How important is false doctrine really...

dizerner

Well-known member
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.

It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
 
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.

It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
I have known several people online who have changed their minds on major doctrines and more people in person. It does happen as I'm one of them myself, our admin, @Joe and one other member here. But yes it can get very frustrating. I think Rockson got through to seth recently on a major doctrine where he changed his mind.
 
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.
And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.
It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.
I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.
Maybe I'm just discouraged.
Is it really worth it?
Is it profitable?
In over 46 years of reading and studying the Bible, of reading commentaries and other peoples' bible studies, and in posting on forums and discussion boards since 2006 I get a pretty good dose of what's out there in peoples' minds concerning Scripture and this "so-great salvation."
Now, I don't know everything, but I know a lot, and I mean this with regard to my "measure of faith" for this particular time which is called 'today.'
I have learned based on what I already know to build my 'theology' and beliefs upon Scripture and thread every line and precept into each other to come out with better understanding of what the Scripture teaches even to the very jot and tittle that are very important by which my "mansion' stands.
The Space Shuttle 'Challenger' was a very large and complex piece of machinery by which it was able to fly and carry humans into space but was felled by a very small "O-ring" the size of a quarter.

Having said that, I approach the study of Scripture with an open mind. If I hold to a certain understanding of Scripture doctrine and come across a verse that contradicts my holding, then I have to modify my beliefs and bring it into compliance with Scripture. It may take some time, or the answer will come to me almost immediately. And I do some original thinking and find I have to discard what the majority of mainline Christianity believes. In this I find myself frequently in the minority. But am I really? Since God determines how much light a person, even a generation of people, receives I see a progression of knowledge towards what the Scripture teaches grow like a building brick by proverbial brick. This is called "edification."

Scripture says that "we know in part." Everyone in the Body of Christ possesses some truth in the building of their own 'mansion.' In personal discussion or at Forums like this we all post that which we know is true. But for the insightful they see that his "part" and brother so-so's "part" joined with sister so-so's "part" and his "part" over there we can then better see the "whole." But only for those who really seek to know the truth of God and go to someone's 'well' to draw water.

It gets frustrating on Forums like this in the exchange of thoughts and ideas about what one says Scripture says and teaches and no doubt we run into people that will not give up what they believe even though a passage of Scripture contradicts their beliefs, and we know it. But we love the Word of God. I know I do. And I keep going forward in posting what I believe Scripture says on various subjects and ideas. But it is not a waste of time and effort and the exercise of one's gifts and knowledge for although you're posting a discussion with a knucklehead who just doesn't "get it," if it's the Word of God that is posted and rightly divided and God's Word is "sent" to "do" something, believe me, it will go and do that thing for there are others not involved in a present discussion that will read your words and receive something from heaven that God meant for that person at that moment in time as they peruse your words.

IF you love God and His Word as I do know one thing: Love comes with profit.
All we do is plant and water.
God is the one who brings the increase.
Most of the time we may never know who's been blessed by our words. But don't give up. God is honored in seeing His kids 'cut up' His Word when the goal is to come to the knowledge of the truth. His truth. And this we will do "Lord willing."
Today.
Tomorrow.
And the next day.
 
In over 46 years of reading and studying the Bible, of reading commentaries and other peoples' bible studies, and in posting on forums and discussion boards since 2006 I get a pretty good dose of what's out there in peoples' minds concerning Scripture and this "so-great salvation."
Now, I don't know everything, but I know a lot, and I mean this with regard to my "measure of faith" for this particular time which is called 'today.'
I have learned based on what I already know to build my 'theology' and beliefs upon Scripture and thread every line and precept into each other to come out with better understanding of what the Scripture teaches even to the very jot and tittle that are very important by which my "mansion' stands.
The Space Shuttle 'Challenger' was a very large and complex piece of machinery by which it was able to fly and carry humans into space but was felled by a very small "O-ring" the size of a quarter.

Having said that, I approach the study of Scripture with an open mind. If I hold to a certain understanding of Scripture doctrine and come across a verse that contradicts my holding, then I have to modify my beliefs and bring it into compliance with Scripture. It may take some time, or the answer will come to me almost immediately. And I do some original thinking and find I have to discard what the majority of mainline Christianity believes. In this I find myself frequently in the minority. But am I really? Since God determines how much light a person, even a generation of people, receives I see a progression of knowledge towards what the Scripture teaches grow like a building brick by proverbial brick. This is called "edification."

