7 Reasons the church does not go through the great tribulation

[Victoria]

Please do not hold your breath, he makes many accusations, yet as of yet posted his first post in his own words what he believes and neither has he as of yet disproved any post that I have made.

Well, it's to my understanding that some in the partial preterist camp believe Nero was the Antichrist...
but given he committed suicide, he doesn't qualify.

Nero died by suicide on June 9, 68 AD

I've then been told that Titus was the actual Antichrist... but given he too died, he doesn't qualify either.
I'm now awaiting who they'll say is next.

Titus died on September 13, 81 AD

According to Revelation 19:20, they certainly wouldn't qualify... unless...
they attempt to allegorize Revelation 19:20

"And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."

I'am waiting for the first premillennialists to prove which comes first, Christ, or the man of sin. According to their teachings Christ comes first.

But they do not even know who is the man of sin/antichrist/abomination of desolation. Anyone?

The man of sin cannot be revealed yet while the Body of Christ is still on the earth. The apostle Paul was given the revelation of the mystery... yes, even the Body of Christ is part of that mystery...

"Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began." Acts 3:21

Prophecy was made known since the world began. Nothing prophesied was ever kept secret.
The mystery, on the other hand, was kept hid in God...

"And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ: To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God," Ephesians 3:9-10

"But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory."
1 Corinthians 2:7-8

"And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;... And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it." Colossians 2:13; 15

"For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."
2 Thessalonians 2:7

Who's "he?" Since we're members of Christs' body, Jesus is speaking of the Body of Christ. There's a mystery of iniquity, & there's a mystery of godliness.

"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." 1 Timothy 3:16

Satan hates the fact that the Body of Christ will replace him, & his angels in the heavens. God never revealed before the cross how He'd reconcile the heavens back unto Himself, kept that hidden from Satan b/c of his "I" statements in Isaiah 14:13-15. In the book of Job, God says...

"Behold, he putteth no trust in his saints; yea, the heavens are not clean in his sight." Job 15:15

So the way Satan sees it, since God never makes mention of creating any new angels, he felt at least his position in the heavens was secure, regardless of whether Jesus Christ resurrected, or not. Then.... UH, ohhh... wha... what has he DONE!!!

You can now get an idea of why he hates Paul's ministry, the Body of Christ, & our abode being in the heavens.

"For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:"
Philippians 3:20

"For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:"
2 Corinthians 5:1-2

 

[Red Baker]

@Victoria

Well, it's to my understanding that some in the partial preterist camp believe Nero was the Antichrist...
but given he committed suicide, he doesn't qualify.

Nero died by suicide on June 9, 68 AD

I've then been told that Titus was the actual Antichrist... but given he too died, he doesn't qualify either.
I'm now awaiting who they'll say is next.

Titus died on September 13, 81 AD

Since I do not use history to support, confirm, what I understand and teach, I cannot confirm or disagree with this, and neither do I care, since God's children live by every word of God, to the best of their powers to do so. We get our bible truths from the scriptures alone, history cannot be trusted to support any bible teachings since history is written by victors who lie. Scriptures are written by men moved by the Holy Ghost and we know His witness is faithful and true, and He cannot lie. The scriptures are more sure word of prophecy, than any eyewitness account that one may give ~ So said Peter.

2nd Peter 1:19-21​

“We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”

We will trust only the scriptures and will not waste our time reading The Wars of the Jews by the infidel Josephus, seeking to help us understand what we are reading from God's inspired word.

According to Revelation 19:20, they certainly wouldn't qualify... unless...
they attempt to allegorize Revelation 19:20

"And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."

We will address these scriptures when we come to them, maybe later today, when we will consider the mark of the beast.

The man of sin cannot be revealed yet while the Body of Christ is still on the earth. The apostle Paul was given the revelation of the mystery... yes, even the Body of Christ is part of that mystery...

Highlighted word are done by me for discussion.

