Things that accompany Christ

[brightfame52]

If Christ died for us, its a fact that by His death alone, He obtained eternal redemption for us Heb 9:12

Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Now thats fact, The word redemption here lutrósis:

a ransoming, redemption: deliverance, redemption,

redemption from the penalty of sin: Hebrews 9:12.

This redemption is eternal,

Hence , the us for whom He died have been eternally delivered from the penalty of their sin, even as unbelievers because

Christ has taken their punishment upon Himself, therefore God will be to them merciful Heb 8:12

For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

Their iniquities having been satisfied by Christ Isa 53

5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

The sins of the elect have been paid in full by Christ, and His Righteousness is now charged to them by grace!

All this legality is true fact even before the elect become believers.

 

[brightfame52]

He died for them who were not ever appointed to wrath, His Wrath as in Jn 3:36

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Or like here Eph 5:6

Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
However His death for them was so that they obtain Salvation 1 Thess 5:9-10

9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

Everyone He died for was so they obtain Salvation, that accompanies Christ !

 

[Kampioen]

If Christ died for us, its a fact that by His death alone, He obtained eternal redemption for us Heb 9:12

By His death alone yes but God wants to see our faith in His death too.

Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Yes. Effectual after faith.

Now thats fact, The word redemption here lutrósis: a ransoming, redemption: deliverance, redemption, redemption from the penalty of sin: Hebrews 9:12.

This redemption is eternal, Hence , the us for whom He died have been eternally delivered from the penalty of their sin, even as unbelievers because

Not as unbelievers. But Christ's death opens access to God in time to all ie to the elect and non-elect, so that they might all believe. Believers then are chosen as the elect, but eternally foreknown.

Christ has taken their punishment upon Himself, therefore God will be to them merciful

Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. Their iniquities having been satisfied by Christ

Isa 53 5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

The sins of the elect have been paid in full by Christ, and His Righteousness is now charged to them by grace!

Yes, His righteousness is effectually charged/credited/gifted only to those who libertarianly have faith, and those credited ones are the elect.

All this legality is true fact even before the elect become believers.

No. The pre-believers are not legally elect yet, but are called elect in name only based on foreknowledge of legally being elect.

 

[brightfame52]

By His death alone yes but God wants to see our faith in His death too.

False

Yes. Effectual after faith.

False

Not as unbelievers.

False

 

[Kampioen]

False
False
False

No answer?

Faith is not counted as works. But even many of the Calvinists mostly know nothing of
Predetermination when repenting, until later.

And even some Arminians who believe Calvinism is heresy, are according to you unconditionally predetermined/scripted by God to believe scripture that way lest any man should boast. Who are you to argue against God to say they are wrong?

Romans 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

So whether faith is works or not, God counts it as righteousness.

So whether faith is of ourselves, the counting as righteousness is not, ie the counting is the gift/graced of God, not of yourselves or of works, lest any man should boast. ...

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[brightfame52]

No answer?

lol yeah false

 

[brightfame52]

Dead to sin !

When Christ died for the elect, with that death and in the legal sense, all the elect became dead to sin, yes before they believed. Rom 6:2,11

God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Now understand this is a legal death, in that sin because it has been charged to Christ for its debt to be paid, sin therefor cannot be imputed or charged to the debt of the elect sinner, hence dead to sin 2 Cor 5:19, they are dead to sin as to its condemnation power over them Rom 8:33. they have been discharged from the penalty of sin altogether, its damning power can never hurt them, they're discharged from the second death for sin, it is crucified, abolished, and made an end of by Christ, Now all this is legally true fact even while the elect person is dead in sin.

 

[brightfame52]

The world Jesus Christ died for, He took its sin away Jn 1:29

29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world [Jew and Gentile].

 

[FreeInChrist]

Yes it causes them to repent, its indicated in the lexicon as well. The word give didōm:
b. the noun denotes something to be done by him to whom it is said to be given: διδόναι τινὶ μετάνοιαν, to cause him to repent, Acts 5:31; Acts 11:18; γνῶσιν https://www.blueletterbible.org/lexicon/g1325/kjv/tr/0-1/

Ah, another works example. No matter how it comes to be if you do it it is works... unless you have free will

 

[brightfame52]

Christs Death delivers the elect from the hands of their enemies Lk 1:69-75

69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;

70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:

71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;

72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,

74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.

Now Death is an enemy, Paul writing of physical death calls it an enemy here 1 Cor 15:26

The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

But frankly all death is an enemy to Gods elect, even spiritual death in sins. Rom 6:23

23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

But death cant separate the Love of God in Christ Jesus from Gods elect Rom 8:38-39

38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,

39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

So therefore its an guaranteed that the elect while even dead in sin, shall be quickened to spiritual life because of Gods Great Love and the death of Christ Eph 2:3-5

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

So when quickened from the spiritual dead, we may serve God without fear in holiness and righteousness before Him, all the days of our life.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Dead to sin !

When Christ died for the elect, with that death and in the legal sense, all the elect became dead to sin, yes before they believed. Rom 6:2,11

God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Now understand this is a legal death, in that sin because it has been charged to Christ for its debt to be paid, sin therefor cannot be imputed or charged to the debt of the elect sinner, hence dead to sin 2 Cor 5:19, they are dead to sin as to its condemnation power over them Rom 8:33. they have been discharged from the penalty of sin altogether, its damning power can never hurt them, they're discharged from the second death for sin, it is crucified, abolished, and made an end of by Christ, Now all this is legally true fact even while the elect person is dead in sin.

