A Little Salvation story.

[MTMattie]

Wow. You sure do require a lot in order to get saved !
A true legalist.

Does Richard Dawkins want to go to heaven?
I don't think so.

An odd one to ask about...

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’

‘I love hymns and Christmas carols and I sort of feel at home in the Christian ethos, and I feel that we are a Christian country in that sense,’ said the British author of ‘The God Delusion.’

www.ncregister.com

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’​

If someone asks someone if they want to go to heaven and the reply is Yes....it shows a desire to want to be with God.
God will judge us on the light we've received.

I disagree. Most people if they say yes it is because they do not want the alternative. Most people, whether they have a strong faith or not believe that everyone they know who dies goes to heaven.

I could fill and entire thread by myself with those who I personally know who automatically believe this. From a neighbor who was baptized as a teen but has no idea why. to family who are certain unless you are a horrible scum of the earth you will be there... even those who who don't believe and even those who laughed when another family member cammented they were glad
they had Jesus. The list is endless, and it is not because they want to be with God so much as it is because it will be a greater place then earth

So...here's what is necessary to get to heaven:
1. Believe in God.
2. Obey God.

You do not believe Faith in Jesus is needed?

I say, very simplified....

1. You have to be born again. Which requires faith.

John 3:3 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’”

2. Believe that Jesus is the Son of God. (I'll leave the Jesus is God out of this at the moment.)

John 3:16 describes God’s gift to humankind: “For God so loved the world, that He gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”

Romans 5:8 describes the sacrifice Jesus made for sinners: "But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."

2. Accept that you can't go to heaven unless you become saved in Christ.

The Bible also makes it clear that you can not be good enough to get into heaven on your own—it is not something that can be accomplished by your “works,” or actions. Ephesians 2:8-9 says: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:

*John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'"


Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.

The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:

Romans 10:9 "That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

This is what is necessary to get to heaven.

Easy.

And, is being saved different than being GENUINLY saved??
What an odd thing to say.

Reminds me of those that say that one must be a TRUE believer.
Is that different than A BELIEVER?

I have a Jewish friend.... man... who lives close to Miami FL which is a strong Jewish area in the states.
He was married to a Catholic girl who has since died.

One day we were talking and it was on religion and I simply said "But you don't believe in Jesus."

He piped up with "I do believe in Jesus. He might even be the Son of God." After that we talked no more on religion.

Now you tell me. Was he a "TRUE" believer or merely a believer.

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

Wow. You sure do require a lot in order to get saved !
A true legalist.

Does Richard Dawkins want to go to heaven?
I don't think so.

If someone asks someone if they want to go to heaven and the reply is Yes....it shows a desire to want to be with God.
God will judge us on the light we've received.


So...here's what is necessary to get to heaven:
1. Believe in God.
2. Obey God.

Easy.

And, is being saved different than being GENUINLY saved??
What an odd thing to say.

Reminds me of those that say that one must be a TRUE believer.
Is that different than A BELIEVER?

Believe in GOD
Obey GOD .
And WHO did the FATHER testify of ............
JESUS the CHRIST . in fact if one beleives NOT the testimony that GOD gave of the SON
they call God a liar .
And all liars shall have their part in the lake of fire .
Its real simple . To be saved one must do as did Cornelious .
Now lets notice that While GOD was pleased with His alms and prayers
Still he lacked ONE thing to be saved . So peter was sent for
and peter preached the CHRIST and cornelious BELIEVED and was saved .
Sirs what must i do to be saved . BELIEVE on JESUS the CHRIST . Very very simple indeed .
Now on those feet and to the trenches for it is all out battle for the souls of men in these last hours upon earth .

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

An odd one to ask about...

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’

‘I love hymns and Christmas carols and I sort of feel at home in the Christian ethos, and I feel that we are a Christian country in that sense,’ said the British author of ‘The God Delusion.’

www.ncregister.com

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’​

I disagree. Most people if they say yes it is because they do not want the alternative. Most people, whether they have a strong faith or not believe that everyone they know who dies goes to heaven.

