Did Christ bring peace or did the law bring peace?

[Bob Carabbio]

I've never claimed to have perfect obedience, nor is there any particular reason why I would need to have it. That is a fundamental misunderstanding of the goal of the law.

The LAW primarily was given TO MAKE SIN VISIBLE to humans. But you, like everybody else, continue to SIN after being "Born Again". However we have an advocate -

The EXISTENCE of "LAW" creates in humans the DESIRE to transgress it.

 

[Soyeong]

The LAW primarily was given TO MAKE SIN VISIBLE to humans. But you, like everybody else, continue to SIN after being "Born Again". However we have an advocate -

The law was primarily given to teach us how to know God through experiencing His nature such as by doing what is holy, righteous good, which is eternal life (John 17:3), and it reveals our sin by contrast. Moreover, the purpose of revealing our sin is to lead us to repent and return to obedience to God's law.

A chip off of the old block is someone who has the same nature or character as their father, so that is the sense that Jesus is the Son of God insofar as he is the exact image of God's nature (Hebrews 1:3), which he experienced through setting a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law, so that is also the sense that we are born again as children of God when we are partaking in the divine nature through following his example. This is why 1 John 3:4-10 says that those who do not practice righteousness in obedience to the Mosaic Law are not children of God and why Romans 8:4-14 contrasts those who are born of the Spirit with those who have minds set on the flesh who are enemies of God who refuse to submit to the Mosaic Law.

The EXISTENCE of "LAW" creates in humans the DESIRE to transgress it.

In Romans 7:7, the Law of God is not sinful, but is how we know what sin is, and when our sin is revealed, then that leads us to repent and causes sin to decrease, however, the law of sin is sinful, so it causes sin to increase by stirring up sinful passions in order to bear fruit unto death. In Romans 7:22-23, Paul said that he delighted in obeying the Law of God, but contrasted that with the law of sin that held him captive. Paul said that the Law of God is good and that he wanted to do good, but contrasted that with the law of sin that was causing him not to do the good that he wanted to do, so it is important not to take what was said about the law of sin and apply it as though it were said about the Law of God.

 

[Brakelite]

Psa 119:165 Great peace have those who love your law;

If you have peace in the law, then why do you need Christ?

The quote doesn't say one has peace in the law, it says that people have great peace when they love the law.
People can know the truth, but still be deceived. One has to love the truth, have a passion for truth, seek it like a treasure, and once found, never let it go. Then God won't send them a strong delusion, because they love the truth as a principle in the life, it isn't about just knowing a string of facts.
So when someone loves the law, they are loving more than just a list of commandments, they are loving the Law-maker, they are loving the principles embodied in the law and which were personified in Christ. They are loving the government which is founded on that law. They admire and appreciate the law as being eternal, a transcript of righteousness... The righteousness of God Himself. It goes far deeper and further than simple obedience. It recognises that the principles of them law are as eternal as is the God who spoke them. A God of love who is not arbitrarily being a demanding tyrant, but deeply cares how His people live... That they be happy, content, and yes, at peace with God and one another.
It's a deeply blasphemous insult to claim that God has done away with and discarded the very law that underpins His government and kingdom. It is no different than claiming God has cast aside His own character and become an anarchist.

 

[civic]

The quote doesn't say one has peace in the law, it says that people have great peace when they love the law.
People can know the truth, but still be deceived. One has to love the truth, have a passion for truth, seek it like a treasure, and once found, never let it go. Then God won't send them a strong delusion, because they love the truth as a principle in the life, it isn't about just knowing a string of facts.
So when someone loves the law, they are loving more than just a list of commandments, they are loving the Law-maker, they are loving the principles embodied in the law and which were personified in Christ. They are loving the government which is founded on that law. They admire and appreciate the law as being eternal, a transcript of righteousness... The righteousness of God Himself. It goes far deeper and further than simple obedience. It recognises that the principles of them law are as eternal as is the God who spoke them. A God of love who is not arbitrarily being a demanding tyrant, but deeply cares how His people live... That they be happy, content, and yes, at peace with God and one another.
It's a deeply blasphemous insult to claim that God has done away with and discarded the very law that underpins His government and kingdom. It is no different than claiming God has cast aside His own character and become an anarchist.

So you would tie that with the 1st commandment to love the Lord your God with all of your mind, heart, strength and soul. Those who actually Love God in that way will result in delighting in the law of the Lord as a byproduct.

 

[praise_yeshua]

The quote doesn't say one has peace in the law, it says that people have great peace when they love the law.
People can know the truth, but still be deceived. One has to love the truth, have a passion for truth, seek it like a treasure, and once found, never let it go. Then God won't send them a strong delusion, because they love the truth as a principle in the life, it isn't about just knowing a string of facts.
So when someone loves the law, they are loving more than just a list of commandments, they are loving the Law-maker, they are loving the principles embodied in the law and which were personified in Christ. They are loving the government which is founded on that law. They admire and appreciate the law as being eternal, a transcript of righteousness... The righteousness of God Himself. It goes far deeper and further than simple obedience. It recognises that the principles of them law are as eternal as is the God who spoke them. A God of love who is not arbitrarily being a demanding tyrant, but deeply cares how His people live... That they be happy, content, and yes, at peace with God and one another.
It's a deeply blasphemous insult to claim that God has done away with and discarded the very law that underpins His government and kingdom. It is no different than claiming God has cast aside His own character and become an anarchist.