Well @Victoria you are boldly going against the apostle Paul, who said let no man deceive you by any means, basically the very same warning that the Lord Jesus gave when he begun his Olivet discourse that we shall consider in-depth very soon, the Lord willing, and I trust that he is.

2nd Thessalonians 2:3​

“Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;”

Victoria, please consider and respond back to me the following points.

1)Paul said these words: "for that day shall not come:....what day is Paul referring to? Very simple to answer.

2nd Thessalonians 2:1​

“Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,”

THAT DAY, is the Lord's second and only coming for his elect, and for you to say the man of sin cannot be revealed is for you to boldly goes against the word of God! To all of the saints reading this: let no man deceive you by any means! The man of sin must come first, but wait, listen carefully to Paul there's much more to hear.

2nd Thessalonians 2:7​

“For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.”

The mystery of iniquity or, the spirit of an antichrist has been in the world since Cain, and has work greater or less throughout this world's history, but in the last days leading up to the second coming of Jesus Christ there will be an overflowing of the mystery of iniquity in great numbers the like the world has never seen or will ever see. Consider:

1st John 2:18​

“Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.”

The early church taught because of Daniel and Christ's Olivet discourse that the spirit of antichrist will come in GREAT NUMBERS at the end of the world, even though there have always been that mystery of iniquity in this world, yet during the tribulation period, the time of Jacob's trouble, the number of the man of sin will be great, the likes this world has never seen, except the Lord shortened those days, no flesh would be saved with the true knowledge of the word of God because of all these popular false prophets that this world will be faced with.

More on this later. You need to rethink your position for it is against the scriptures, very plainly so.

"For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."
2 Thessalonians 2:7

Who's "he?" Since we're members of Christs' body, Jesus is speaking of the Body of Christ. There's a mystery of iniquity, & there's a mystery of godliness.

The "He" in this verse is the Spirit of God, he has hindered the spirit of the devil until the church of Jesus Christ is finished, and then that restraint will be taken out of the way, and then this world will be flooded with false prophets, the likes this world has never seen, or will see. History repeats it self, much what will happen in the end of this world happened to Israel jus tbefoe the Babylonian captivity.

Much of what you said above has no reference to what we are discussing. Wonderful scriptures, but not pertaining to the subject under consideration.

 

[Persevering]

Those who do not believe in a pre-trib rapture over look the fact that the church is not mentioned in Revelation chapters 4–18 because the have gone to be with Jesus.

 

[Red Baker]

Augustine built on Origen’s teachings and helped establish amillennialism—the belief that the Millennium described in Revelation symbolizes the Church Age, not a future literal reign of Christ.

"The Church is the kingdom of Christ, and the millennium is the period between Christ’s resurrection and His second coming."
(City of God, Book 20)

Augustine’s interpretation dominated Western Christianity for over a thousand years.

THE TRUTH OF THE WORD OF GOD! Not so sure it was built on Origen, but Augustine without question had the truth. His teachings of Revelation 20 is the best that I have ever seen by older writers, and even today men still teach the same truth that he did over sixteen hundred years ago.

Augustine’s interpretation dominated Western Christianity for over a thousand years.

It still does until this very hour! Latter day false prophets hate Augustine, but I see a man of God who had truth even when most did not see what he taught to be the truth. His teachings was the very reason why there was a Reformation period, that turned the world upside down and free men from the RCC/EOC strong hold they had on the world for many years. He was NOT part of the RCC that they try so hard to make him a part of them.

 

[DavidTree]

I can defend why I believe what I believe. Let's compare spiritual things w/ spiritual!

"But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Matthew 15:24

"These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Matthew 10:5-6

"But the Lord said unto him [Ananias], Go thy way: for he [Saul of Tarsus "aka" Paul] is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:" Acts 9:15

"For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:" Romans 11:13

"For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope... Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:" Romans 15:4; 8

We couldn't be under both the law & grace simultaneously, could we?