I could fill and entire thread by myself with those who I personally know who automatically believe this. From a neighbor who was baptized as a teen but has no idea why. to family who are certain unless you are a horrible scum of the earth you will be there... even those who who don't believe and even those who laughed when another family member cammented they were glad
they had Jesus. The list is endless, and it is not because they want to be with God so much as it is because it will be a greater place then earth


You do not believe Faith in Jesus is needed?

I say, very simplified....

1. You have to be born again. Which requires faith.

John 3:3 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’”

2. Believe that Jesus is the Son of God. (I'll leave the Jesus is God out of this at the moment.)

John 3:16 describes God’s gift to humankind: “For God so loved the world, that He gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”

Romans 5:8 describes the sacrifice Jesus made for sinners: "But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."

2. Accept that you can't go to heaven unless you become saved in Christ.

The Bible also makes it clear that you can not be good enough to get into heaven on your own—it is not something that can be accomplished by your “works,” or actions. Ephesians 2:8-9 says: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:

*John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'"


Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.

The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:

Romans 10:9 "That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

This is what is necessary to get to heaven.




I have a Jewish friend.... man... who lives close to Miami FL which is a strong Jewish area in the states.
He was married to a Catholic girl who has since died.

One day we were talking and it was on religion and I simply said "But you don't believe in Jesus."

He piped up with "I do believe in Jesus. He might even be the Son of God." After that we talked no more on religion.

Now you tell me. Was he a "TRUE" believer or merely a believer.

correct my friend .
There are many people even in false relgions whose desire is to be in heaven , in a paradise
with who they THINK is GOD .
But as you so rightly stated , THERE BE ONLY ONE WAY TO GOD
and to be saved ONE MUST BELEIVE IN HIM . JESUS the GLORIOUS and The MIGHTY CHRIST of GOD .
The only NAME given unto men under heaven whereby one may be saved .
As far as your jewish friend
Its clear to see HE IS NOT a true beleiver . There is no He MIGHT even
HE IS . any sheep with the SPIRIT would know . The sheep of His pasture HEED HIM
and HIS VOICE they do follow and HIS words are their meat .

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

An odd one to ask about...

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’

‘I love hymns and Christmas carols and I sort of feel at home in the Christian ethos, and I feel that we are a Christian country in that sense,’ said the British author of ‘The God Delusion.’

www.ncregister.com

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’​

I disagree. Most people if they say yes it is because they do not want the alternative. Most people, whether they have a strong faith or not believe that everyone they know who dies goes to heaven.

I could fill and entire thread by myself with those who I personally know who automatically believe this. From a neighbor who was baptized as a teen but has no idea why. to family who are certain unless you are a horrible scum of the earth you will be there... even those who who don't believe and even those who laughed when another family member cammented they were glad
they had Jesus. The list is endless, and it is not because they want to be with God so much as it is because it will be a greater place then earth


You do not believe Faith in Jesus is needed?

I say, very simplified....

1. You have to be born again. Which requires faith.

John 3:3 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’”

2. Believe that Jesus is the Son of God. (I'll leave the Jesus is God out of this at the moment.)

John 3:16 describes God’s gift to humankind: “For God so loved the world, that He gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”

Romans 5:8 describes the sacrifice Jesus made for sinners: "But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."

2. Accept that you can't go to heaven unless you become saved in Christ.

The Bible also makes it clear that you can not be good enough to get into heaven on your own—it is not something that can be accomplished by your “works,” or actions. Ephesians 2:8-9 says: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:

*John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'"


Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.

The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:

Romans 10:9 "That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

This is what is necessary to get to heaven.




I have a Jewish friend.... man... who lives close to Miami FL which is a strong Jewish area in the states.
He was married to a Catholic girl who has since died.

One day we were talking and it was on religion and I simply said "But you don't believe in Jesus."

He piped up with "I do believe in Jesus. He might even be the Son of God." After that we talked no more on religion.

Now you tell me. Was he a "TRUE" believer or merely a believer.

