If you are under the law, those sins become transgressions and the person is accountable. But blessed is the one whose sin the Lord will not take into account. But of course no one should test the Lord by violating these.
Gospel of Christ: Is It Law Or Did It End Law?
- Thread starter Titus
- Start date
Titus
Active Member
If a born again christian was to keep any of the old law as legally binding,
Paul said, Galatians 5:4,
- Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law(Moses) ye have fallen from grace
I believe that means just what it says. Go back and try to be justified in the old law= fall from Gods unmerited favor.
Very serious.
civic
Active Member
It’s still a willful sin and no one is forgiven of any sin they do not repent of.
Titus
Active Member
Its absolutely a sin to bind the old law. Teaching so is heresy.
civic
Active Member
So idolatry is not a sin ?
Yikes
Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound ? May it never be.
Titus
Active Member
? Where did I imply that?
civic
Active Member
It’s one of the 10 commandments affirmed in the NT in many places
Titus
Active Member
Error, it in Christs new testament gospel.
You need to learn Paul's allegory in Galatians 4:21-31
civic
Active Member
Wrong
1 John 2:3-6
3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him; 5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him: 6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.
1 John 3:9-12
9 No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10 By this the children of God and the children of the devil are obvious: anyone who does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor the one who does not love his brother.
11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.
civic
Active Member
John 14:15
If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.
1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome,
If you love Me, you will keep My commandments.
1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome,
civic
Active Member
And a servant is not greater than his master . Be imitators of Christ !
John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will remain in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and remain in His love
John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will remain in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and remain in His love
Titus
Active Member
Have you noticed Jesus gave commandments?
John is teaching to keep the commandments in Christ' law not the old law under the old covenant. Gentiles were never under the law of Moses. New testament Christian's are made up of Jews and gentiles. No way 1John 5:3 is the old law for the jews.
Law of Moses was for Jews only.
Deuteronomy 5:1-3,
- and Moses called all Israel and said unto them Hear O Israel the statues and judgments which I speak in your ears this day that ye may learn them and keep them
The Lord our God made a COVENANT WITH US(JEWS) in Horeb
The Lord made this NOT THIS COVENANT WITH OUR FATHERS BUT WITH US(JEWS) EVEN US
- WHO ARE ALL OF US HERE, HERE, HERE ALIVE THIS DAY
123 John is new covenant not old.
1Corinthians 9:21,
- to them that are without law as without law, being not without Law to God, but under the law of Christ
All under the law of Christ. The Law of Christ is not and never will be the law of Moses.
Gentile Christians were told by the apostles that they were NEVER commanded to keep the law of Moses,
Acts 15:24,
- forasmuch we have heard that certain which went out from us(apostles) have troubled you with words subverting your souls saying, ye must be circumcised and KEEP THE LAW OF MOSES TO WHICH
WE GAVE NO SUCH COMMANDMENT
You did not read my post to make wild accusations like this one,
Not even close to my beliefs.
You didn't get these ideas from my teaching.
civic
Active Member
hmmm I noticed you did not quote Jesus the authority Himself and the source of truth. I did.
Titus
Active Member
Jesus embodies His law.
You didn't notice very well. Ive already given key verses.
Matthew 5:17
Romans 10:4
John 1:17
Hebrews 10:1
Colossians 3:24-25
Jesus is the reality behind the law of the new covenant.
Jesus is the embodiment of grace and truth.
civic
Active Member
and He said one must obey His commandments if they want to be His disciple.
What are His commandments?
Is He God ?
What are Gods commandments ?
I await your honest response.
civic
Active Member
Just a few of Jesus commands to obey and there are plenty more
1. Repent - Matthew 4:17
"From that time on Jesus began to preach, 'Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near.'"
2. Follow Me - Matthew 4:19
"'Come, follow me,' Jesus said, 'and I will send you out to fish for people.'"
3. Rejoice - Matthew 5:12
"Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."
4. Let Your Light Shine - Matthew 5:16
"In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven."
5. Honor God’s Law - Matthew 5:17-19
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore, anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."
