Are we told to worship Jesus or are we told to worship God?

[MatthewG]

Jesus said...."you believe in God, believe ALSO....in ME"

Jesus said., ,"I and my Father are ONE"

Jesus said..>"when you've seen ME... you've SEEN.................the Father".

That can be taken a lot of ways.

One what? They most certainly was One in the beginning, Yahweh, and His Word, which represents the (soul - mind/will/emotions.)

If we are to also believe in Jesus, wouldn’t that mean to worship the Father in spirit and truth? Undoubtedly to me Jesus showed the heart of God, by virtue of being helped by Gods spirit, and in part of Yeshua being the Word of God, and first one born of spirit and flesh named Yeshua…

So not sure where you think or have thoughts concerning the perception that I have, be it wrong or right.

 

[MatthewG]

As Christians we believe that Jesus is the Logos, God incarnate (God in human form), God the Son, and "true God and true man"—fully divine and fully human.

Is Jesus God? Why should I believe that Jesus is God? | GotQuestions.org

Is Jesus God? Why should I believe that Jesus is God? Is Jesus God in the flesh?

www.gotquestions.org

I don’t personally downplay Jesus being the very Word of God… the only thing was, that Jesus didn’t know everything and had his Father also help reveal things to him, after ascending with Revelation…

The thing also is Jesus constantly prayed for people to come to know the true God… why do people believe he is talking about himself? How vain that would be… and self entitled… never seen Jesus like that, even when proclaims before Abraham was I am, (the Word of God.)

People who say Jesus is God, and fully God… then how did he die on the cross with God forsaking him? God can’t possibly die… but I been assured from other sources apparently, the self existing one can die… somehow.

 

[Behold]

Jesus showed the heart of God, by virtue of being helped by Gods spirit,

"God is A Spirit"

"Christ is THAT Spirit""

"He that hath not the Spirit of God, is none of God's".

"Christ IN You, the Hope of Glory" (Glory is Heaven).

All believers have become "The Temple of the Holy Spirit".. ("Christ is that Spirit".)

 

[MatthewG]

@Behold, while God is spirit and his spirit seems to outflow from him, namely what we tend to call the Holy Spirit of God, is different than the Spirit of Christ. While I believe we are given the Holy Spirit, from God is poured out on to the hearts of believers, the Spirit of Christ, which would be in essence, Yeshua’s spirit of how he was like while on earth, and believers inherit this Spirit, which is of Yeshua, whom was the anointed one or Christ. We also find out later that God was in Christ - - being in Christ, is a completely differing opinion of what is commonly supposed that Jesus is God… but how could he by the nature of his flesh… it’s not spirit at all… though in essence we live by his spirit which indwells us, as well as the Holy Spirit of God.

I believe this uniformed view shows, that God is calling out by the Spirit and the bride, speaking of his calling to all people daily, each and every day they wake up. Whether they respond or not idk. That’s up to them, in their own heart. To believe and have faith. While the Spirit of Jesus Christ, is what conforms one to being lowly, humble, obedient to what Yeshua has taught (though not everything written in the gospel relates to us) the reason I mention this is because of the construction of the narrative itself defined what needed to be heeded to, in a time where that bride that calls out today, was under severe circumstances… of course most people tend to disagree…

But I can’t change peoples minds, thought process, or traditions they have learned… like many people suggest Yahweh, can’t change his mind… that’s a lie. That’s why we too, can change our own minds about things when experience comes in and through life.

(TLDR - Version)
I don’t just have to agree with someone, I at least owe an explanation… of why I digress my point whether you may see it right or wrong. Cause not everyone got everything down just right to a t.

 

[MatthewG]

And just cause someone quotes the Bible, and say they have read it so many times, doesn’t mean they haven’t forgotten… cause with no retention… overtime one does forget, and if they aren’t season in really knowing what is in the Bible because of distractions and also lack of teaching. That is not the fault of person, except the one who was lack in teaching, and it is the fault of the person who made not effort to seek out what information is stored there.

Be encouraged to read your Bible, out loud to hear the words and ponder about what’s going on. It’s not a fairy tell, with a quick story about how someone gave some money to a poor person one time, or just did something nice…

Life and death. That’s what lived by Yeshua, and he overcame death, and everything else!

 

[Johann]

And just cause someone quotes the Bible, and say they have read it so many times, doesn’t mean they haven’t forgotten… cause with no retention… overtime one does forget, and if they aren’t season in really knowing what is in the Bible because of distractions and also lack of teaching. That is not the fault of person, except the one who was lack in teaching, and it is the fault of the person who made not effort to seek out what information is stored there.

