The Eternal Son

[DavidTree]

That they have to be prophetic to fit in the framework you already assume...

Most of the references to the Divine Savior coming to earth are OT Prophecies

What we are seeking is a declaration of a "eternally begotten Son"

@civic is assuming a "eternally begotten Son"

We(@DavidTree @civic and yourself) are only permitted to embrace the Scripture that declares this.

 

[Dizerner]

What we are seeking is a declaration of a "eternally begotten Son"

I would say this is the "must be stated in one specific way and never deduced" fallacy.

Or the "over-exact and direct phrasing" fallacy.

We do not have a verse "God is a Trinity" or "Jesus is God" or "pedophilia is a sin" or "Jesus took God's wrath."

Many truths can simply be deduced from Scripture instead of stated in the most direct fashion.

 

[DavidTree]

I would say this is the "must be stated in one specific way and never deduced" fallacy.

Or the "over-exact and direct phrasing" fallacy.

We do not have a verse "God is a Trinity" or "Jesus is God" or "pedophilia is a sin" or "Jesus took God's wrath."

Many truths can simply be deduced from Scripture instead of stated in the most direct fashion.

i am GLAD you brought up "presupposition"

The phrase "eternally begotten Son" is a presupposition.

It must be found in Scripture AND the wording is from God and HE knows how to Declare Truth

If it is Truth = it is GUARANTEED to be in the Scripture = both OT and NT

Example: the Bride of Christ is Prophesied in the OT but She is Betrothed only in the NT

 

[praise_yeshua]

Most of the references to the Divine Savior coming to earth are OT Prophecies

What we are seeking is a declaration of a "eternally begotten Son"

@civic is assuming a "eternally begotten Son"

We(@DavidTree @civic and yourself) are only permitted to embrace the Scripture that declares this.

I believe you misunderstand based upon how you understand and apply "begotten".

Also, "begotten" is only referenced once in the OP and doesn't match your assessment of "requirements".

 

[praise_yeshua]

Example: the Bride of Christ is Prophesied in the OT but She is Betrothed only in the NT

The Bride was betrothed before the foundation of the world. The bride is veiled to humanity.

 

[DavidTree]

I believe you misunderstand based upon how you understand and apply "begotten".

only begotten Son is only in the Incarnation = NT

Now, civic claims that JESUS is the only begotten Son from Eternity

We are looking for that Declaration

So far, only prophecies are being posted

Furthermore Post 204 comes into play as Genesis Dictates

The fact that the OT speaks of the Coming MESSIAH who is born of a virgin validates Prophecy of a only begotten Son

 

[civic]

Most of the references to the Divine Savior coming to earth are OT Prophecies

What we are seeking is a declaration of a "eternally begotten Son"

@civic is assuming a "eternally begotten Son"

We(@DavidTree @civic and yourself) are only permitted to embrace the Scripture that declares this.

No I’m saying an Eternal Son.

You are adding in the begotten part as if there is a beginning point.

 

[DavidTree]

The Bride was betrothed before the foundation of the world. The bride is veiled to humanity.

Please post the scripture

Eph ch2 ???

 

[DavidTree]

No I’m saying an Eternal Son.

You are adding in the begotten part as if there is a beginning point.

We know who the Son is = Incarnation = Jesus the Christ= the Word that was God

Therefore we know that Jesus Christ as the Son of God is Eternal but NOT in His flesh.

Today HE is Eternal in His Body for HE Resurrected from the Grave and Ascended

We are looking to Eternity BEFORE the Incarnation to SEE the Declaration of a "Eternal Son"

 

[DavidTree]

No I’m saying an Eternal Son.

You are adding in the begotten part as if there is a beginning point.

Is there a difference between Eternal Son and Eternally begotten Son???

 

[DavidTree]

I believe you misunderstand based upon how you understand and apply "begotten".

OP

If Jesus was not God. how did he take the sin of the world?

All that was required was a sinless man.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Please post the scripture

Eph ch2 ???

What do you see in "betrothal"? It is a promise associated with a commitment from the Groom.

Tit 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

 

[DavidTree]

What do you see in "betrothal"? It is a promise associated with a commitment from the Groom.

Tit 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

promised before the world began

JESUS/the Lamb was promised before the world began

A promise from God is a Prophecy until the Promise becomes Fulfilled

 

[praise_yeshua]

Is there a difference between Eternal Son and Eternally begotten Son???

Not in the Person of the Holy Trinity. However, there is a change that took place relative to manifestation. The bodily form of Christ changed.

 

[praise_yeshua]

promised before the world began

JESUS/the Lamb was promised before the world began

A promise from God is a Prophecy until the Promise becomes Fulfilled

Life in the Bride. No life, No Bride. No Bride, No Life.

 

[DavidTree]

Not in the Person of the Holy Trinity. However, there is a change that took place relative to manifestation. The bodily form of Christ changed.

Elohim is first declared in Gen 1:1

We know that Elohim had a Counsel Meeting between Themselves prior to Creation

We are not told When

Genesis is our first exposure to the Counsel of Elohim - and all the prophecies that follow

 

[Red Baker]

@praise_yeshua

That is where you're wrong. There is no context of God without humility. Humility is part of condescending but in the manner in which you present it.

Even trying to reason with him is almost impossbile. God needs no humility, period! Only the Son of God, as a man, taught us true humility being the express image of His Father in the flesh. But, God whose is a Spirit, is perfect in all of His ways, and lacks not one thing, and humility is not something He needs to do, for all of His ways are perfect, glorious, beyond our powers to comphrend .

 

[Red Baker]

@DavidTree

What presuppositions?

David, you will never be able to reason with him, (unless you agree with him and then he will become a freind to you, maybe) he's one confused person, who truly desires to join the RCC, (his own words) yet it would reveal too much about him, that he does not desire for others to know.

 

[DavidTree]

@DavidTree

David, you will never be able to reaosn with him, he's one confused person, who truly desires to join the RCC, (his own words) yet it would reveal too much about him, that he does not desire for others to know.

Anyone who desires to be part of the RCC either has not been Baptized in the Holy Spirit
or
lacks understanding in the Scriptures

i know for i am a RCC raised and confirmed member before the LORD saved me at the age of 23

 

[DavidTree]

I would say this is the "must be stated in one specific way and never deduced" fallacy.

Or the "over-exact and direct phrasing" fallacy.

We do not have a verse "God is a Trinity" or "Jesus is God" or "pedophilia is a sin" or "Jesus took God's wrath."

Many truths can simply be deduced from Scripture instead of stated in the most direct fashion.

We do not have a verse "God is a Trinity" or "Jesus is God" or "pedophilia is a sin" or "Jesus took God's wrath."

We have a TON of scripture that declares Elohim is Plural and THREE

We have clear scripture, when applying all scripture, that declares Jesus is God

We have scripture declaring that any sexual relationship outside of Marriage is sin.

We have scripture declaring that 12 is the minimum age of entering young adulthood = how old was Mary???

Not all but many of Today's laws are built off of Scripture as a Source of wisdom and guidance.

We can find the "Eternal Son" Declaration(s) IF we find and post them = most are prophecy of the Incarnation

There is Room for Discovery here from the Scriptures = let's get at it and Please God