Point to CHRIST JESUS to the last breath ebbs out those lungs .
He alone is the Savoir , HE alone is the CHRIST , the SON OF GOD , the only NAME that saves .
Many religoins beleive in a paradise , a heaven after this life .
But believe as they will , IF they repent not and come to FAITH IN JESUS THE CHRIST
paradise wont be their end .
Its that serious that we preach ONLY LIFE to this people . THE WORD of LIFE
the glorious gospel of CHRIST JESUS
with a reminder to all THAT YE MUST BELIEVE in HIM to be saved or perish you surely will .
THERE is the narrow and only way to GOD and then there is the broad and ever growing way TO DESTRUTION .
Real simple . JESUS is the WAY and the ONLY WAY to THE FATHER . pretty simple to me .
And never let one fool you with
the words OH DONT JUDGE , there are good people in every religoin .
SEEING THERE IS NONE WHO IS GOOD but GOD , YEAH , that is easy to DEBUNK .
ITS JESUS PREACHING TIME IN THE BUILDING my friend . TO HE alone shall the sheep POINT .

 

[Marvelloustime]

Point to CHRIST JESUS to the last breath ebbs out those lungs .
He alone is the Savoir , HE alone is the CHRIST , the SON OF GOD , the only NAME that saves .
Many religoins beleive in a paradise , a heaven after this life .
But believe as they will , IF they repent not and come to FAITH IN JESUS THE CHRIST
paradise wont be their end .
Its that serious that we preach ONLY LIFE to this people . THE WORD of LIFE
the glorious gospel of CHRIST JESUS
with a reminder to all THAT YE MUST BELIEVE in HIM to be saved or perish you surely will .
THERE is the narrow and only way to GOD and then there is the broad and ever growing way TO DESTRUTION .
Real simple . JESUS is the WAY and the ONLY WAY to THE FATHER . pretty simple to me .
And never let one fool you with
the words OH DONT JUDGE , there are good people in every religoin .
SEEING THERE IS NONE WHO IS GOOD but GOD , YEAH , that is easy to DEBUNK .
ITS JESUS PREACHING TIME IN THE BUILDING my friend . TO HE alone shall the sheep POINT .

@Tothalordbeallglory
“And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭16‬:‭31‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Marvelloustime]

Believe in GOD
Obey GOD .
And WHO did the FATHER testify of ............
JESUS the CHRIST . in fact if one beleives NOT the testimony that GOD gave of the SON
they call God a liar .
And all liars shall have their part in the lake of fire .
Its real simple . To be saved one must do as did Cornelious .
Now lets notice that While GOD was pleased with His alms and prayers
Still he lacked ONE thing to be saved . So peter was sent for
and peter preached the CHRIST and cornelious BELIEVED and was saved .
Sirs what must i do to be saved . BELIEVE on JESUS the CHRIST . Very very simple indeed .
Now on those feet and to the trenches for it is all out battle for the souls of men in these last hours upon earth .

@Tothalordbeallglory
“But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21‬:‭8‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[dwight92070]

§That sure is a lot of theology packed into one sentence.
Let's go over what you stated is necessary for salvation:
You stated: (in post 117 - my reply is in green).

The priest did not ask him if he wanted to be saved. He asked him if he wanted to go to heaven when he died.
Some might wonder what being saved means. This is a theoligical question and everyone is not as informed as you are.
However, if someone knows about heaven and wants to go there...they most probably believe in God and would like to be with HIM and not the evil one.

Probably 90% of everyone on earth would answer "Yes" to that question.
Have you done a survey?
Are you aware that most persons these days are either agnostic or atheirst?
To the question at hand, many would reply that they don't even believe heaven exists.
Would this be any different to YOU than someone saying: "Yes, I'd like to go to heaven".....
or is the fact that they don't now all your theology a disqualifying factor?

I'm happy to be sure that God loves humanity more than you do.

There was no mention of Jesus, who He is, and what He did for us,
Is Jesus God?
I DID state that they have to believe in God.
Maybe you don't believe Jesus is God.

and what we need to do to become a disciple of His.
Therefore, the homeless man just got wet, nothing more, nothing less.
According to the NT, baptism forgives sins.

Acts 2:38
38 Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Baptism is efficacious if the person desires it. Someone who wants to go to heaven most probably will want to be baptized.

Nothing is said about repenting of his sins, and putting his faith in Jesus, so that his sins would be forgiven, and he could be born again or saved. A promise of going to heaven means nothing, if the person is not first genuinely saved.
Is there a difference between saved and being genuinely saved?
I think I might have already asked this.ù
As far as I can understand,,,there seems to be no difference in the two terms.