Scripture says that "we know in part." Everyone in the Body of Christ possesses some truth in the building of their own 'mansion.' In personal discussion or at Forums like this we all post that which we know is true. But for the insightful they see that his "part" and brother so-so's "part" joined with sister so-so's "part" and his "part" over there we can then better see the "whole." But only for those who really seek to know the truth of God and go to someone's 'well' to draw water.

It gets frustrating on Forums like this in the exchange of thoughts and ideas about what one says Scripture says and teaches and no doubt we run into people that will not give up what they believe even though a passage of Scripture contradicts their beliefs, and we know it. But we love the Word of God. I know I do. And I keep going forward in posting what I believe Scripture says on various subjects and ideas. But it is not a waste of time and effort and the exercise of one's gifts and knowledge for although you're posting a discussion with a knucklehead who just doesn't "get it," if it's the Word of God that is posted and rightly divided and God's Word is "sent" to "do" something, believe me, it will go and do that thing for there are others not involved in a present discussion that will read your words and receive something from heaven that God meant for that person at that moment in time as they peruse your words.

IF you love God and His Word as I do know one thing: Love comes with profit.
All we do is plant and water.
God is the one who brings the increase.
Most of the time we may never know who's been blessed by our words. But don't give up. God is honored in seeing His kids 'cut up' His Word when the goal is to come to the knowledge of the truth. His truth. And this we will do "Lord willing."
Today.
Tomorrow.
And the next day.
ditto !
 
'And Paul, as his manner was,
went in unto them,
and three sabbath days reasoned with them
out of the scriptures,

Opening and alleging,
that Christ must needs have suffered,
and risen again from the dead;
and that this Jesus,
Whom I preach unto you,
is Christ.'

(Act 17:2-3)

'And when he (Apollos) was disposed to pass into Achaia,
the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him:
who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:
For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publickly,
shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.'

(Act 18:27-28)

'But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest:
for as concerning this sect, we know that every where it is spoken against.
And when they had appointed him a day,
there came many to him into his lodging;
to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God,
persuading them concerning Jesus,
both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets,
from morning till evening.

And some believed the things which were spoken,
and some believed not.'

(Act 28:22-24)
 
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.

It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
I think you're on to something. I try to just share what I believe. That's a lot easier than trying to convince anybody to change their mind about anything. It's not my job that's the Holy Spirit's job. I've read in many of your posts where you've encouraged people to pray. That's probably the best advice.
 
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

Just stop these topics from being discussed on a "christian forum" and most of the "trouble makers" will have to go and get a life.

1.) OSAS
2.) You can lose your salvation
3.) Calvinism - Predestined elect - Tulip
4.) Water baptism
5.) The Trinity
6.) KJV
7.) Mary
8.) What "church father's" taught.
9). Preterism
10.) 1 John 1:9

And one other thing.... Find the people who can't actually use their own thoughts or point of view or Theological knowledge.... as their reason to post or Thread..., and all they do is >>cut and past<< the WORK of others from commentaries, and online sites, or other people's videos....and filter out most of this behavior, completely.


See all those?
= Those are where the heretics live and RANT.... Its what they do, because they have nothing else they can talk about, or want to talk about.
Get rid of those and most of the heretics have no reason to be on the forum 24/7 = trying to agitate and frustrate and annoy real born again Christians.

If ONE forum on the entire Internet would do that, then at least ONE "christian" forum, would be a place a new believer could come and not be faith destroyed on the site.

Good luck with that..
 
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Good luck with that.. is right. The majority of Christians never come on any of these forms as they've never even heard of them. It takes a certain kind of person to come on here and share what they believe. And if you separated everyone that disagreed with each other to their own forum they would die out because it would be boring as could be. The key is to discuss our points of view with courtesy and respect, Lifting up our Lord and savior. New believers can be encouraged to look things up that are being discussed for themselves and make their own decision. But when they come on here and see us bickering with each other they don't want any part of it.
 
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. And if you separated everyone that disagreed with each other to their own form they would die out because it would be boring as could be.

