means “begotten” rather than “born.” The Greek word anothen, means: “from above, again, anew” (Arndt & Gingrich,
A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament).
From
The English Hexapla (1841) we can compare Tyndale’s translation of the critical verses in John 3 with five other English translations. It is evident that other translators also had problems interpreting
gennao and gennao anothen. The following four versions were translated into English from the Greek Text:
1) Tyndale 1534: “born anew,” verse 3; “born again,” verses 4, 7; “born,” verses 4, 5, and 6.
2) Great Bible, Cramner 1539: “born from above,” verses 3, 7; “born again,” verse 4; “born,” verses 4, 5, and 6.
3) Geneva 1557: “begotten again,” verses 3, 7; “begotten,” verses 4, 5 and 6.
4) KJV 1611: “born again,” verses 3, 7; “born,” verses 4, 5 and 6.
The translators of the 1557
Geneva Bible translated gennao as “begotten.” In many instances, “begotten” is a correct translation of gennao. However, in John 3 “begotten” is an
incorrect rendering. The translators of the 1599 Geneva Bible corrected this error to make it read “born” instead of “begotten.”
As I said, this is only a bit from that article. The link above you can check out if you wish.