Luke 1:69–75 is about what God provides in Christ, not about people being saved before they believe. You’re placing people in the ‘delivered’ category before Scripture ever does , IOW the Bible puts that after faith, not before it.”

“Where does Luke 1 say anyone is delivered from sin before believing?”
“Dead to sin, indeed! Not. You’re claiming all the elect were made dead to sin at the cross before believing, but Romans 6 speaks to those already united with Christ. Scripture shows that union happens through faith , not before it. Otherwise, you’ve got people ‘dead to sin’ while still being ‘dead in sin’ and ‘children of wrath’ (Eph 2:1–3), which is a contradiction.”

 

[brightfame52]

Luke 1:69–75 is about what God provides in Christ,

Yes Salvation from death and sin [spiritual enemies], and then causes fear and serving God

 

[brightfame52]

Even before the elect are ever born, and before they believe, they have redemption and the forgiveness of sins on Gods record books, because of the blood of Christ and the riches of His Grace Eph 1:7

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
That word redemption is the greek word apolytrōsis:

1. a releasing effected by payment of ransom
   
   1. redemption, deliverance
   2. liberation procured by the payment of a ransom

2. everywhere in the N. T. metaphorically, viz. deliverance effected through the death of Christ from the retributive wrath of a holy God and the merited penalty of sin: Romans 3:24; Ephesians 1:7; Colossians 1:14

So as well the elect are born, through the death of Christ, delivered from the retributive wrath of God which their sins merited and its penalty.

 

[brightfame52]

Blessings that accompany the Death of Christ are twofold,

Both Legal and practical/Spiritual

1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

#1 his baring our sins causes us if He died for us, to be dead to sin and the law [see Rom 7:4]

This is legal first and foremost, the elect by means of the substitutionary death of Christ, have died to sin and its legal condemnation, its penalty, sin shall never be charged or imputed to them for their condemnation see 2 Cor 5:19 and Rom 4:7-8;

and secondly the blessing is they will be made dead to the power of sin, so they will no longer be a slave spiritually to it, this is when they are able to become servants of righteousness, obedient believers as in Rom 6:17-18

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.

Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Becoming a servant of righteousness is simply being made a believer in Christ and His Righteousness for us

Now these two blessings accompany Christ !

 

[brightfame52]

If Christ died for us these things follow according to Rom 4:22-25

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.

23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him;

24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

The imputation of righteousness, the Gift of Faith to believe in Him, Justification

These are the consequences of His having been delivered up for our offences. Thats why also Abraham believed in Him

 

[brightfame52]

Made us Dead to the Law !

Everyone Christ died for, His Death for them alonce made them legally dead to the Law Rom 7:4
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Now ye become dead is the greek word ἐθανατώθητε and means:

1. to put to death
2. metaph.
   1. to make to die i.e. destroy, render extinct
   2. by death to be liberated from the bond of anything, literally to be made dead in relation to (something)

Also the phrase is aorist passive indicative, this happened to them in the past and now its a state of fact.

Now how did this happen ? Was it by their Faith or believing ? No, it was by the Body of Christ, meaning His death. Now one of the purposes for which it was done, so that they would be spiritually united to Christ to bring forth fruit unto God. However their severance from the Law was prior by His death. Any and all sinners He died for, are born into this world legally dead to the law of God, it has no power to condemn them or demand obedience from them to be in a right relationship with God, thanks to the body of Christ.

 

[brightfame52]

For all whom Christ died, He as their Surety representative, condemned sin in the flesh Rom 8:3

3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: Hence no sin that the elect commits against the Law of God can condemn them.

This correlates with the fact stated earlier in Rom 7:4

4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

This is why no charge can be laid to the elect Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

See that ? Christ has already handled every charge of sin that could be lodged against Gods elect, they were all condemned in Him in His death for them !

Barnes writes :

(By the sacrifice of Christ, God indeed showed his abhorrence of sin, and secured its final overthrow. It is not, however, of the sanctifying influence of this sacrifice, that the apostle seems here to speak, but of its justifying power. The sense, therefore, is that God passed a judicial sentence on sin, in the person of Christ, on account of which, that has been effected which the Law could not effect, (justification namely). Sin being condemned in the human nature of Christ, cannot be condemned and punished in the persons of those represented by him. They must be justified.https://biblehub.com/commentaries/romans/8-3.htm

I agree with Barnes on this particular point !

 

[civic]

Men are in Christ when they believe

Ephesians 1:13 (KJV 1900) — 13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Exactly and he is talking about believers and to believers, not anyone in a state of unbelief, unsaved.

 

[brightfame52]

Shall be made alive to righteousness !

Them Christ died for, and died to the law, shall sooner or later be made alive to righteousness, that's an end and accomplishment of His death 1 Pet 2:24

Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

They shall experience Gods Gift of eternal life Rom 6:23

23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

So this guarantees the New Birth to meet this objective !

 

[brightfame52]

Obedience to the Gospel

Christs Death for one will cause them to obey Him through the Gospel. Heb 5:9

9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

The Salvation He authored bestows obedience, hence, obeying Him is the fruit of His Salvation He authored by being made perfect.

Those obeying are His Seed Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

If one never comes to obeying, submitting to Christ evangelically, He didn't die for them.

The word obey in Heb 5:9 is the same greek word for obey here Rom 6:17

But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.