I realize that there there is a point of view that some "christian" forum members have... which is.....""" A Christian Forum, is a type of social media like "facebook" where we can talk about , whatever, and we call it "christian". """""""

And you misread my post.
I said nothing about "disagreement"...... you did. @Hosanna

Im all for honest debate that is not an attempt to indoctrinate you into someone's "doctrines of devils" pretending to be a "Thread" "Post" or "debate".

I simply listed 10 ... "click bait" "hot topics" "fire starters">. that get people banned and @civic knows this very well....., that are redundantly Threaded by the SAME people who are teaching those deceived teachings, as they have nothing else to offer.

So, if you feel that all a Christian can talk about, is those 10 on my list, or the forum will be "boring" to you..... when the bible is filled with how many other Topics......
And the NT is dripping with revelation and 1000 other topics .

See.....Those on my LIST are constantly and purposefully misused by people who want to teach those as their harmful Theology, and everyone of them, can ruin the faith of a new believer.

Listen...
Wouldn't you would think that the Moderators... would be the one writing the """"Top Ten Hatred starting Topics that need to be BANNED""""..... post, instead of a member. ?????
But that is not the case....is it? ???
You would think that MODS would be the first line of defense, against heresy always being up and running on their forums, that can harm baby christians, and new believers.. and will, and does.
But they dont care... They really dont think about this, at all...
That is a fact, and that is what happens on forums, because this idea of '""" let whatever "park and preach" whatever is harmful"... is the RULE and not the exception.

Ive spent a lot of time, over the years, talking to Forum owners, and forum mods, ... more or less pleading with them to deny certain known heretical topics from being allowed.......so that the new believers, would not come to their forum and be harmed..... faith destroyed for LIFE.

They NEVER care. NEVER.
They "vote"... """"Let them all Teach whatever, shall be the one forum RULE""", as long as they say it "NICELY".

Here is what they tell me.... "Well, maybe the deceived person, can be helped if we let them THREAD and POST their HERESY, over and over".

Uh huh.

I had a Forum owner tell me...>"well, what i do, is model my Forum, after the way the rabbinical jews, do it.
How do they do it?
They just argue., and if the topic is not true, or if its designed to harm your mind, then that is "discussion".
That's what they do..., and that is the "Worthy Christian Forum" Owner's concept of a "christian forum".
And i talked to Him a lot..... and he just can't see it any other way.

So, can you SEE that this type of warped Spiritual IQ, is why Forums are theological hell pits, strife filled venues..... and are exactly the one place you dont want to send any new Christian.
NEVER do that.
Never.

The key is to discuss our points of view with courtesy and respect,

That Key you listed.... is a great concept, that will never be found for long on a Christian fourm, = as long as the Holy Spirit in a believer, is offended by posted demonic heresies, = Hebrews 13:9 ......that is allowed to be continued to be taught on a Forum.

Lifting up our Lord and savior. New believers can be encouraged to look things up

New believers come to a "christian" forum, and they read about CALVINISM... They are told they can LOSE their Salvation... They are show Preterism, and many other heresies..
That's what they get to "study" by just reading the posts and Threads.

. But when they come on here and see us bickering with each other they don't want any part of it.

As i told you.
If the Forum stops the "click bait" "fire starting" Threads and posts, then the "bickering" is mostly turned off.
Like about 95%.
 
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"Bickering" Starts with disagreement. So I disagree with your above statements. Also how could you possibly know I misread your post? My reply were my thoughts on this topic. Just because my thoughts are in disagreement with yours doesn't mean I misread your post.

Thank you for your reply.

however,,,,,

I have not posted to you @Lily

until now..

And its true that i view a Christian Forum, as a place for Believers to learn, and share, .. vs being indoctrinated by heretics, 24/7.

"well behold, who is the heretic".. /????????

Right.<

That's the main thing, isn't it......and that is the reason Forums will never change.

Here is the thology of most... it this..> 1.) """well, i think:""".... ."and my opinion is"... and "well, that is just your opinion". "and my church teaches" and "my pastor said".... and in the Video, and on that online site i read..."""""

So, when ALL THAT...= is the core foundation of a person FAITH and Theology.... then, why would they want to have any rules and regulations, that require the membership to abstain from some HOT topics that are only designed as "click bait" to cause strife. ?