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Ephesians 2:8-9

"Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only... For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also." James 2:24; 6

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work." Romans 11:6

"For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." James 2:10

Peter, James, & John are the apostles of the circumcision, just as Jesus Christ was the minister unto the circumcision.
It doesn't mean we ignore the rest of the Bible. We're commanded to study, to rightly divide. This way, we can
understand God's manifold plan on how He'll reconcile both the earth & heavens back unto Himself.

The Synoptic Gospels are still Old Testament. If you place the Body of Christ there, you'd be placing us back under the law.

"But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?" Galatians 4:9

"Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more." 2 Corinthians 5:16

"But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus." Galatians 3:23-26

Actually, you're right, dwight. The apostle Paul dealt w/ a man who fits the criteria for what we know today as preterism.

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness. And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some." 2 Timothy 2:15-18

"This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare; Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck: Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme." 1 Timothy 1:18-20

The best way to know for sure is by looking at what the early church fathers believed.

Jerome wrote of Polycarp (On Illustrious Men,17):
"Polycarp, a disciple of the apostle John and by him ordained bishop of Smyrna, was the leader of all Asia,
where he saw and had as teachers some of the apostles and of those who had seen the Lord."

Irenaeus was a disciple of Polycarp. You can't get any closer to the horse's mouth than that.

“And therefore in the end when the Church is suddenly caught up from this, it is said, ‘There shall be tribulation such as has not been since the beginning, neither shall be.’ For this is the last contest of the righteous, in which, when they overcome, they are crowned with incorruption." Irenaeus, Against Heresies 5.29.1

“For Enoch, when he pleased God, was translated in the same body in which he did please Him, thus pointing out by anticipation the translation of the just. … Wherefore also the elders who were disciples of the apostles tell us that those who are translated are translated to … paradise … in which place also Paul the apostle, when he was caught up, heard unspeakable words … and that those who have been translated shall remain there until the consummation [the end], as a prelude to incorruptibility.” Irenaeus, Against Heresies 5.5.1

He's basically claiming that the apostles taught a Pre-Trib Rapture to men like Polycarp, & men like Polycarp taught Irenaeus.
But wait... there's more!

What the Early Church Fathers Said​

Given that John wrote the book of Revelation around 90–95 AD, here’s what some of the earliest Church Fathers had to say about the End Times:

1. Papias of Hierapolis (circa 70–155 AD)

Papias, a bishop and a disciple of John:

"There will be a period of a thousand years after the resurrection of the dead when the kingdom of Christ will be established in material form on this earth." (Fragments of Papias)

2. Tertullian (155–240 AD)

"We confess that a kingdom is promised to us upon the earth... after the resurrection, for a thousand years."
(Against Marcion, Book 3, Chapter 25)

3. Hippolytus (170–235 AD)

"When the times are fulfilled, and the ten horns spring from the beast in the last times, then Antichrist will appear among them... then may we expect the manifestation of the Lord from heaven." (Commentary on Daniel, 2.7)

4. Eusebius (260-339 AD)

"As all perished then except those gathered with Noah in the ark, so also at this coming, the ungodly in the season of apostasy shall perish. While according to the pattern of Noah, all the righteous and godly are to be separated from the ungodly and gathered into the heavenly ark. For in this way comes a time when not even one righteous man will be found among mankind and when all the ungodly have been made atheists by the antichrist, and the whole world is overcome by apostasy, the wrath of God shall come upon the ungodly." (Fragments on Luke (Luke 17:26, Migne 24.584-585)

5. Ephrem The Syrian (306–373 AD)

Sermon on Repentance and Judgment:

"For the elect shall be gathered prior to the tribulation, so they shall not see the confusion and the great tribulation coming upon the unrighteous world."

Sermon On the Fathers Who Have Completed Their Course:

"Behold, now the holy and the just are chosen and gathered into the harbor of life that they should not see the tribulation and the snares coming upon us because of our sins."

The Turning Point: Origen and Augustine​

A shift began with Origen (185–254 AD) and later Augustine (354–430 AD).

Origen introduced the idea that Scripture should be interpreted allegorically rather than literally. He argued that the prophecies about Christ's earthly reign symbolized spiritual truths rather than a future, physical event.

