Isaiah 53:5 The chastisement of our peace was upon Him

[praise_yeshua]

That's just completely untrue.

He rejected EDD and believed in LWF.

Saying this makes me lose respect for your integrity.

He is correct. The arguments that he had against Calvinism were largely procedural. This why some seasoned Calvinists over the years have sought to downplay the differences.

Calvinists agree with Provisionists that the Tirnity exists.

This doesn't prove anything—it's not like a point of agreement means two things are identical.

It's a non sequitur.

It doesn't? He never claimed they were identical?

Do you know how few of those that claim to be "Calvinist" actually know Calvinism? Do you know how many Calvinists disagree with one another? Do they deny the connection?

 

[Diserner]

no as Romans 1 declares God is self evident to even the reprobate.

You realize I'm sure that self-evident doesn't mean you respond to the truth righteously.

That's a fallacy.

Assuming Romans 1 really means what you want to mean here, which is debatable.

 

[civic]

He is correct. The arguments that he had against Calvinism were largely procedural. This why some seasoned Calvinists over the years have sought to downplay the differences.




It doesn't? He never claimed they were identical?

Do you know how few of those that claim to be "Calvinist" actually know Calvinism? Do you know how many Calvinists disagree with one another? Do they deny the connection?

Your last paragraph is so true. There are so many different views with today’s Calvinist vs those during the reformation period. What usual happens when challenged by most is the response : I don’t follow Calvin. Then my response is then stop calling yourself one

It’s why after leaving Calvinism I call myself a Christian- a follower of Christ.

 

[praise_yeshua]

You realize I'm sure that self-evident doesn't mean you respond to the truth righteously.

That's a fallacy.

Assuming Romans 1 really means what you want to mean here, which is debatable.

There is no debate....


Rom 1:21 For although they knew God, they did not glorify him as God or give him thanks, but they became futile in their thoughts and their senseless hearts were darkened.
Rom 1:22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools

 

[praise_yeshua]

Your last paragraph is so true. There are so many different views with today’s Calvinist vs those during the reformation period. What usual happens when challenged by most is the response : I don’t follow Calvin. Then my response is then stop calling yourself one

It’s why after leaving Calvinism I call myself a Christian- a follower of Christ.

If it was good enough for Peter, then it good enough for everyone...

1Pe 4:16 Yet if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, but let him glorify God in that name.

 

[Diserner]

You cannot accept LFW and be a Calvinist.

Like, definitionally.

 

[civic]

You cannot accept LFW and be a Calvinist.

Like, definitionally.

Leighton Flowers Website

 

[Diserner]

Leighton Flowers Website

Yes, and Leighton fully admits that Jacobus Arminius was not a Calvinist.

Please accept his opinion.

 

[Johann]

Yes, and Leighton fully admits that Jacobus Arminius was not a Calvinist.

Please accept his opinion.

Not a opinion

Jacobus Arminius (born October 10, 1560, Oudewater, Netherlands—died October 19, 1609, Leiden) was a theologian and minister of the Dutch Reformed Church who opposed the strict Calvinist teaching on predestination and who developed in reaction a theological system known later as Arminianism.

 

[TomL]

by man not God.


Acts 2:23
this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.

Acts 2:36
“Therefore, let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah.”

Acts 4:10- Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole…

Acts 5:30- The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree

Matthew 16:21
From that time on Jesus began to show His disciples that He must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things at the hands of the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and on the third day be raised to life

Matthew 20:18-19
“We are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and the teachers of the law. They will condemn him to death and will deliver Him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified. And on the third day He will be raised to life."

Matthew 27:1- When the morning was come, all the chief priests and elders of the people took counsel against Jesus to put him to death:

Matthew 27:35- When they had crucified Him, they divided up His garments by casting lots.

Mark 15:24- And they crucified Him. They also divided His garments by casting lots to decide what each of them would take

hope this helps !!!

Yes we considered him

Isaiah 53:4–5 (KJV 1900) — 4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, And carried our sorrows: Yet we did esteem him stricken,

I've read the Scriptures. I don't see God with the hammer nor God with the spear......

You need to realize that the Incarnation is all about God (In Christ) joining in the experience of humanity.

We see Christ throughout His life gradually experience all that it means to be human. As He faced the Cross you find Him submitting to humanity when He speaks of the shame He must face. Submitting to the government. The rulers of this world in the manner of death He must face. Submitting to MEN....... It is why Jesus was Crucified instead of stoned to death.

Just as we experience ourselves. Submitting to governance and trials none of us want to face. Evils that come from this world's governmental systems and

Eph_6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Christ SUBMITTED to this.

Don't make this about God's supposed actions in "killing Christ". God's actions was SUBMISSION.

It is why Jesus was Crucified instead of stoned to death.

Hebrews 2:14–18 (KJV 1900) — 14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. 16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. 17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people. 18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

 

[TomL]

Yes, and Leighton fully admits that Jacobus Arminius was not a Calvinist.

Please accept his opinion.

Um he was in fact a Calvinist

Jacobus Arminius (/ɑːrˈmɪniəs/; Dutch: Jakob Hermanszoon[a] ; 10 October 1560 – 19 October 1609) was a Dutch Reformed minister and theologian during the Protestant Reformation period whose views became the basis of Arminianism and the Dutch Remonstrant movement. He served from 1603 as professor in theology at the University of Leiden and wrote many books and treatises on theology.

Following his death, his challenge to the Reformed standard, the Belgic Confession, provoked ample discussion at the Synod of Dort, which crafted the five points of Calvinism in response to Arminius's teaching.

 

[civic]

Um he was in fact a Calvinist

Jacobus Arminius (/ɑːrˈmɪniəs/; Dutch: Jakob Hermanszoon[a] ; 10 October 1560 – 19 October 1609) was a Dutch Reformed minister and theologian during the Protestant Reformation period whose views became the basis of Arminianism and the Dutch Remonstrant movement. He served from 1603 as professor in theology at the University of Leiden and wrote many books and treatises on theology.

Following his death, his challenge to the Reformed standard, the Belgic Confession, provoked ample discussion at the Synod of Dort, which crafted the five points of Calvinism in response to Arminius's teaching.

Yes he was for 10 years

 

[Johann]

Personally-I think we should speak reverently when it comes to Messiah and what He endured on that Cross in our stead.

 

[civic]

Personally-I think we should speak reverently when it comes to Messiah and what He endured on that Cross in our stead.

Yes especially when it comes to breaking up the Trinity which PSA teaches.

 

[civic]

Red flag alert