I'll ask you the question that I always those that hold your position.

Do you kill your own children because they cursed you?

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

Contrast. You know what God did? He died for his children .

You speak of the character of God found in the law? The Character of God is found in God's love for sinners. There is no love to be found in

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

 

[Brakelite]

I'll ask you the question that I always those that hold your position.

Do you kill your own children because they cursed you?

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

Contrast. You know what God did? He died for his children .

You speak of the character of God found in the law? The Character of God is found in God's love for sinners. There is no love to be found in

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

Seems to me that you know little of the character of God if you believe He is so arbitrary that He desires the death of a child at the hands of a parent for a non consequential reason. Abraham and Isaac should have taught you that. The curse in that biblical sense is more than a swear word popping out as a result of a short temper or a hammer on a thumb. The curse you speak of is motivated by the desire to destroy.

 

[Brakelite]

There is no love to be found in

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

Yes there is. God's love demanded the nation learn quickly that parents are not to be trifled with by the mouth or actions of utterly rebellious children for which there is no hope. God protected Israel in the same way by requiring the death of Agag. Read how the failure to comply turned out. You don't take the law then arbitrarily apply it to your understanding of the nature of God and declare, "that doesn't fit".
You take the nature and character of God and apply it to the law, and contextualise the law in accordance to what you know, (John3:16 eg) of God's character.

 

[Brakelite]

So you would tie that with the 1st commandment to love the Lord your God with all of your mind, heart, strength and soul. Those who actually Love God in that way will result in delighting in the law of the Lord as a byproduct.

Absolutely. Particularly when you appreciate that the law, designed in the context as a hedge of protection around his people, (as per the hedge around the vineyard) is a transcript of His character. A character that loves and protects. Like True Father. As we trust in that love, trust in that protection, trust in God's providence and caring watchful nature constantly, our faith will remain strong, and as we behold God in this manner, we are changed into His likeness. Obedient to all the commandments of God.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Seems to me that you know little of the character of God if you believe He is so arbitrary that He desires the death of a child at the hands of a parent for a non consequential reason. Abraham and Isaac should have taught you that.

How nice of you. I've spent a large portion of my life extolling the good character of God. I hope don't mind if I wait for God to speak. It really doesn't matter how you seek to judge me.

I asked you a question. A question you ignored. I asked would you kill you own children for cursing you? You didn't answer the question because you know you wouldn't. We all know you wouldn't.

You speak of God's character...... and yet you believe God would. That what you believe. Which is contrary to the very actions that God wrought in Jesus Christ. When we deserved death, God brought life.

The curse in that biblical sense is more than a swear word popping out as a result of a short temper or a hammer on a thumb. The curse you speak of is motivated by the desire to destroy.

It is? I did read that in the Scriptures. I know where you got your response from. It wasn't from the Scriptures. You're using philosophy found Judaism. You know..... all those contemptible words from Pharisees that killed Jesus Christ.

YOU PERSONALLY should already be dead. I should too. Thank God for mercy. Mercy He extends even to sinners that do not know Him.

You wouldn't kill your own children.... but you wouldn't mind at all killing someone else's children because they broke your laws. The law was given to expose the bad character of those who judge others when they are equally guilty themselves. People like yourself.

Here. Read it again and show me specifically what you claim is there.

Lev 20:9 For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother; his blood shall be upon him.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Absolutely. Particularly when you appreciate that the law, designed in the context as a hedge of protection around his people, (as per the hedge around the vineyard) is a transcript of His character. A character that loves and protects. Like True Father. As we trust in that love, trust in that protection, trust in God's providence and caring watchful nature constantly, our faith will remain strong, and as we behold God in this manner, we are changed into His likeness. Obedient to all the commandments of God.

Then why do you dishonor Him by breaking these laws you claim make you like Him? You dishonor Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is who made you like Himself. Not the law.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Yes there is. God's love demanded the nation learn quickly that parents are not to be trifled with by the mouth or actions of utterly rebellious children for which there is no hope.

Like your children? Like YOU... Yourself?

Every child is rebellious. You love your own. Everyone does. Everyone.

Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

God protected Israel in the same way by requiring the death of Agag. Read how the failure to comply turned out. You don't take the law then arbitrarily apply it to your understanding of the nature of God and declare, "that doesn't fit".
You take the nature and character of God and apply it to the law, and contextualise the law in accordance to what you know, (John3:16 eg) of God's character.

Children were SELECTIVELY killed in accordance to Lev 20:9.

You know... by people like yourself that see the sins of others but not their own?