Be encouraged to read your Bible, out loud to hear the words and ponder about what’s going on. It’s not a fairy tell, with a quick story about how someone gave some money to a poor person one time, or just did something nice…

Life and death. That’s what lived by Yeshua, and he overcame death, and everything else!

You can download a KJV audio Bible @MatthewG

 

[Studyman]

My personal belief is that people are to worship God. Not Jesus.

Our fellowship is with the Father, and the Son. When it comes to worship it is important to worship Yahava/Yahweh, God.

Certainly, there is an image of this world's religion's God, created my men in the likeness of man. This image is of a handsome, long-haired man, who supposedly came to save us from the Laws of the God and Father of the Lord's Christ. This is the God I have seen worshipped since my youth.

The Jesus of the bible once said, "What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before".

Was HE not sent as the Redeemer? Isn't that the Glory HE had before?

John 17: 4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had "with thee" before the world was.

So I don't see the masses worshipping the Jesus "of the Bible", because if they truly believed in him, they would worship His Father. But I do see "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord, worshipping this image of God plastered on Billboards and manmade shrines of worship all over the world.

 

[MatthewG]

You can download a KJV audio Bible @MatthewG

Yeah buts that boring to me. Since I am able to read, I like to do it myself; which I suppose is a personal choice. It’s not to bad in teaching setting, and sometimes it is just boring. Can’t help that, when reading about a bunch of people back in the day doing what they had done in name of Christ… definitely have utmost respect to the first bride; alway.

 

[Behold]

@Behold, while God is spirit and his spirit seems to outflow from him, namely what we tend to call the Holy Spirit of God, is different than the Spirit of Christ.

Let us look at God and Jesus..


Genesis...

"Let US..... make Man....in OUR image".


1.) Us, and OUR... = 2

This is GOD the Father ......and .... pre-incarnate Jesus, who "was God"... = John 1.

So, we notice that BOTH God and Pre-incarnate Jesus are "OUR, and US"< who "MAKE" man.

God is the Creator, and Pre-incarnate Jesus is the WORD of Creation.

John wants us to understand that they are ONE.. .so, this is why He wrote that Jesus was the pre-incarnate "WAS God", and now on Earth as Jesus .. "the Word made Flesh" (Virgin born) .... John shows us This verse..

John 1:10, that says that JESUS = ""made the WORLD.""

Same God.
Same Spirit

"US and OUR"... = 2 are ONE.

 

[MatthewG]

Let us look at God and Jesus..


Genesis...

"Let US..... make Man....in OUR image".


1.) Us, and OUR... = 2

This is GOD the Father ......and .... pre-incarnate Jesus, who "was God"... = John 1.

So, we notice that BOTH God and Pre-incarnate Jesus are "OUR, and US"< who "MAKE" man.

God is the Creator, and Pre-incarnate Jesus is the WORD of Creation.

John wants us to understand that they are ONE.. .so, this is why He wrote that Jesus was the pre-incarnate "WAS God", and now on Earth as Jesus .. "the Word made Flesh" (Virgin born) .... John shows us This verse..

John 1:10, that says that JESUS = ""made the WORLD.""

Same God.
Same Spirit

"US and OUR"... = 2 are ONE.

Listen I barely read what you wrote and this is what come to mind; you can see me as rude or straightforward… cause I’d like to know if your understanding me or still misunderstanding me, in that you don’t think I believe that Yeshua, in his now returned state to his former glory, sits with his Father, with the title of Lord God Almighty (though this doesn’t make the Lord Jesus greater than his Father.

As the Word… He was God because of expressing the heart of Yahweh to all humans in creating light, in which Yahweh (not his Word) separated the light from the darkness.

What about it? Sure you can make it seem us and our relate to what Yeshua said. He could have been speaking in a Kingly tone, “Let us make a banquet” for example.

I shared what with how I see them as one. Do you have any comments on those things.

Cause if you don’t, your responses I don’t care much about as your still on ignore, and it’s not that I can’t stand your or anything it’s just your communication typically fails when you try to talk to me. Your seemingly trying to just override anything I have stated or not make no jesters of understanding or respect for that matter in capacity to make any attempt, thus why should I do so now?

 

[MatthewG]

Certainly, there is an image of this world's religion's God, created my men in the likeness of man. This image is of a handsome, long-haired man, who supposedly came to save us from the Laws of the God and Father of the Lord's Christ. This is the God I have seen worshipped since my youth.

The Jesus of the bible once said, "What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before".

Was HE not sent as the Redeemer? Isn't that the Glory HE had before?