You must be a new Christian and have taken on the responsibility of knowing who is going to heaven and who is not.
A responsibility I would not care to have.
Even Jesus said that we will be judged according to how we judge.
I'd leave judging a person's SOUL to God.

You didn't reply.
Interesting.

You also said one must be GENUINELY SAVED.

I'm just wondering if there's a difference between your statement:

LEGALIST VS TRUE LEGALIST
SAVED VS GENUINELY SAVED
BELIEVER VS TRUE BELIEVER

I keep hearing these words added on to verbs and I'm just wondering if the added on word changes the meaning of the verb.

Let's leave that up to God.

Like I said, that depends on whether or not they believe in heaven and hell.
If they want to go to heaven, it shows some DESIRE to be with God.
We are saved by grace....through faith (whatever amount we have - even the size of a mustard seed).

God offers to all who want salvation the gift of salvation.

More theology.
So what is the Kingdom of God?
And HOW does one enter into it?
And, if this was the main message of Jesus, why are YOU speaking about "being saved" instead of the Kingdom of God?
Did Jesus say we must be saved or did he say we must be born again?


What happens to all the humans that ever lived that never heard of Jesus?

Talking to you Baptismal Regeneration people and the Non-Trinitarians is very much alike. Attempting to get you to see the truth is like trying to convince a fox not to eat the chickens. Both are futile.

There's hardness of heart.
There's tares in the wheat.
There's the spirit of anti-Christ.

Which are you?

 

[GodsGrace]

An odd one to ask about...

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’

‘I love hymns and Christmas carols and I sort of feel at home in the Christian ethos, and I feel that we are a Christian country in that sense,’ said the British author of ‘The God Delusion.’

www.ncregister.com

Famous Atheist Richard Dawkins Says He Considers Himself a ‘Cultural Christian’​

Right.
But he's still an atheist !

I disagree. Most people if they say yes it is because they do not want the alternative. Most people, whether they have a strong faith or not believe that everyone they know who dies goes to heaven.

OK.
Maybe our experiences are different.
Not going to spend time on this.
It would require looking up some statistics.

I could fill and entire thread by myself with those who I personally know who automatically believe this. From a neighbor who was baptized as a teen but has no idea why. to family who are certain unless you are a horrible scum of the earth you will be there... even those who who don't believe and even those who laughed when another family member cammented they were glad
they had Jesus. The list is endless, and it is not because they want to be with God so much as it is because it will be a greater place then earth

If they want to be with §God why do they make fun of Him?
Sorry, MT, I don't understand and it's not really important.

You do not believe Faith in Jesus is needed?

Did I say this?
Is Jesus God or not?
Paul spoke about God doing the judging.
Jesus IS the judge at the final judgment.
I don't see a contradition.
If we believe in God, we believe in Jesus.
It's JESUS that is the savior of the entire world and from the beginning of time.

I say, very simplified....

1. You have to be born again. Which requires faith.

John 3:3 'I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.’”

2. Believe that Jesus is the Son of God. (I'll leave the Jesus is God out of this at the moment.)

John 3:16 describes God’s gift to humankind: “For God so loved the world, that He gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.”

Romans 5:8 describes the sacrifice Jesus made for sinners: "But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."

Agreed.

2. Accept that you can't go to heaven unless you become saved in Christ.

The Bible also makes it clear that you can not be good enough to get into heaven on your own—it is not something that can be accomplished by your “works,” or actions. Ephesians 2:8-9 says: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."

Agreed.
I said we MUST BELIEVE IN GOD.

Because people can never be good enough to get to heaven, God provided a way, through justification, for them to be credited with the righteousness of Jesus Christ:

*John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

Agreed.

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, 'I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.'"

Not sure what anyone means by his.
Are you saying that everyone that never heard of Jesus is doomed to hell?

Have you read Romans chapters 1 and 2?

Receiving salvation through Christ is a simple step-by-step process that has nothing to do with works or goodness. Eternal life in heaven comes through God's grace, a gift. It is gained through faith in Jesus, not performance.

Initial salvation is received as you've stated above.

Does Jesus then require us to do good works or not?

The Bible is the final authority on heaven, and its truth is crystal clear:

Romans 10:9 "That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

This is what is necessary to get to heaven.