Augustine built on Origen’s teachings and helped establish amillennialism—the belief that the Millennium described in Revelation symbolizes the Church Age, not a future literal reign of Christ.

"The Church is the kingdom of Christ, and the millennium is the period between Christ’s resurrection and His second coming."
(City of God, Book 20)

Augustine’s interpretation dominated Western Christianity for over a thousand years.

A Pattern in History​

But what’s fascinating is that belief in the Millennium resurfaced in the 1600s and 1700s—well before Darby or modern dispensationalism.

Peter Jurieu (1687) wrote that Christ would return before the battle of Armageddon and rapture the saints.

Philip Doddridge (1738) and John Gill (1748) taught about a literal rapture and millennial reign.

So, What Does It Mean Today?​

That belief in a literal future millennium wasn’t an invention of modern Christianity; it was central to the teachings of some of the earliest Christians.

We don’t need to have every detail figured out. But we need to hold to what is clear:

• Christ will return.

• God will make all things new.

• His kingdom will reign forever.

The hope of Christ’s return and reign is secure.

The early Church Fathers understood this. So can we.

Actually, I originally was going to post that article under another thread in reponse to another who holds this view.
Instead, I felt it'd be more appropriate to post this article in an area regarding eschatology.

Now, as you were. My only intention was just to share the truth in love to clear up any confusion.

We KNOW that Christ is the Chief Cornerstone and Foundation of the Church with the OT Prophets and Apostles built upon Christ.

The other people you quoted are NOT the Church father's.

They may be the father's of the Catholocism or some other denomination = but they are NOT the Church father's

My only intention was just to share the truth in love to clear up any confusion.

SHALOM in the LORD Jesus Christ

 

[Selah]

Those who do not believe in a pre-trib rapture over look the fact that the church is not mentioned in Revelation chapters 4–18 because the have gone to be with Jesus.

Sure it is. Who is the church? It’s Christians.

It’s Christians (the Elect) who will be delivered into the synagogues of Satan (the man of sin who comes at the 6th trump). And it will be through Christians that the Holy Spirit will witness to the whole world. No one will have an excuse for not hearing the Gospel.

Mark 13:9-11 (KJV) 9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them. 10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations. 11 But when they shall lead [you], and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

selah

 

[FreeInChrist]

@dwight92070 @civic @Victoria @FreeInChrist @Jim @Amos @Angelo @Quintus5 @DavidTree

Please do not hold your breath, he makes many accusations, yet as of yet posted his first post in his own words what he believes and neither has he as of yet disproved any post that I have made.

I'am waiting for the first premillennialists to prove which comes first, Christ, or the man of sin. According to their teachings Christ comes first.

But they do not even know who is the man of sin/antichrist/abomination of desolation. Anyone?

2 Thes 2:4 gives a strong indication.

who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God.

 

[Selah]

2 Thes 2:4 gives a strong indication.

who opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being God.

Satan (the Antichrist, the Abomination of Desolation) is the “who”. …selah

 

[Angelo]

These ten events are the things we can expect in embryonic form in the days preceding the Pre-Tribulation Rapture and the beginning of the Tribulation. These ten things will continue to multiply and progress as the first three and one-half years of the Great Tribulation unfold.
• A Time of Deception—“Many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many” (Matthew 24:5).
• A Time of Dissension—“You will hear of wars and rumors of wars . . . Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom” (Matthew 24:6–7).
• A Time of Devastation—“There will be famines . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disease—“ . . . pestilences . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disasters—“ . . . and earthquakes in various places” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Death—“They will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake” (Matthew 24:9).
• A Time of Disloyalty—“Many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another” (Matthew 24:10).
• A Time of Delusion—“Many false prophets will rise up and deceive many” (Matthew 24:11). It should also be noted that part of the delusion will be an increase in drug use. One of the characteristics of the end times’ false religion will be what the book of Revelation calls “sorceries” (9:21). The word John uses is pharmakia, from which we get the word pharmacy. It is an ancient reference to the ingestion of drugs. The use of mind-altering substances such as narcotics and hallucinogens will be associated with false religions, doubtless with the approval of the government.
• A Time of Defection—“Because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold” (Matthew 24:12). People will turn away from God and from one another.
• A Time of Declaration—“This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations” (Matthew 24:14).


