Jesus vs Antichrist

[Johann]

 

[Keiw1]

The real Jesus brought a new covenant= Love--That love not only goes to family and friends but to ones enemies as well. Almost all humans love family and friends but God sees many of those as wicked. The people of Noahs day loved family and friends. Hitler loved family and friends etc,etc.
Jesus vs the antichrist:

Jesus = love, peace, unity- Return evil for evil to no one- Forgive them Father they know what what they do. Turn the other cheek. Vengeance is mine said the Lord. If your enemy is hungry-feed him, if thirsty give him a drink. Keep conquering the evil with good. Rom 12:20-21)

Antichrist= Hate, war, division. Return evil for evil, steal vengeance for pride and self, kill them if you must.

History shows who gets backed. 99% on this earth are backing the wrong side-Like this-2Cor 4:4, 2Cor 11:12-15---
Not so easy to follow Jesus in a satan ruled system. Yet the blind guides assure the ac backers--you are saved.

 

[Soyeong]

Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Mosaic Law by word and by example, so he is the man of lawfulness, which is why the antichrist is by contrast the man of lawlessness (Thessalonians 2:3).

 

[Keiw1]

Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Mosaic Law by word and by example, so he is the man of lawfulness, which is why the antichrist is by contrast the man of lawlessness (Thessalonians 2:3).

The Mosaic Law is done away with. Jesus brought a new covenant=Love. Jesus was Jewish, he had to go by the Mosaic Law but under love. The Israelite teachers were lacking in love. Jesus told them off( Matt 23) told them they were cut off of being Gods chosen(23:38) unless they do verse 39- they haven't yet after 1950 years or more. A new religion began.

 

[Soyeong]

The Mosaic Law is done away with. Jesus brought a new covenant=Love. Jesus was Jewish, he had to go by the Mosaic Law but under love. The Israelite teachers were lacking in love. Jesus told them off( Matt 23) told them they were cut off of being Gods chosen(23:38) unless they do verse 39- they haven't yet after 1950 years or more. A new religion began.

All of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160), so none of them will ever be done away with, and instructions for how to testify about God's nature can't be done away with without first doing away with God.

In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the Gentiles, and the Mosaic Law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel message, which he prophesied would be proclaimed to all nations (Matthew 24:12-14). Furthermore, Christ set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law and we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 2:6). In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to the Mosaic Law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20). The reason that Jesus establish the New Covenant was not to negate everything that he spent his ministry teaching by word and by example and everything he accomplished through the cross, but rather the New Covenant still involves following the Mosaic Law (Jeremiah 31:33).

In Matthew 22:36-40, Jesus summarizes the Mosaic Law as being about how to love God and our neighbor, so it is the law of love. Jesus said that all of the other commandments hang on the greatest two, so they are all connected, and if you think that we should obey the greatest two commandments, then you should also think that we should obey the commandments that hang on them. For example, if we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit adultery, theft, murder, idolatry, kidnapping, rape, favoritism, and so forth for all of the other commandments. Some of the Israelites teachers were lacking in love, so the right solution to that problem is to start correctly obeying God's law out of love, not to do away with God's instructions for how to love.

You can pick whether you want to follow the man of lawfulness or the man of lawlessness.

 

[Keiw1]

All of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160), so none of them will ever be done away with, and instructions for how to testify about God's nature can't be done away with without first doing away with God.

In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the Gentiles, and the Mosaic Law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel message, which he prophesied would be proclaimed to all nations (Matthew 24:12-14). Furthermore, Christ set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law and we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 2:6). In Titus 2:14, Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to the Mosaic Law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20). The reason that Jesus establish the New Covenant was not to negate everything that he spent his ministry teaching by word and by example and everything he accomplished through the cross, but rather the New Covenant still involves following the Mosaic Law (Jeremiah 31:33).

In Matthew 22:36-40, Jesus summarizes the Mosaic Law as being about how to love God and our neighbor, so it is the law of love. Jesus said that all of the other commandments hang on the greatest two, so they are all connected, and if you think that we should obey the greatest two commandments, then you should also think that we should obey the commandments that hang on them. For example, if we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit adultery, theft, murder, idolatry, kidnapping, rape, favoritism, and so forth for all of the other commandments. Some of the Israelites teachers were lacking in love, so the right solution to that problem is to start correctly obeying God's law out of love, not to do away with God's instructions for how to love.