Nothing else?
Is this what Jesus taught for over 3 years?
Nothing about our behavior or doing good?
Matthew was wrong in chapter 5 and chapter 25 and chapter 7?
Paul was wrong in stating that we will be judged according to our works? Romans 2:5-8

I have a Jewish friend.... man... who lives close to Miami FL which is a strong Jewish area in the states.
He was married to a Catholic girl who has since died.

One day we were talking and it was on religion and I simply said "But you don't believe in Jesus."

He piped up with "I do believe in Jesus. He might even be the Son of God." After that we talked no more on religion.

Now you tell me. Was he a "TRUE" believer or merely a believer.

Sis....
A BELIEVER and a TRUE BELIEVER is the same.

The word TRUE does not change in any way the word BELIEVER.

If one believes, he's a believer.


If I'm dead, I'm dead... I don't have to add the word TRULY dead.
See what I mean??
I think we need to stop adding words to describe verbs that are self-explanatory.
I'm suspicious as to why people do this.

 

[GodsGrace]

Believe in GOD
Obey GOD .
And WHO did the FATHER testify of ............
JESUS the CHRIST . in fact if one beleives NOT the testimony that GOD gave of the SON
they call God a liar .
And all liars shall have their part in the lake of fire .
Its real simple . To be saved one must do as did Cornelious .
Now lets notice that While GOD was pleased with His alms and prayers
Still he lacked ONE thing to be saved . So peter was sent for
and peter preached the CHRIST and cornelious BELIEVED and was saved .
Sirs what must i do to be saved . BELIEVE on JESUS the CHRIST . Very very simple indeed .
Now on those feet and to the trenches for it is all out battle for the souls of men in these last hours upon earth .

If Cornelious had never met Jesus or heard about Him...
would he have gone to heaven or hell?

 

[GodsGrace]

Talking to you Baptismal Regeneration people and the Non-Trinitarians is very much alike. Attempting to get you to see the truth is like trying to convince a fox not to eat the chickens. Both are futile.

Right. Kind of like it's pretty futile to speak to you too.
Very proudful of you to believe YOU are right and everyone else is wrong.

There's hardness of heart.
There's tares in the wheat.
There's the spirit of anti-Christ.

Which are you?

So, instead of worrying about ME...

why not reply to my post no. 120 instead?

This is what happens when a person cannot reply...
they resort to personal statements that have nothing to do with the conversation.

Which are YOU dwight?
The type that is ABLE to respond to a post...
or the type that is UNABLE to respond to a post so you attack on a personal level.

 

[MTMattie]

Right.
But he's still an atheist !

OK.
Maybe our experiences are different.
Not going to spend time on this.
It would require looking up some statistics.

If they want to be with §God why do they make fun of Him?
Sorry, MT, I don't understand and it's not really important.

Did I say this?
Is Jesus God or not?
Paul spoke about God doing the judging.
Jesus IS the judge at the final judgment.
I don't see a contradition.
If we believe in God, we believe in Jesus.
It's JESUS that is the savior of the entire world and from the beginning of time.

Agreed.

Agreed.
I said we MUST BELIEVE IN GOD.

No belaboring this too much other then you well know those , even on here, who will say the do believe in God, but deny the divinity of Jesus. That is why I use the name of Jesus because you and I believe the same thing... but those who do not
need to hear the truth.

Agreed.

Not sure what anyone means by his.
Are you saying that everyone that never heard of Jesus is doomed to hell?

Have you read Romans chapters 1 and 2?



Initial salvation is received as you've stated above.

Does Jesus then require us to do good works or not?

Required, as in a command.? I say no. But expected I say yes. I say yes to that as one who wants to do good works for Father, Son and yes, even the Holy Spirit. If we won't who will?

How else will we get to demonstrate what He has done for us? How else will He be able to get things accomplished on earth as He has it set up?

Even the President of the United States has said several times after his two assignation attempts that "God saved me for a reason"

Now, I can only speak for myself when I say I am no angel. There was a generally heart felt program in the states called Touched by an Angel. Purely fidtion where angels came to help folks through their rough patches.

If we just sit on our backsides watching the telly and eating popcorn or bonbons we are a poor excuse for getting things done
that are needed.