6. Be Reconciled - Matthew 5:24-25
"Leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to your brother or sister; then come and offer your gift. Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison."
7. Do Not Lust - Matthew 5:28-30
"But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."
8. Keep Your Word - Matthew 5:37
"All you need to say is simply 'Yes' or 'No'; anything beyond this comes from the evil one."
9. Go the Second Mile - Matthew 5:38-42
"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you."
10. Love Your Enemies - Matthew 5:44
"But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,"
11. Be Perfect - Matthew 5:48
"Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect."
12. Practice Secret Disciplines (Giving, Praying, Fasting) - Matthew 6:1-18
[Due to the length, this passage outlines the importance of not doing your acts of righteousness before others to be seen by them, with specific instructions for giving to the needy, prayer, and fasting, each to be done in secret so that the Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.]
13. Lay Up Treasures in Heaven - Matthew 6:19-21
"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."
14. Seek God’s Kingdom - Matthew 6:33
"But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well."
15. Judge Not - Matthew 7:1-2
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
16. Do Not Throw Pearls to Pigs - Matthew 7:6
"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces."
17. Ask, Seek, Knock - Matthew 7:7-8
"Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened."
18. Do Unto Others - Matthew 7:12
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."
19. Choose the Narrow Way - Matthew 7:13-14
"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it."
20. Beware of False Prophets - Matthew 7:15
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves."
21. Pray for Laborers - Matthew 9:38
"Ask the Lord of the harvest, therefore, to send out workers into his harvest field."
22. Be Wise as Serpents - Matthew 10:16
"I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves."
23. Fear Not - Matthew 10:28
"Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell."
24. Hear God’s Voice - Matthew 11:15
"Whoever has ears, let them hear."
25. Take My Yoke - Matthew 11:29
"Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls."
26. Honor Your Parents - Matthew 15:4
"For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and 'Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.'"
27. Beware of Leaven - Matthew 16:6
"Be careful," Jesus said to them. "Be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees."
28. Deny Yourself - Matthew 16:24
"Then Jesus said to his disciples, 'Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me.'"
29. Do Not Despise Little Ones - Matthew 18:10
"See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven."
30. Go to Offenders - Matthew 18:15
"If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over."
31. Beware of Covetousness - Luke 12:15
"Then he said to them, 'Watch out! Be on your guard against all kinds of greed; life does not consist in an abundance of possessions.'"
32. Forgive Offenders - Matthew 18:21-22
"Then Peter came to Jesus and asked, 'Lord, how many times shall I forgive my brother or sister who sins against me? Up to seven times?' Jesus answered, 'I tell you, not seven times, but seventy-seven times.'"
33. Honor Marriage - Matthew 19:6
"So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate."
34. Be a Servant - Matthew 20:26-27
"Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, and whoever wants to be first must be your slave—"
35. Be a House of Prayer - Matthew 21:13
"He said to them, 'It is written, ‘My house will be called a house of prayer,’ but you are making it ‘a den of robbers.’'"
36. Ask in Faith - Matthew 21:21-22
"Jesus replied, 'Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not
only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, ‘Go, throw yourself into the sea,’ and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.'"
37. Bring in the Poor - Luke 14:12-14
"Then Jesus said to his host, 'When you give a luncheon or dinner, do not invite your friends, your brothers or sisters, your relatives, or your rich neighbors; if you do, they may invite you back and so you will be repaid. But when you give a banquet, invite the poor, the crippled, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.'"
38. Render to Caesar - Matthew 22:19-21
"Show me the coin used for paying the tax.' They brought him a denarius, and he asked them, 'Whose image is this? And whose inscription?' 'Caesar’s,' they replied. Then he said to them, 'So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.'"
39. Love the Lord - Matthew 22:37
"Jesus replied: 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'"
40. Love Your Neighbor - Matthew 22:39
"And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'"
41. Await My Return - Matthew 24:42-44
"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him."
42. Celebrate the Lord’s Supper - Matthew 26:26-27
"While they were eating, Jesus took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it and gave it to his disciples, saying, 'Take and eat; this is my body.' Then he took a cup, and when he had given thanks, he gave it to them, saying, 'Drink from it, all of you.'"