John 17: 4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had "with thee" before the world was.

So I don't see the masses worshipping the Jesus "of the Bible", because if they truly believed in him, they would worship His Father. But I do see "many" who call Jesus Lord, Lord, worshipping this image of God plastered on Billboards and manmade shrines of worship all over the world.

It would have been quite vain for Jesus to really say “I am God.” In my opinion, and because of the writings of John in his gospel while it may be a different perspective it’s a perspective in revealing who Yeshua was… as being “Gods” very living “Word” in which so “God spoke, and the first thing the “Word” created was light. Then you see God, Yahweh himself separate the light from the darkness.

“In the beginning, when God created the earth and sky, the earth was without life and not yet useful for anything. Deep waters covered the earth, and darkness covered the water. God’s Spirit was moving like a storm over the surface of the water. Then God said, “Let there be light!” And light began to shine. He saw the light, and he knew that it was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1‬:‭1‬-‭4‬ ‭ERV‬‬

Yeshua was the Word of God, which was God. You can say was of God; it doesn’t diminish Yeshua in any way whatsoever to me personally; because he was the Logos in the beginning.

“In the beginning, before the earth was made, the Word was there. The Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was there with God in the beginning. Everything was made through him, and nothing was made without him. In him there was life, and that life was light for the people of the world. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not defeated it.”
‭‭John‬ ‭1‬:‭1‬-‭5‬ ‭ERV‬‬

Certainly a revelation. As you see the correlation here by John and his admission of Yeshua being the Logos of Yahweh, whom spoke, and thus the heart of Yahweh is made known through the expression of his word.

“Then God said, “Let there be light!” And light began to shine. He saw the light, and he knew that it was good. Then he separated the light from the darkness.”
‭‭Genesis‬ ‭1‬:‭3‬-‭4‬ ‭ERV‬‬

Here again, just looking at these verses, you have the Word creating, Yahweh creating through His Word. Which where we get the knowledge of how Yeshua was the one in the beginning doing the creating, by and through the Father.

“Now I will write about meat that is sacrificed to idols. It is certainly true that “we all have knowledge,” as you say. But this knowledge only fills people with pride. It is love that helps the church grow stronger. Those who think they know something do not yet know anything as they should. But whoever loves God is known by God. So this is what I say about eating meat: We know that an idol is really nothing in the world, and we know that there is only one God. It’s really not important if there are things called gods in heaven or on earth—and there are many of these “gods” and “Lords” out there. For us there is only one God, and he is our Father. All things came from him, and we live for him. And there is only one Lord, Jesus Christ. All things were made through him, and we also have life through him.”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭8‬:‭1‬-‭6‬ ‭ERV‬‬

Again? Here we see, in verse 6; For to us there is only one God, and he is our Father.

“All things came from him, and we live for him” speaking of Yahweh.

“And there is only one Lord (not LORD, but the LORDs Word,) Jesus Christ.”

“All things are made through him.”

How? Revert back to the beginning, and I believe there is a definitive explanation from this perspective of use of the Bible.

Of course apologetically: you can’t go by this directive, or direction; you must go by scriptural point verse which is nothing more than butchering and bartering the Bible outside of context, and not to much of spirit, but just material verses missing context, no thought on the Holy Spirit and what is truth behind it all; whether a tradition stands or falls, is in fact of the One whom decided to create in the first place; and from what I understand all things can be shaken; even faith.

Which is kinda of a scary thing because it seems life and death is found in the power of the tongue.

 

[Behold]

Listen I barely read what you wrote and this is what come to mind; you can see me as rude or straightforward… cause I’d like to know if your understanding me or still misunderstanding me,

If you say you barely read what i wrote ( you said)............, and now based on that, you post some erroneous comments..............

Read it instead.

 

[MatthewG]

If you say you barely read what i wrote ( you said)............, and now based on that, you post some erroneous comments..............

Read it instead.

I disagree. Thank you for always taking time to share your thoughts, and verses from the Bible. I’m glad to know that there are people out there who do decide to choose to live and love God and others by the Spirit. Thank you for also not taking in my own comments and making sure you continue to belittle me, or mock. That’s not of Jesus Christ at all. If for the second time? You decided to barely read at all? Cause I can’t tell, if you did or didn’t; I typically skim fast and reply; my fault.

Don’t be so hypocritical… it’s not my problem or issue that I haven’t explained and yet you don’t respond with really anything other than “I’m in error.”

That’s not away to be constructive but disruptive; and that’s why I have you on ignore.

 

[Behold]

yet you don’t respond with really anything other than “I’m in error.”

that’s why I have you on ignore.

Well 2 things..