The Prophecy Answer Book

 

[Red Baker]

Revelation 13:1-7~"And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations."

I'll give a quick brief overview of "my" understanding of this chapter. As most should know, evil beasts are images in Scripture that often signify the carnal (fleshly), beastly, dangerous nature of man. It is sometimes used to signify evil Kingdoms or wicked carnal individuals.

Psalms 73:22

• "So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee."

It is my position that beasts are often used in Scripture to signify the animalistic flesh driven nature of man. Without Christ, man is as a creature or beast without conscience or wisdom, and like a beast his driving force is to get whatever it desires, to tear, to devour, without consideration for law. It is often used to represent kingdoms or individuals as a token of those who live by the flesh (carnal nature) rather than the Spirit of God's law. I also believe that Revelation chapter 13 uses this imagery to paint a portrait of the carnal kingdom of Satan, as well as the false prophets whom he empowers to devour. The carnal, rebellious, disobedient man ruled by Satan is the likness (image) of the beast.

Revelation 13:1-2

• "And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
• And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority."

Without going into too much detail, the sea often used in Scripture as a synonym for the deep, bottomless pit or abyss, the spiritual place where this evil spirit resides ready to be loosed upon man at any moment. The first beast is the body of the antichrist (his kingdom) that was wounded at Christ's death and resurrection. The heads in Scripture often signify authority, and the number 7 is the perfect number of completeness. Thus I believe that the 7 heads represent Satan's authority to rule as the prince of this world throughout time (7 mountains = 7 kingdoms). Horns in Scripture often signify the power of whatever is in view, as the horn that was broken in Daniel (meaning his power was broken). The number 10 signifies the fullness of whatever is in view. In this instance the 10 horns signify Satan's "Power" over men to rule for the fullness of this short period of time near the time of the end of the world. The fullness and rule of this period is also spoken of in Scripture as one hour. Thus these 10 horns rule (as kings) with the beast kingdom one hour, or a little season, which could be two hundred years or so as we shall soon see. And their crowns again illustrate they reign with him. i.e., crowns are for kings.

Revelation 17:12

• "And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast."

This also shows clearly that the first beast (with these 10 horns) spans the completeness (7) of time, and near the end of this time (the 1 hour of God's judgment) when the church the relgious part of spiritual Babylon, these 10 kings will reign with him for this short period (little season KJV) after Satan is loosed from the bottomless pit. The wound that was healed was the power of Satan to deceive the nations, which was before taken away (when Satan was bound) by Christ. At this time when Satan is loosed (the wound healed), he again goes out to gather together and deceive the nations to bring them up against the camp of the saints, not natural Israel.

Revelation 13:3

• "And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast."

Christ, of course, wounded him by the cross, and also looses the beast, or heals that wound, after all Israel (spiritual) are sealed. Satan is loosed so that He might bring judgment upon the unfaithful (spiritual harlot) church, called the great tribulation

Revelation 13:4-5

• "And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
• And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months."

Under the authority of Satan, these kings rule and go to make war against the camp of the saints (the church), it being judged of God for its abominations, after which is the return of Christ on the clouds of glory. Christ wounds and Christ heals that wound, to the glory of God.

Psalms 68:20-22

• "He that is our God is the God of salvation; and unto GOD the Lord belong the issues from death.
• But God shall wound the head of his enemies, and the hairy scalp of such an one as goeth on still in his trespasses.
• The Lord said, I will bring again from Bashan, I will bring my people again from the depths of the sea:"

Compare Revelation 17:8,11 of, "the beast that was, and is not, and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit." In other words, this is the Beast, this is the power of Satan as he brought Israel into apostasy, as Christ defeated him, and as he again ascends out of the bottomless pit to attack the church. Just as a ravenous beast would attack the sheep in a fold, so Satan comes as an adversary of the house of God. He was because He ruled before Christ bound him. He is not because Christ bound Him. And He ascends out of the Pit because Christ looses him.