You can pick whether you want to follow the man of lawfulness or the man of lawlessness.

Some mosaic Laws are done away with. Like stoning one to death if they are unrepentent--Try doing that. Most laws are written on ones heart in the new covenant-Love. If one has that love, they wouldn't even consider stealing from their brothers, committing adultery on their mate, having any other God before their face, etc,etc. Tithing is done away with. The blind guides asking for the tithe do not know Jesus-RUN FROM THEM.
The Jewish religion stoned some apostles to death. Paul was stoned but lived. Jesus wouldn't stone another under the new covenant love. The Jewish religion lacked love thats why they were cut off.

 

[Soyeong]

Some mosaic Laws are done away with. Like stoning one to death if they are unrepentent--Try doing that. Most laws are written on ones heart in the new covenant-Love. If one has that love, they wouldn't even consider stealing from their brothers, committing adultery on their mate, having any other God before their face, etc,etc. Tithing is done away with. The blind guides asking for the tithe do not know Jesus-RUN FROM THEM.
The Jewish religion stoned some apostles to death. Paul was stoned but lived. Jesus wouldn't stone another under the new covenant love. The Jewish religion lacked love thats why they were cut off.

Again, all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160).

Jesus did not come to start his own religion following a different God, but rather he came as the Jewish Messiah of Judaism in fulfillment of Jewish prophecy and he set a perfect example of how to practice for us to follow Judaism by living in sinless obedience to the Torah. In Acts 21:20, they were rejoicing that tens of thousands of Jews were coming to faith in Jesus who were all zealous for the Torah, which is in accordance with believing in what Jesus accomplished through the cross (Titus 2:14), so Jews coming to faith in Jesus were not ceasing to obey it, but just the opposite. This means that there was a period of time between the resurrection of Jesus and the inclusion of Gentiles in Acts 10 that is estimated to be around 7-15 years during which all Christians were Torah observant Jews. So Christianity at its origin was the form of Judaism that recognized Jesus as its prophesies Messiah.

In Jeremiah 31:33, it doesn't quality it by saying that the New Covenant involves God writing most of the Torah on our heart. Everything commandments in the Mosaic Law is an example of what it means to correctly obey the greatest two commandments, which is why Jesus said that they are the greatest two and that all of the other laws hang on them. Jesus is one with the Father, so he was not in disagreement with what the Father commanded. Judaism is entirely about loving God and our neighbor, so it does not lack love, thought some individuals can lack love just as they can today.

 

[Keiw1]

Again, all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160).

Jesus did not come to start his own religion following a different God, but rather he came as the Jewish Messiah of Judaism in fulfillment of Jewish prophecy and he set a perfect example of how to practice for us to follow Judaism by living in sinless obedience to the Torah. In Acts 21:20, they were rejoicing that tens of thousands of Jews were coming to faith in Jesus who were all zealous for the Torah, which is in accordance with believing in what Jesus accomplished through the cross (Titus 2:14), so Jews coming to faith in Jesus were not ceasing to obey it, but just the opposite. This means that there was a period of time between the resurrection of Jesus and the inclusion of Gentiles in Acts 10 that is estimated to be around 7-15 years during which all Christians were Torah observant Jews. So Christianity at its origin was the form of Judaism that recognized Jesus as its prophesies Messiah.

In Jeremiah 31:33, it doesn't quality it by saying that the New Covenant involves God writing most of the Torah on our heart. Everything commandments in the Mosaic Law is an example of what it means to correctly obey the greatest two commandments, which is why Jesus said that they are the greatest two and that all of the other laws hang on them. Jesus is one with the Father, so he was not in disagreement with what the Father commanded. Judaism is entirely about loving God and our neighbor, so it does not lack love, thought some individuals can lack love just as they can today.

Jesus cut Judaism off-Matt 23:38,39--he lovingly left the door open to them in 39, they outright refuse. They have been apostatized since before Jesus came to earth.
Jesus gave a teaching--The pharisees all put their tithes in the box, a little old lady gave 2 small coins out of love. Jesus said she gave more value than all those tithes combined--Out of the heart(love) is the new covenant. Certain laws were done away with including stoning one to death.