I do not say we HAVE to go into mission work... as a Catholic friend forced each of her children in their teens to save their own money to go to some place like El Salvadore for mission work for 2 weeks.

But there are even very small things like dropping a can into a box for a food pantry, or making contributions to worthy charities or shopping for an invalid neighbor or even cooking for someone. (Maybe... cause that depends on if your food is really edible... I have been on the receiving end that has not been)

I am not talking about scrubbing out the sanctuary on hands and knees, or giving most everything you have to the poor but those things that just are nice to do .... and bringing the love of God to folks ..

I cannot explain the difference between works and works... but there is.

Nothing else?
Is this what Jesus taught for over 3 years?
Nothing about our behavior or doing good?
Matthew was wrong in chapter 5 and chapter 25 and chapter 7?
Paul was wrong in stating that we will be judged according to our works? Romans 2:5-8

As I said above... There are works and there are works... and I cannot explain well, I just am aware.

And I believe in them because it is the right thing to do... not because I am commanded to.

Sis....
A BELIEVER and a TRUE BELIEVER is the same.

The word TRUE does not change in any way the word BELIEVER.

If one believes, he's a believer.


If I'm dead, I'm dead... I don't have to add the word TRULY dead.
See what I mean??
I think we need to stop adding words to describe verbs that are self-explanatory.
I'm suspicious as to why people do this.

 

[GodsGrace]

No belaboring this too much other then you well know those , even on here, who will say the do believe in God, but deny the divinity of Jesus. That is why I use the name of Jesus because you and I believe the same thing... but those who do not
need to hear the truth.

Required, as in a command.? I say no. But expected I say yes. I say yes to that as one who wants to do good works for Father, Son and yes, even the Holy Spirit. If we won't who will?

How else will we get to demonstrate what He has done for us? How else will He be able to get things accomplished on earth as He has it set up?

Even the President of the United States has said several times after his two assignation attempts that "God saved me for a reason"

Now, I can only speak for myself when I say I am no angel. There was a generally heart felt program in the states called Touched by an Angel. Purely fidtion where angels came to help folks through their rough patches.

If we just sit on our backsides watching the telly and eating popcorn or bonbons we are a poor excuse for getting things done
that are needed.

I do not say we HAVE to go into mission work... as a Catholic friend forced each of her children in their teens to save their own money to go to some place like El Salvadore for mission work for 2 weeks.

But there are even very small things like dropping a can into a box for a food pantry, or making contributions to worthy charities or shopping for an invalid neighbor or even cooking for someone. (Maybe... cause that depends on if your food is really edible... I have been on the receiving end that has not been)

I am not talking about scrubbing out the sanctuary on hands and knees, or giving most everything you have to the poor but those things that just are nice to do .... and bringing the love of God to folks ..

I cannot explain the difference between works and works... but there is.

I believe we agree on everything.
Sometimes we might state something that is not understood or needs to be clarified...
but we understand scripture the same, in my opinion.

I'd say that a work is anything we do to futher the Kingdom of God.
It could be a smile at the check out person that seems to be in a bad mood.

It's anything that is good.

Both Jesus and Paul spoke of doing good works..
I have difficulty understanding why this is so much fought against.

Plus, it has to be a work done cheerfully.
Forcing someone to go do missionary work somewhere is not really causing them to do a good work...
for we humans it will be beneficial...for the good it will do to the persons there...
but to God it would not be, unless HE asked them to do this.

And I'd say that the difference between works and works is this:
For works to be valid for §God...
we need to be saved FIRST...
and then our works count for §God.

 

[MTMattie]

Jesus said "Repent and believe in the gospel", which is Christ died for our sins, He was buried and He was raised on the 3rd day.

If that's too much for you, then I guess we won't be seeing you in heaven.

Not sure which one but judging another like this surly is against the rules.....?

Is being a legalist different than being "a true legalist"?
What an odd thing to say.

Which are you?

If someone says that they want to go to heaven, it often shows a desire that they have to not go to hell.

There's no scripture that says: Here's what is necessary to get to heaven ... Even Jesus said very little about the need for people to go to heaven. His message was

Ye must be born again.

focused on the Kingdom of God and the importance of entering into it - which is not synonymous with heaven.