And the ability to bring God's external church down was bound or restrained by Christ's binding Satan over 2000 years ago, but his loosing after the millennial reign allows this judgment, even as Israel was judged. Thus the Gentile congregation is no better than the Jewish one. Apostasy knows no bounds. The blasphemies that he speaks is his false teachings and contradictions forsaking the Word of God. These are the great things he speaks that deceive and which Revelation 13 talks about.

Revelation 13:6-7

• "And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
• And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations."

Same as Revelation 20 when Satan is loosed from the Pit to make war with the saints.

Revelation 13:8-9

• "And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
• If any man have an ear, let him hear."

All of those who aren't sealed of God in Israel worship the carnal, Pseudo or Antichrist instead of God. He has deceived them so that they serve him, thinking they do God service.

Revelation 13:10-11

• "He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
• And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

John sees another vision of a beast coming up from the earth. The earth signifies they come up from the world, and this beast has two horns like a lamb, but speaks as a dragon. This beast represents the false prophets. They come looking like they have the power of the messenger of light (horns signify power, the number two signifies the truthful witness of the church), but what gives them away is that they speak as the Dragon, which is Satan. In other words, they appear as a messenger of light, but their gospel is false and of the adversary Satan.

The first beast, who the false prophets cause men to worship, represents the antichrist, or more to the point Satan's substitute kingdom. It is the body of false worshipers. Revelation is written this way because just as the true church is represented by the body of Christ, and the Old Testament congregation by the body of Moses, the false congregation is seen as the body of the anti (substitute) or false Christ. The false prophets are those who cause the unfaithful to depart from Scripture and worship Him. All Israel who are not sealed unto the day of redemption, only the very elect among them.

Revelation 13:12-14

• "And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
• And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
• And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live."

The deadly wound was given the beast who is to be worshiped at the cross. Christ dealt the adversary a death wound so that he could not deceive the nations (and the church could be built), but at this time Satan is loosed from his prison. This is spoken of as the deadly wound being healed, and the reason is so that the unfaithful people of the world might again serve him (as judgment). The false prophets, the second beast, deceive the unfaithful people and seduce them into serving this antichrist kingdom by means of false miracles, signs and wonders. Remember, Christ was bound for the specific purpose of the nations not being deceived. Now that He is loosed, his false prophets again deceive the nations, in order to usher in the Lord's second coming.

Revelation 13:15-16

• " And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
• And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:"

The false prophets give life to the likeness of the Antichrist by propagating their false teachings, which leads to them overcoming the church and causing all the faithful therein (the two witnesses) to be killed. Those remaining as a judgment of God are said to be marked on their hand (not literally as some suppose, but spiritually) signifying their will belongs to them, and in their forehead, signifying their mind is sold out to Satan. (our next post will cover this point) Just as a cow is branded or marked to signify ownership, so this signifies these unsealed are slaves to the antichrist.

Revelation 13:17-18

• "And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
• Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."

The buying and selling signify being able to move freely within the false churches of the last days and no one can work there except those who have been spiritually marked slaves of Satan. The mark God tells us is 666, the number of man, a man void of the Spirit of God. A true man of God would not be able to even get close to a pulpit in most churches!

The mark of the beast, next.