 

[Soyeong]

Jesus cut Judaism off-Matt 23:38,39--he lovingly left the door open to them in 39, they outright refuse. They have been apostatized since before Jesus came to earth.

Do you agree or disagree that all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160)?

Again, there was a period of time between the resurrection had Jesus and the inclusion of Gentiles in Acts 10 during which all Christians were Torah observant Jews who practiced Judaism, and in Acts 21:20, they were rejoicing that tens of thousands of Jews were coming to faith in Jesus who were all zealous for the Torah, so Matthew 23:38-39 is not speaking about Judaism being cut off or about them refusing. The correct solution to people incorrectly practicing Judaism is to start practicing it correctly in accordance with the purpose of spreading the Gospel, not to do away with Judaism.

Jesus gave a teaching--The pharisees all put their tithes in the box, a little old lady gave 2 small coins out of love. Jesus said she gave more value than all those tithes combined--Out of the heart(love) is the new covenant. Certain laws were done away with including stoning one to death.

Jesus, the Pharisee, and the old woman were all Jews who practiced Judaism under the Mosaic Covenant in obedience to the Torah. Jesus did not establish the New Covenant until the end of His ministry, so everything he taught prior to that point was in regard to how to live under the Mosaic Covenant, which is the same as the New Covenant, which still involves following the Torah (Jeremiah 31:33).

 

[Keiw1]

Do you agree or disagree that all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160)?

Again, there was a period of time between the resurrection had Jesus and the inclusion of Gentiles in Acts 10 during which all Christians were Torah observant Jews who practiced Judaism, and in Acts 21:20, they were rejoicing that tens of thousands of Jews were coming to faith in Jesus who were all zealous for the Torah, so Matthew 23:38-39 is not speaking about Judaism being cut off or about them refusing. The correct solution to people incorrectly practicing Judaism is to start practicing it correctly in accordance with the purpose of spreading the Gospel, not to do away with Judaism.


Jesus, the Pharisee, and the old woman were all Jews who practiced Judaism under the Mosaic Covenant in obedience to the Torah. Jesus did not establish the New Covenant until the end of His ministry, so everything he taught prior to that point was in regard to how to live under the Mosaic Covenant, which is the same as the New Covenant, which still involves following the Torah (Jeremiah 31:33).

The pharisees condemned Jesus for certain things he allowed under Love which they thought went against law.. Showing the new covenant came with Jesus. You try stoning one to death and see where it gets you. Disfellowshipping( 1Cor 5:9-13) is the new practice of those unrepentent, not stoning.

 

[Soyeong]

The pharisees condemned Jesus for certain things he allowed under Love which they thought went against law.. Showing the new covenant came with Jesus. You try stoning one to death and see where it gets you. Disfellowshipping( 1Cor 5:9-13) is the new practice of those unrepentent, not stoning.

The issue is that some of God's commands appear to conflict with each other, such as when God commanded priests to rest on the Sabbath, but also commanded priests to make offerings on the Sabbath (Numbers 28:9-10), however, it was not the case that they were forced to sin by breaking one of the two commands no matter what they chose to do, but that the lesser command was never intended to be understood as preventing the greater command from being obeyed. This is why Jesus said in Matthew 12:5-7 that priests who did their duties on the Sabbath were held innocent, why David and his men were held innocent, and why Jesus defended his disciples as being innocent. This is also why we are permitted to get an ox or a child out of a ditch on the Sabbath or to circumcise a baby on the 8th day if it happens to fall on the Sabbath.

This is also why there is much discussion within Judaism about which commandment is the greatest and why Jesus was commonly asked that question. Jesus was not the only one to recognize that the commandments to love God and our neighbor are the greatest, however, there was not universal agreement. Some Pharisees had reasoned that it is unlawful to work on the Sabbath and that healing was work, therefore it is unlawful to heal on the Sabbath, which is straightforward and not entirely off base, however, we are also instructed to love our neighbor as ourselves, and Jesus gave a higher priority to loving our neighbor as ourselves. So Jesus was not teaching a different religion or covenant, but was simply speaking about what was the highest priority, and he was not in disagreement with what the Father commanded.