It's strange that your list of two requirements to get to heaven doesn't even mention Jesus - yet Jesus said that no one comes to the Father but through Him.

Duh........... Jesus is God. He also said that whoever the Father gives Him ha will not lose.

They are God....... Saying the title of the deity.... God.... encompasses all three of them.

Once you understand that it will be easier for you.

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

If Cornelious had never met Jesus or heard about Him...
would he have gone to heaven or hell?

we can theorize all day about fables . Fables upon falbes and thoughts upon thoughts .
The thing is , HE DIDNT . now did he .
How did GOD choose to save . by the preaching of the gospel that all who DO BELEIVE would be saved .
That was HOW cornelious was saved . CALL FOR PETER , he has words for you .
The problem with this generation is
that men have crept in , just like this , with this kind of mindset and scenarios that you just gave .
BUT WHY .
in order to begin to create doubt so as they can begin to pull us all into the lie .
You can ask all kinds of scenarios but if we get taken up into that realm
IT leads to a serious problem .
ME , i keep it real simple . Cornelious actually worshipped the true GOD of abraham
But even HE had to hear the gospel and believe TO BE SAVED .
THERE simply is no other hope for mankind . DEATH has come upon all
and there is ONLY ONE WAY to BE FREED FROM DEATH .
HIS NAME IS JESUS THE CHRIST and one must BELEIVE .
dont allow these other men and voices to try and pull you into
an idea . RATHER we speak what WE KNOW . and we KNOW THAT JESUS SAVES
and we KNOW one must beleive in HIM to be saved . KEEP it simple .

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

If Cornelious had never met Jesus or heard about Him...
would he have gone to heaven or hell?

And if pigs suddenly had wings i suppose they would fly .
You might be wondering why i said such a thing .
Scenarios given about things that never occurred , not good .
Did you see any example written that said
and there lived a man named cornelious the second , son to cornelious .
Now he too did his dads good works , but he didnt turn to believe on JESUS , but oh he was still saved .
NO ya didnt .
NOR would you hear such a thing written in the scrips .
That is what i mean about planting scenarios that never existed .
THEY DID THIS in order to lull us into another mindset and to lead us farther and farther into the agenda .

 

[MTMattie]

If Cornelious had never met Jesus or heard about Him...
would he have gone to heaven or hell?

You do realize that before the common newspaper and /or printing press there we a great many people who never heard about Jesus... and I would bet about baptisms too.

How many people settling the earth that ended up a single family on a farm somewhere in the middle of nowhere
who heard nothing.

If they could not here, I do not believe they would be punished.

But it is those who have heard... including those other religions that mention Him but do not give Him the honor due that turn their backs... they are the ones I see in trouble and those who just dont care.

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

You do realize that before the common newspaper and /or printing press there we a great many people who never heard about Jesus... and I would bet about baptisms too.

How many people settling the earth that ended up a single family on a farm somewhere in the middle of nowhere
who heard nothing.

If they could not here, I do not believe they would be punished.

But it is those who have heard... including those other religions that mention Him but do not give Him the honor due that turn their backs... they are the ones I see in trouble and those who just dont care.

Lets say if perhaps that did occur . If one never did hear then perhaps that would be a possiblity
BUT here is the thing .
GOD is in control . Dont think For a second
that HE does not know who has not yet heard the gospel .
And let us take notice of what JESUS said .
BEFORE HIS RETURN the gospel would have been preached IN ALL nations .
sounds like they had a chance to HEAR before HIS RETURN .
we would be shocked at how many have heard that name
and yet STILL failed to beleive and still remaining in their dead false religoin
or an atheist . We would marvel at how many HAVE heard it and yet STILL DENY .
THOSE WILL FRY in the lake of fire.
So i have a real good idea for us all to ponder on my friend .
Rather than us pondering on what MIGHT occur to those who did not hear
WHY NOT JUST POINT TO JESUS . with the dire reminder and real sense of urgency
as had the apostels and others , THAT ONE MUST BELIEVE in HIM or perish . because that was their mindset .
NO wonder they got up and turned the world upside down . THEY KNEW WHO SAVED
they KNEW ONE must beleive to be saved . that is the key right there .
THE rest of scenarios i leave alone . Rather than us both theorizing on possibilities
JUST preach JESUS . cause we BOTH KNOW HE SAVES .