 

[DavidTree]

These ten events are the things we can expect in embryonic form in the days preceding the Pre-Tribulation Rapture and the beginning of the Tribulation. These ten things will continue to multiply and progress as the first three and one-half years of the Great Tribulation unfold.
• A Time of Deception—“Many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many” (Matthew 24:5).
• A Time of Dissension—“You will hear of wars and rumors of wars . . . Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom” (Matthew 24:6–7).
• A Time of Devastation—“There will be famines . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disease—“ . . . pestilences . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disasters—“ . . . and earthquakes in various places” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Death—“They will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake” (Matthew 24:9).
• A Time of Disloyalty—“Many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another” (Matthew 24:10).
• A Time of Delusion—“Many false prophets will rise up and deceive many” (Matthew 24:11). It should also be noted that part of the delusion will be an increase in drug use. One of the characteristics of the end times’ false religion will be what the book of Revelation calls “sorceries” (9:21). The word John uses is pharmakia, from which we get the word pharmacy. It is an ancient reference to the ingestion of drugs. The use of mind-altering substances such as narcotics and hallucinogens will be associated with false religions, doubtless with the approval of the government.
• A Time of Defection—“Because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold” (Matthew 24:12). People will turn away from God and from one another.
• A Time of Declaration—“This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations” (Matthew 24:14).


The Prophecy Answer Book

Good Morning @Angelo,

All that you listed below is TRUTH

• A Time of Deception—“Many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many” (Matthew 24:5).

• A Time of Dissension—“You will hear of wars and rumors of wars . . . Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom” (Matthew 24:6–7).
• A Time of Devastation—“There will be famines . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disease—“ . . . pestilences . . .” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Disasters—“ . . . and earthquakes in various places” (Matthew 24:7).
• A Time of Death—“They will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake” (Matthew 24:9).
• A Time of Disloyalty—“Many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another” (Matthew 24:10).
• A Time of Delusion—“Many false prophets will rise up and deceive many” (Matthew 24:11). It should also be noted that part of the delusion will be an increase in drug use. One of the characteristics of the end times’ false religion will be what the book of Revelation calls “sorceries” (9:21). The word John uses is pharmakia, from which we get the word pharmacy. It is an ancient reference to the ingestion of drugs. The use of mind-altering substances such as narcotics and hallucinogens will be associated with false religions, doubtless with the approval of the government.
• A Time of Defection—“Because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold” (Matthew 24:12). People will turn away from God and from one another.
• A Time of Declaration—“This gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations” (Matthew 24:14).

the LORD JESUS CHRIST gave to us His commandment of Love, which is to only believe His words

TRUTH = “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

pre-trib rapture is a LIE and Christ does not want you adding to His words or taking away from His words

Any opposition to these words of Christ is a lie from satan's mouth to your ears and heart

Example: Satan says to the churches: "Did Christ really say He is coming after the Tribulation?"

 

[FreeInChrist]

Satan (the Antichrist, the Abomination of Desolation) is the “who”. …selah

Do I have a name or an identifiable ID for the anti-christ such as "The Pope" of which some of you that I know to be so....NO

But I personally believe the anti-Christ will be Jewish... and we shall know who , or what, once the 3rd temple is completed.

 

[FreeInChrist]

@FreeInChrist

Go back and look again, I was quoting what @dwight92070 had said, even if I tagged it to civic. I know what civic is a very confused person in the Premillennialism camp. The camp I once was part of when I first came to Christ, but it took me less than two to three years to see through that mess. I was taught by the very best of those in that camp, so I know their teaching inside and out, maybe better than many of them.

you do not believe Rev 20: 1-6


20 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

That these verses suggest that Christ's Second Coming will precede a period of peace and righteousness on Earth where

Jesus will physically return to Earth and that this event marks the beginning of the Millennium.

No surprise there because in the years I have known you I rarely have found anything that tells one what you do believe other then you are not a Calvenist, but lean toward those teachings re-predestination. Which is your choice.

 

[DavidTree]

Do I have a name or an identifiable ID for the anti-christ such as "The Pope" of which some of you that I know to be so....NO

But I personally believe the anti-Christ will be Jewish... and we shall know who , or what, once the 3rd temple is completed.

candidate for AC = Jared Kushner

 

[FreeInChrist]

candidate for AC = Jared Kushner

I could almost make a case for that, but why do you suggest him?