Let me tell you a true story.. @Lily

I was on Christianforums.net.
(im still there)...

There is a female mod there.....>"Reba". also known as "wondering".. on other sites....

So, im a skilled Pauline Theologist, and i was there for a while... and still am... as i said... on occasion.
One day, a few are just wanting me to be banned, so they are "pm'ing" the Mods, with "report, report, report" as that his how carnal people ban together to try to get a "member" banned.
They literally start a fight, then abuse as a group, post after post..... and they're pm'ing each other at the same time......and then they as a group all go and "report" your response, that is finally equal to their attack.
So, that is the GAME that is played on "christian forums", .....
The MOD who gets the 10 reports, has not been reading what is going on, so they have not seen the previous 20 insulting posts that this little group of carnal devil's has posted so that the "member" eventually says something that isn't "Christ's Love".
And that is their purpose.. So, they REPORT it, and the Mod reads that ONE post, and YOU get banned, and they are still laughing.
And the kicker is.. .once you are banned you cant go to the Mod and explain it.......and show then their 30 posts.,.. that you didn't report, as you are BANNED...

= Welcome to a CHRISTIAN forum, that is filled with heretics, and similar...

Now....Here is the story.
Im on Chrisitanforums.net, and im teaching basic Paul's theology to a Catholic and to a Mormon, and they are both... "water baptism saves you"... "water washes your sin away"....
And im trying to help them understand exactly why that is not True.
Im trying to help them understand the Sacrifice of Christ as God's eternal redemption.... and the birth by the Holy Spirit, that is to become Born again, as a "new creation in Christ".

So, REBA, the MOD..... comes to my PM box, and she says..... """""im giving you a Strike, and 2 more and you are banned for a while.. .and The reason im giving you a strike is because You know more than they do, and you.......never let them win"....

True story.

Welcome to a "christian forum", where people including some mods believe you are here to argue and try to WIN.

What is that?
That is a "Carnal mind"
 
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How important is false doctrine really...
I've come to recognize the doctrinal debates in Christendom are a sad form of IDOLATRY.

We should consider our ideas as gifts we explain and leave at the Christmas tree of life. It's up to others to take the gift or leave it.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
These are moral questions. In philosophy morality is not a primary consideration but dependent or secondary. Always, you must ask worth it TO WHO? And as is it profitable TO WHO? One man's trash is another man's treasure.

I once belonged to a church that had a mantra for fund raising, Give until it feels good not until it hurts. I find this has universal applicability. Iron sharpens iron. At some point, you are sharp enough to stop sharpening.

Hope this helps, my friend.
 
I've come to recognize the doctrinal debates in Christendom are a sad form of IDOLATRY.

We should consider our ideas as gifts we explain and leave at the Christmas tree of life. It's up to others to take the gift or leave it.


These are moral questions. In philosophy morality is not a primary consideration but dependent or secondary. Always, you must ask worth it TO WHO? And as is it profitable TO WHO? One man's trash is another man's treasure.

I once belonged to a church that had a mantra for fund raising, Give until it feels good not until it hurts. I find this has universal applicability. Iron sharpens iron. At some point, you are sharp enough to stop sharpening.

Hope this helps, my friend.
Ditto 👍🏼
 
People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

You have to believe in something, or you'll fall for anything.

If you don't know where you are going, then any road will take you there.

Theology is not a guess or an opinion...., unless its wrong.

Paul teaches us that Satan comes as a preacher/minister of Righteousness..
This means that THIS Minister, teacher, is going to mix truth with untruth, so that it sound's correct to anyone who is not grounded in THE Truth.

Hebrews 13:9... = A believer has to do what that verse says to do with your heart, or what that verse says will happen, will happen to you.

If you dont know what that verse is telling you to do with your heart, then listen to someone who told you to do it, and they can help you, as obviously those who have never done what that verse demands, can't help you at all., tho forums and pulpits are filled with them, found trying to confuse you, deceive you, and keep you that way, reader.
 
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People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.