You initially posted to me, so that is why i responded. @MatthewG
So, if you had me on "ignore" i guess you forgot . (again)

2nd, i posted 2 clear posts to you, and neither of them said anything personal about you.

So, like i told you.. next time.. read the posts, and then you'll know what i actually wrote.

 

[MatthewG]

Well 2 things..

You initially posted to me, so that is why i responded. @MatthewG
So, if you had me on "ignore" i guess you forgot . (again)

2nd, i posted 2 clear posts to you, and neither of them said anything personal about you.

So, like i told you.. next time.. read the posts, and then you'll know what i actually wrote.

Same to you, and please be sure to comment on something’s you see so you can prove how people are in error, instead of just stating it as though you are some type of “authority” concerning the Bible; or let alone: judge another person who is not always faithful to Yahweh, however I’m thankful to him, and his Son for what they accomplished.

 

[Behold]

Same to you, and please be sure to comment on something’s you see so you can prove how people are in error, instead of just stating it as though you are some type of “authority” concerning the Bible;

I teach Pauline Theology.

And honestly, im am one of the "last of their kind" as we are in the great falling away, ...when Paul's Doctrine is become..."what is that stuff" regarding most believers, theology.

IN fact, not 25 mins ago, i had a Staff Member on "ChristianityBoard" tell me......> Paul is not my teacher.

So, i agreed....., and they have no idea what they are saying when in fact, Jesus chose Paul for the "time of the Gentiles" and that woman is a gentile.

Who is her "teacher"?

A.) JOHN Calvin the deceiver, and that is why she has no use for "Paul".

And also, @MatthewG .... its Paul who teaches that God calls into the ministry, whomever He calls, "for the perfecting of the Saints".

My call is not "pastor" even tho i can perform that ministry....but that is not my anointing.

 

[Studyman]

I teach Pauline Theology.

Paul taught the Gospel of Christ "of the Bible". There is no such thing as "Pauline Theology". You are simply preaching the traditions and doctrines of one of this world's religious businesses or sects.

 

[MatthewG]

I teach Pauline Theology.

And honestly, im am one of the "last of their kind" as we are in the great falling away, ...when Paul's Doctrine is become..."what is that stuff" regarding most believers, theology.

IN fact, not 25 mins ago, i had a Staff Member on "ChristianityBoard" tell me......> Paul is not my teacher.

So, i agreed....., and they have no idea what they are saying when in fact, Jesus chose Paul for the "time of the Gentiles" and that woman is a gentile.

Who is her "teacher"?

A.) JOHN Calvin the deceiver, and that is why she has no use for "Paul".

And also, @MatthewG .... its Paul who teaches that God calls into the ministry, whomever He calls, "for the perfecting of the Saints".

My call is not "pastor" even tho i can perform that ministry....but that is not my anointing.

Every person who follows Yeshua, is given some sort of ministry duty, which are all performed by our awareness of its Christ in us that does any good, none of these remarks change that which we had already went over. That’s fine though, that you didn’t acknowledge whether your understood or disagreed in parts of my statements. I try to be patient but when you continue to prove yourself your lead further and further away from discussion in order to make a hazy fog, which leads some people perhaps not remembering what they said or you have said, and I’m glad we are able to make this explicit and out in the open.

You speaking of yourself as “I’m one of the last of this kind” is defunct; and doesn’t mean anything to Yahweh as far as I am concerned because being one of the last of this kind doesn’t please God. Nor do feelings please God, it’s faith…

Anyway; sorry that you decided to go this route, and may God continue to bless you; not hatred or judgment on my end other than what is presented here, and as normal it’s always openly expressed with any individual member.

 

[Behold]

"Pauline Theology".

This is Paul's Doctrine.

You can read 1 Tim 4:13, and you'll note that He mentions His Doctrine to His Convert.

"Pauline Theology" is the more contemporary Christian description.

So, when Paul says to you..>"Be a follower of ME, as i follow Christ".....He's not only describing his Christianity, but he's describing also His Doctrine.

Its the same that He taught the other Apostles in Acts 15.

Peter refers to this that Paul teaches as "Scripture".. equal to the Jew's Torah..

 

[Behold]

Every person who follows Yeshua, is given some sort of ministry duty,

"the ministry of Reconciliation" 2 Corinthians 5:19, is absolutely the Ministry of all who are born again.

That’s fine though, that you didn’t acknowledge whether your understood or disagreed in parts of my statements.

I did respond to your original post, and then you responded by saying you didnt really read it..

So, yes, i responded, and it was just info,.... .. and not anything related to what you stated about it, previously.