 

[Angelo]

I believe the Tribulation is a natural consequence of the Pre-turbulation Rapture. You may think the world today is degenerating into rampant greed and immorality, and indeed it is. When all Christians are removed from the earth, the restraining ministry of the Holy Spirit will be completely absent. The result will be horrific.

Jesus Himself described what will happen next: “For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved” Matthew 24:21–22

.

 

[DavidTree]

I believe the Tribulation is a natural consequence of the Pre-turbulation Rapture. You may think the world today is degenerating into rampant greed and immorality, and indeed it is. When all Christians are removed from the earth, the restraining ministry of the Holy Spirit will be completely absent. The result will be horrific.

Jesus Himself described what will happen next: “For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved” Matthew 24:21–22

.

Dear @Angelo

i am so grateful that you posted another TRUTH from the Mouth of God to our ears and heart!!! - Matthew 24:21-22

LORD Jesus Christ says: For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be.
And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved;
but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

JESUS says His Elect is on earth during the Tribulation and that HE shortened the days just for His Elect(Saints/Bride/Church).

Protect your heart = Any opposition to these words of Christ is a lie from satan's mouth to your ears and heart

 

[FreeInChrist]

I believe the Tribulation is a natural consequence of the Pre-turbulation Rapture. You may think the world today is degenerating into rampant greed and immorality, and indeed it is. When all Christians are removed from the earth, the restraining ministry of the Holy Spirit will be completely absent. The result will be horrific.

Jesus Himself described what will happen next: “For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved” Matthew 24:21–22

.

Okay, But I do not see a pre-trib rapture.

21 For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will.

22 Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.

If there is a pre-trib rapture.... who are these elect that cause the days to be shortened?

I see, at best a mid-trib where we are pulled out before the worst comes to pass.

We are told... the mark of the beast will be at that 3 1/2 year point. So the only way that can be avoided is for us to be gone.

If we go at the beginning, then the "elect" at the mid point ( which I believe are those who come to Christ as all hell is breaking loose around them) that would be a double rapture and no on ever suggested that. It says elect for the days to be cut short and
that has to be all of us.

Just my opinion

 

[DavidTree]

Okay, But I do not see a pre-trib rapture.

21 For then there will be a great tribulation, such as has not occurred since the beginning of the world until now, nor ever will.

22 Unless those days had been cut short, no life would have been saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short.

If there is a pre-trib rapture.... who are these elect that cause the days to be shortened?

I see, at best a mid-trib where we are pulled out before the worst comes to pass.

We are told... the mark of the beast will be at that 3 1/2 year point. So the only way that can be avoided is for us to be gone.

If we go at the beginning, then the "elect" at the mid point ( which I believe are those who come to Christ as all hell is breaking loose around them) that would be a double rapture and no on ever suggested that. It says elect for the days to be cut short and
that has to be all of us.

Just my opinion

This is not "just your opinion", for you correctly stated the Truth spoken by Christ and the Apostles.

Never second guess the words of Christ for that is the devils playground.

Stay STRONG in the WORD of LIFE = LORD Jesus Christ

 

[Angelo]

Christians will defiantly escape the seven-year nightmare of the Tribulation.

I believe the Bible clearly teaches that one of the coming great events in the fulfillment of prophecy concerns the Church. This is the personal, bodily return of the Lord in the air to remove His waiting Church from the earth and to reward them according to their works. This will take place before the Tribulation period during which time the judgments of God will be poured out upon the unbelieving world.

I believe there are a lot of Scriptures to support the imminent return of Christ for His Church prior to the Tribulation than during or after it: 1 Thessalonians 4:13– 18; 2 Thessalonians 2:8–12; 1 Thessalonians 1:10, 5:9.

“Those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the heavens, and those who lead many to righteousness, like the stars for ever and ever” (Daniel 12:3 NIV). In the midst of all the difficult times, the horror of the Tribulation, God has some special things that He has reserved for those who serve Him. He says they are to become like stars in His galaxy!
The Handwriting on the Wall