43. Watch and Pray - Matthew 26:41
"'Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.'"
44. Feed My Sheep - John 21:15-16
"When they had finished eating, Jesus said to Simon Peter, 'Simon son of John, do you love me more than these?' 'Yes, Lord,' he said, 'you know that I love you.' Jesus said, 'Feed my lambs.' Again Jesus said, 'Simon son of John, do you love me?' He answered, 'Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.' Jesus said, 'Take care of my sheep.'"
45. Baptize My Disciples - Matthew 28:19
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,"
46. Teach Them to Obey My Commands - Matthew 28:20
"and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."
47. Receive God’s Power - Luke 24:49
"I am going to send you what my Father has promised; but stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high."
48. Make Disciples - Matthew 28:19-20
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age
hope this helps !!!
Titus
Active Member
Some of the commandments Himself and His apostles gave in the epistles.
They are scattered throughout the gospels and specifically from Acts 2 to Revelation.
Since the gospels occured under the old covenant some old law would have been taught and binding.
After Jesus' death His law went into effect. Acts 2. Then Jesus' new testament commandments would be taught and binding. But Acts is a transition from the old law to the new. So many Jews have not yet heard the gospel therefore they would be obligated to keep the old law until they heard about Jesus and His gospel.
It would be unjust for God to hold Jews accountable to the new law if they had not known about it nor given the opportunity to believe and obey it. Acts 19 as example.
Acts 19:1-7,
- Paul said unto them, have ye received the Holy Spirit since ye believed and they said unto him, we have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Spirit
- and he said unto them, unto what then were ye baptized and they said unto John's baptism (old law)
- Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance saying unto the people (jews) that they should believe on Him which should come after John that is on Christ Jesus
- when they heard this(the new testament gospel for the first time) they were baptized in the name of Lord Jesus(new testament commandment, Acts 2:38 ; Acts 10:47-48)
- and when Paul had laid hands on them the Holy Spirit came on them and they spake in tongues
Many Jews were living during the new covenant, the new testament law but had not yet heard it.
So those Jews were obeying God by still keeping the old law because that's all they knew to do.
Totally different situation today.
The law of Moses has been defunct since the death of Christ, Hebrews 9:16-17.
Even Paul would keep the law in the book of Acts even though he was not obligated to for the purpose of winning Jews to Christ.
If Paul did not keep the law at times around the Jews. They would have never listened to him.
1 Corinthians 9:19-23,
- for thou I be free from all men, yet I have made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more
- and unto the Jews I became as the jew that I might gain the Jews to them that are under the law that I might gain them that are under the law
- to them that are without law(gentiles never were under the old law) as without law being not without law to God but under the law of Christ that I might gain them that are without law
Paul's allegory in Galatians proves when the perfect law of liberty went into force.
The old law of Moses, law of sin and death, was no longer in force.
civic
Active Member
Jesus agrees with me as I have demonstrated in my previous post.
Titus
Active Member
You speak the same as the Pharisees in Acts 15.
The Pharisees tried to bind the old law of Moses on gentile converts to Christ just as you claim the law of Moses is binding today.
The apostles taught that christians were never commanded to keep the law of Moses.
Jesus is who the apostles are speaking. They are speaking teaching, preaching on His behalf.
John 14:26.
I'm not calling you a Pharisee as that would be misrepresentation of your motives and character.
The Pharisees new they were going against Jesus. You do not.
You are like Paul, you do everything in sincerity.
Unfortunately you are sincerely wrong.
You by ignorance take the same position as the Pharisees trying to bind the old law on those who have been freed from the law.
I take the side of the apostles. Therefore Christ is well pleased with me.
Acts 2:42,
- and they continued steadfastly in the apostles doctrine....
The apostles gave their answer to the very subject we are discussing today.
Acts 15:24 is their answer. Which is Jesus' oracles.
1Peter 4:11.
I'm not your enemy.
I'm hear to help with understanding Gods revelation to man.
Titus 2:1,
- but speak thou the things which become sound doctrine
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