James White affirms Libertarian Free Will.

[brightfame52]

I am not a huge fan of Wesley's "prevenient grace" where God overturns "original sin" and "Total Inability" to make all people without exception capable of "libertarian" (free from all external influence) "free will". I do not see ANY scripture that supports that as a "doctrine".

Correct, scripture is clear grace in salvation makes alive Eph 2:5

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

 

[AaronH]

What a woefully dark view of God Calvinists have! I'm so thankful that it happens to not be true, but I do feel sorry for both them and those unbelievers whose only exposure to Christianity is the Calvinist version of it.

 

[atpollard]

What a woefully dark view of God Calvinists have! I'm so thankful that it happens to not be true, but I do feel sorry for both them and those unbelievers whose only exposure to Christianity is the Calvinist version of it.

The lack of scriptural support in your "taint so" is duly noted. For the record, I am a "Sola Scriptura" Baptist who derives no pleasure from the "Doctrines of Grace" (TULIP) - [I refuse to call something written by the Synod of Dort after John Calvin was already dead 'Calvinism' just because the powerful Lutheran State Church gave it that name as an insult]. I would gladly embrace Wesleyan Arminianism, but for the fact that Scripture does not affirm what John Wesley and Billy Graham - both Godly men as far as I can tell - assert: There is no call to "invite God into your heart" and God has no need of anyone's "permission" to be God.

Romans 9:14-18 [NKJV]

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.​

Ephesians 2:8-10 [NKJV]

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.​

Contrary to your OPINIONS, scripture teaches that it is ...

• NOT of your will
• NOT of your running
• NOT of yourself

It is ...

• GOD who has mercy
• whomever GOD wills
• GOD's gift
• GOD's workmanship

That is not a "Calvinist" thing, that is a MONERGIST thing ... a BIBLICAL thing.
So, stop trying to sit in God's seat.

 

[AaronH]

Romans 9:14-18 [NKJV]
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.

Ephesians 2:8-10 [NKJV]
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

The lack of scriptural support in your "taint so" is duly noted. For the record, I am a "Sola Scriptura" Baptist who derives no pleasure from the "Doctrines of Grace" (TULIP) - [I refuse to call something written by the Synod of Dort after John Calvin was already dead 'Calvinism' just because the powerful Lutheran State Church gave it that name as an insult]. I would gladly embrace Wesleyan Arminianism, but for the fact that Scripture does not affirm what John Wesley and Billy Graham - both Godly men as far as I can tell - assert: There is no call to "invite God into your heart" and God has no need of anyone's "permission" to be God.

Romans 9:14-18 [NKJV]

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? Certainly not! 15 For He says to Moses, "I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whomever I will have compassion." 16 So then it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to the Pharaoh, "For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I may show My power in you, and that My name may be declared in all the earth." 18 Therefore He has mercy on whom He wills, and whom He wills He hardens.​

Ephesians 2:8-10 [NKJV]

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.​

Contrary to your OPINIONS, scripture teaches that it is ...

• NOT of your will
• NOT of your running
• NOT of yourself

It is ...

• GOD who has mercy
• whomever GOD wills
• GOD's gift
• GOD's workmanship

That is not a "Calvinist" thing, that is a MONERGIST thing ... a BIBLICAL thing.
So, stop trying to sit in God's seat.

But Pollard, as you probably know there are answers for those scriptures that don't involve God forcefeeding faith to some and irreversibly withholding it from others. Those scriptures do not say that God does all this with no criterion whatsoever. He is the author of salvation, of course (not one Christian denies that).

I could fire off several scriptures that seem to preclude [whatever your preferred term for Calvinism is], and maybe I will, but for now I'll just ask.

If God foreordains everything that comes to pass, why does he sometimes get angry at people for doing that which he foreordained, and how is it that he sometimes changes his mind? See Exodus 32:7-14 for an example of each.

 

[atpollard]

If God foreordains everything that comes to pass, why does he sometimes get angry at people for doing that which he foreordained, and how is it that he sometimes changes his mind? See Exodus 32:7-14 for an example of each.

How can anything come to pass that an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent God did not foreordain?
Does God say "Oops, I didn't mean for THAT to happen."?

 

[FreeInChrist]

Someone tells us the gospel and we are told to believe it.

But if I might add a wee comment to this:

Someone tells us the gospel, and we either believe what they say or deny what they say. In other words, we choose.

If there were no real choice involved, then calls to repent, believe, obey, and come to Christ would be meaningless. Scripture consistently addresses people as responsible responders, not as stones being pushed downhill.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Rom 5 is all about the elect

The elect are those who place their faith in Jesus Christ for redemption.

In Scripture, the elect are believers, those who are in Christ through faith.

Nowhere does Scripture describe the elect as unbelievers marked out while remaining outside Christ. The elect are those found in Christ through faith.

 

[brightfame52]

The elect are those who place their faith in Jesus Christ for redemption.

In Scripture, the elect are believers, those who are in Christ through faith.

Nowhere does Scripture describe the elect as unbelievers marked out while remaining outside Christ. The elect are those found in Christ through faith.

Again Romans 5 is about the elect.