 

[Keiw1]

The issue is that some of God's commands appear to conflict with each other, such as when God commanded priests to rest on the Sabbath, but also commanded priests to make offerings on the Sabbath (Numbers 28:9-10), however, it was not the case that they were forced to sin by breaking one of the two commands no matter what they chose to do, but that the lesser command was never intended to be understood as preventing the greater command from being obeyed. This is why Jesus said in Matthew 12:5-7 that priests who did their duties on the Sabbath were held innocent, why David and his men were held innocent, and why Jesus defended his disciples as being innocent. This is also why we are permitted to get an ox or a child out of a ditch on the Sabbath or to circumcise a baby on the 8th day if it happens to fall on the Sabbath.

This is also why there is much discussion within Judaism about which commandment is the greatest and why Jesus was commonly asked that question. Jesus was not the only one to recognize that the commandments to love God and our neighbor are the greatest, however, there was not universal agreement. Some Pharisees had reasoned that it is unlawful to work on the Sabbath and that healing was work, therefore it is unlawful to heal on the Sabbath, which is straightforward and not entirely off base, however, we are also instructed to love our neighbor as ourselves, and Jesus gave a higher priority to loving our neighbor as ourselves. So Jesus was not teaching a different religion or covenant, but was simply speaking about what was the highest priority, and he was not in disagreement with what the Father commanded.

Jesus said-Its never wrong to do good on the Sabbath.
The Israelite spiritual teachers belonged to satan at that point. Jesus told them their Father was the devil. It was they who were in error not Jesus. A new religion started. Jesus would never let his followers follow those whose Father was the devil, now would he? They refused to listen to Jesus.

 

[Soyeong]

Jesus said-Its never wrong to do good on the Sabbath.
The Israelite spiritual teachers belonged to satan at that point. Jesus told them their Father was the devil. It was they who were in error not Jesus. A new religion started. Jesus would never let his followers follow those whose Father was the devil, now would he? They refused to listen to Jesus.

Jesus set a sinless example of how to practice Judaism by walking in sinless obedience to the Torah, so he was much more zealous for obedience to it than the Pharisees were and he never criticized them for obeying it, especially because that is what God commanded them to do, but he did criticize them for not obeying it or for not obeying it correctly. For example, in Mark 7:6-9, Jesus said that they were hypocrites for setting aside the commands of God in order to establish their own traditions. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus again called them hypocrites and said that tithing was something that they ought to be doing while not neglecting weightier matters of the Torah of justice, mercy, and faith, so he was not opposing Judaism or starting a new religion but rather he was calling them to have a greater adherence to the law by obeying it in a manner that is in accordance with its weightier matters.

There were Pharisees who criticized other Pharisees for their hypocrisy, so Jesus was not the only one to do that. In regard to the debate between the house of Shammai and the house of Hillel, Jesus was virtually incomplete agreement with Hillel, so he was not opposed to all Pharisees, nor was he opposed to practicing Judaism. Likewise, if there ware Christians who were showing pride and hypocrisy, then criticizing them for it would not be opposing Christianity in order to start a new religion, but would be calling them to have a greater adherence to Christianity.

 

[Keiw1]

Jesus set a sinless example of how to practice Judaism by walking in sinless obedience to the Torah, so he was much more zealous for obedience to it than the Pharisees were and he never criticized them for obeying it, especially because that is what God commanded them to do, but he did criticize them for not obeying it or for not obeying it correctly. For example, in Mark 7:6-9, Jesus said that they were hypocrites for setting aside the commands of God in order to establish their own traditions. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus again called them hypocrites and said that tithing was something that they ought to be doing while not neglecting weightier matters of the Torah of justice, mercy, and faith, so he was not opposing Judaism or starting a new religion but rather he was calling them to have a greater adherence to the law by obeying it in a manner that is in accordance with its weightier matters.

There were Pharisees who criticized other Pharisees for their hypocrisy, so Jesus was not the only one to do that. In regard to the debate between the house of Shammai and the house of Hillel, Jesus was virtually incomplete agreement with Hillel, so he was not opposed to all Pharisees, nor was he opposed to practicing Judaism. Likewise, if there ware Christians who were showing pride and hypocrisy, then criticizing them for it would not be opposing Christianity in order to start a new religion, but would be calling them to have a greater adherence to Christianity.