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

If Cornelious had never met Jesus or heard about Him...
would he have gone to heaven or hell?

The real question is
WHY DID GOD tell cornelious TO GO and SEND FOR PETER .
Because GOD KNEW that was HOW cornelious WOULD BE SAVED , BY BELEIVING .
ponder on that for a long while . GOD KNEW what one needs to hear and to beleive TO be saved .

 

[MTMattie]

Lets say if perhaps that did occur . If one never did hear then perhaps that would be a possiblity
BUT here is the thing .
GOD is in control . Dont think For a second
that HE does not know who has not yet heard the gospel .
And let us take notice of what JESUS said .
BEFORE HIS RETURN the gospel would have been preached IN ALL nations .
sounds like they had a chance to HEAR before HIS RETURN .
we would be shocked at how many have heard that name
and yet STILL failed to beleive and still remaining in their dead false religoin
or an atheist . We would marvel at how many HAVE heard it and yet STILL DENY .
THOSE WILL FRY in the lake of fire.
So i have a real good idea for us all to ponder on my friend .
Rather than us pondering on what MIGHT occur to those who did not hear
WHY NOT JUST POINT TO JESUS . with the dire reminder and real sense of urgency
as had the apostels and others , THAT ONE MUST BELIEVE in HIM or perish . because that was their mindset .
NO wonder they got up and turned the world upside down . THEY KNEW WHO SAVED
they KNEW ONE must beleive to be saved . that is the key right there .
THE rest of scenarios i leave alone . Rather than us both theorizing on possibilities
JUST preach JESUS . cause we BOTH KNOW HE SAVES .

I am merely thinking of the settlers in the US when they went and grabbed their land ... husban, wife, and maybe
3 or 4 kids.

There could have been those that never saw a traveling preacher....

Or those that were around before the missionaries got to them....

That kind of thing.

Nothing current. Today everyone has a chance to see and/or hear the word.

Except maybe : John Allen Chau was an American evangelical Christian missionary who was killed by the Sentinelese, a tribe in voluntary isolation, after traveling to North Sentinel Island in an attempt to introduce the tribe to Christianity. He was killed in 2018.

There may be some off beat tribes like this still in existence but I am not going to try and find them

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

I am merely thinking of the settlers in the US when they went and grabbed their land ... husban, wife, and maybe
3 or 4 kids.

There could have been those that never saw a traveling preacher....

Or those that were around before the missionaries got to them....

That kind of thing.

Nothing current. Today everyone has a chance to see and/or hear the word.

Except maybe : John Allen Chau was an American evangelical Christian missionary who was killed by the Sentinelese, a tribe in voluntary isolation, after traveling to North Sentinel Island in an attempt to introduce the tribe to Christianity. He was killed in 2018.

There may be some off beat tribes like this still in existence but I am not going to try and find them

But did that happen . we dont know . we might think it did
but how do we really know GOD didnt have one approach them
or that even before they came here they had heard it .
That is what i mean . WE can guess , but we dont really know .
But what we both KNOW is THIS
The apostels knew , WE KNOW JESUS DID ,
and what was their message . DID you ever hear from JESUS or even see HIM
telling anyone oh if perhaps one just had good works but never heard of me they will be okay .
NO . what did we hear from HIM . the dire warnings and reminders TO BELIEVE ON HIM
or perish . That is why i am trying to get us off from scenarios .
Back to actually preaching and speaking THE TRUTH of CHRIST to all
with the reminder to beleive or perish . Plus i want us all
to examine something . DID paul when going into the synagoues
ever try and just preach common ground , OR DID HE PREACH JESUS
and then what did HE say to those who failed to beleive on JESUS .
DID he say oh that is okay , or did he shake the dust off as a testimony agaisnt them .
In fact what did peter warn them .
BEWARE lest that come upon you which is written in the propehts
Behold , wonder , and PERISH for i work a work in your days that you will in no wise beleive
though a man declare it unto you . take note that says PERISH , ye beleive NOT .
they left no guessing or gray areas about it . IT WAS JESUS preached
with no other message that gave out any kind of false hope to anyone . that must be our minds again today .