It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
first off in many of todays Churches false doctrine is defined as anything out side or circle of belief in that denomination. let me list 3 that cause division that many time gets labeled false doctrine . . 1. osas eternal security 2. os nas you can walk lose salvation 3 Baptism of the spirit the evidence of speaking in tongues .

many baptist hold to osas these groups very seldom welcome a outsider in to the service as per sing/ preach your welcome to sit that is it.. these groups will teach no matter what you will never be lost again no matter what. they are not very comfortable with the Pentecostal speaking in tongues . often they will teach that tongues have ceased and left with the apostles .
in some ways they have a point, but tongues is listed as a gift. paul wrote they will cease but did not say they had. so in all that these groups will call it false doctrine. along with the ones that hold to os Not as . i am ordained by the general baptist i was elected pastor to a southern baptist Church. i taught solo scriptures not osas or osnas . a women figured out i was ordained general baptist.. threw a carnal fit the lynch committee asked me to resign . when God called me to preach he did call me to preach thus saith the general baptist. but preach the word and it only.

some of the Pentecostals feel the Baptist are of false doctrine. because they dont teach /practice tongues. the real false doctrine falls anything contrary to the Bible. apostolic are good people but add water baptism to salvation as in part of it . baptism follows salvation .

the above description is not false teaching just different interpterion except the apostolic the j.w Mormons even catholic are work based . not grace based . even then its best guard the flock against heiress ..just dont argue about it.
 
You have to believe in something, or you'll fall for anything.

If you don't know where you are going, then any road will take you there.

Theology is not a guess or an opinion...., unless its wrong.

Paul teaches us that Satan comes as a preacher/minister of Righteousness..
This means that THIS Minister, teacher, is going to mix truth with untruth, so that it sound's correct to anyone who is not grounded in THE Truth.

Hebrews 13:9... = A believer has to do what that verse says to do with your heart, or what that verse says will happen, will happen to you.

If you dont know what that verse is telling you to do with your heart, then listen to someone who told you to do it, and they can help you, as obviously those who have never done what that verse demands, can't help you at all., tho forums and pulpits are filled with them, found trying to confuse you, deceive you, and keep you that way, reader.
but so many have preacher religion i asked a lady one time where in the Bible it said you had to be batized into a local church to join. she wasnt sure but her preacher could tell me hmmm
 
but so many have preacher religion i asked a lady one time where in the Bible it said you had to be batized into a local church to join. she wasnt sure but her preacher could tell me hmmm

Hey Ezra...

The Mormons teach that you have to "accept that the book of Mormon is at least... "equal to the bible", and then if you will, and you want to become a Mormon, you are water baptized INTO the "Mormon Church".

And you're still not a Christian yet..., as that is not how to become one....

The first time i tried to help a 'pre-destined elect" John Calvinist, .. it was the actor from the 80's movie, "The Boy Who Could Fly".
( I really like this movie) as it has such a "sweet spirit"., tho a secular movie.
I really tried to help Him, but, that is when i first learned, that Paul's Galatian's teaching about this type of mind control, is TRUTH.

Paul teaches..

WHO...... has "bewitched you"... "that you should not, (can't) obey the truth"...

"Bewitched".

That is not just deceived, that is "under a spell", and Calvin's Disciples are truly become that one.

There is one on ChristianityBoard........he told me 2 days ago...>>"you are offending God, and will suffer the eternal consequences, because you are teaching against Calvinism".

Uh huh....
 
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WHO...... has "bewitched you"... "that you should not, (can't) obey the truth"...
i am well aware of the Mormons i use work with a guy who was Mormon i asked him if i came to him wanting to be saved. what would i have to do . he said refer you to the evang team see if you wanted join....i tried get more from him but he was sworn to secrecy
 

Subject Heading:- How important is false doctrine really...​

People always seem entrenched in their own positions.

And it's so much work to build a lot of arguments or tear others down when people seem to believe based on presuppositions and not arguments.

It can suck an incredible amount of time and effort dialoguing, and one can feel deeply sincere trying to help people see the light.

I have spent years and hours dialoguing with hundreds of people, and I only know one who changed their mind on a major issue.

Maybe I'm just discouraged.

Is it really worth it?

Is it profitable?
Hello @discerner, :)

Your subject heading indicates that your reason for participating in a forum is to expose what you perceive to be false doctrine, and seek to re-direct the steps of those following such a path into the way of truth. Is that correct?

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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