Jesus told those religious leaders they were closing the kingdom of God up to those who listened to them. Matt 23:13--Jesus would never allow his followers to follow them. That is why he cut that religion off-Matt 23:38--The renting of the banner at the moment Jesus died signified that fact as well. As well Jesus spoke to 7 churches in Revelation-not synagogues-a new religion was started-Acts 24:5

 

[Soyeong]

Jesus told those religious leaders they were closing the kingdom of God up to those who listened to them. Matt 23:13--Jesus would never allow his followers to follow them. That is why he cut that religion off-Matt 23:38--The renting of the banner at the moment Jesus died signified that fact as well. As well Jesus spoke to 7 churches in Revelation-not synagogues-a new religion was started-Acts 24:5

In Matthew 23:2-4, Jesus said that the Pharisees sit in the Seat of Moses, so and observe all that they tell you, so he recognized their authority while speaking against their hypocrisy. Someone can speak against the members or leaders of a religion without speaking against the religion itself. For example, Protestants can speak against the Pope while not speaking against Christianity. Again, Jesus set a sinless example of how to practice Judaism, so he was much more strongly in favor of practicing Judaism than the Pharisees were. The Bible does not state that the ripping of the curtain means that Judaism ended. The Greek word "ekklesia" is translated as "church" and is used many times in the Septuagint to refer to Israel in the wilderness, so that is when the Church began.

 

[Keiw1]

In Matthew 23:2-4, Jesus said that the Pharisees sit in the Seat of Moses, so and observe all that they tell you, so he recognized their authority while speaking against their hypocrisy. Someone can speak against the members or leaders of a religion without speaking against the religion itself. For example, Protestants can speak against the Pope while not speaking against Christianity. Again, Jesus set a sinless example of how to practice Judaism, so he was much more strongly in favor of practicing Judaism than the Pharisees were. The Bible does not state that the ripping of the curtain means that Judaism ended. The Greek word "ekklesia" is translated as "church" and is used many times in the Septuagint to refer to Israel in the wilderness, so that is when the Church began.

They were still Gods chosen until the renting of the banner. They sent their own Messiah to his death. Gods own son. It was the last straw. They have not turned around. Actually that word means-congregation not church.

 

[Soyeong]

They were still Gods chosen until the renting of the banner. They sent their own Messiah to his death. Gods own son. It was the last straw. They have not turned around. Actually that word means-congregation not church.

The Bible does not state that they were God's chosen people until the curtain was torn, but rather that is the meaning that you have come up with on your own. On the cross, Jesus was not acting like he kept bending over backwards for them and this time was the last straw, but rather he prayed to forgive them for they knew not what they were doing. The New Covenant is based on better promises and one of those promises is that Israel would never cease to be a nation before God (Jeremiah 31:35-37).

 

[Keiw1]

The Bible does not state that they were God's chosen people until the curtain was torn, but rather that is the meaning that you have come up with on your own. On the cross, Jesus was not acting like he kept bending over backwards for them and this time was the last straw, but rather he prayed to forgive them for they knew not what they were doing. The New Covenant is based on better promises and one of those promises is that Israel would never cease to be a nation before God (Jeremiah 31:35-37).

What else could the renting of the banner possibly mean? Especially when Jesus told them-Your house is abandoned to you unless they do verse 23:39.
Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen, not literal Israel.

 

[Soyeong]

What else could the renting of the banner possibly mean? Especially when Jesus told them-Your house is abandoned to you unless they do verse 23:39.

It is similar imagery to when people in the Bible tore their clothes in mourning upon hearing of someone's death. Matthew 23:29 does not close the door on Judaism, but leaves room for Jews to comes to faith in Christ, such as with the tens of thousands of Jews who were coming to faith in Acts 21:20.

Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen, not literal Israel.

If that were the case, the the promise would be worthless to the people that it was given to and God does not give worthless promises.

 

[Keiw1]

It is similar imagery to when people in the Bible tore their clothes in mourning upon hearing of someone's death. Matthew 23:29 does not close the door on Judaism, but leaves room for Jews to comes to faith in Christ, such as with the tens of thousands of Jews who were coming to faith in Acts 21:20.


If that were the case, the the promise would be worthless to the people that it was given to and God does not give worthless promises.

Yes they left Judaism and became christian. Real christian, there is only a single religion that has Jesus( 1Cor 1:10) out of the hundreds claiming to be christian.