Olde Tymer
Well-known member
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● 1Cor 14:34 . . Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed
to speak; but must be in submission (i.e. subordinate to the men)
It could be argued, with some merit, that this rule applies only to tongues and
prophecy; but Paul goes further with this rule in a letter to his friend Timothy.
"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to
teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first
formed, then Eve." (1Tim 2:11-13)
It's important to note that this is neither a gender issue nor an issue related to
competence; it's an issue related to primogeniture. For that reason it's an
insubordinate act of contempt for authority when Christian women lead Christian
men in a Christian congregation.
FAQ: Doesn't 1Cor 11:3-10 permit women to pray and/or prophecy just so long as
they cover their hair?
REPLY: There is a gender limit to that privilege. In other words: Christian woman
are not allowed to pray and/or prophecy in the hearing of a mixed congregation;
i.e. where Christian men are present.
FAQ: What about women like Anne Graham Lotz and/or Tara-Leigh Cobble? Aren't
they out of order?
REPLY: The rule is limited to congregational meetings. It doesn't include public
venue's, e.g. forums, street corners, coliseums, stadiums, convention centers,
radio, television, or social media like YouTube and/or Facebook.
FAQ: What about Deborah in the Old Testament book of judges? Exactly how was
she an exception to the rule, if indeed she was?
REPLY: Things are quite a bit different now with Christ at the helm, i.e. Christ's
association with his church trumps Deborah's association with the Jews. I do not
recommend using her, or any other woman in the Bible, as an excuse to defy
Christ's edicts in matters pertaining to the governance of Christian congregations.
NOTE: Debbie was neither a priest nor a member of the Sanhedrin; her
involvement in the Jews' affairs was limited to her position as a judge, viz: the
Temple's sacred business was none of her business; that was strictly a man's world.
** Paul appealed to "the law" as the basis for 1Cor 14:34. Normally when Paul
speaks of the law he's referring to the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon
with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.
Exactly where in the covenant that women are forbidden to preach, or teach, or
usurp authority over men in matters of religion, I don't know. However, it's quite
obvious that the covenant is very sexist, i.e. women are not permitted in either the
priesthood or the Sanhedrin.
However; the law doesn't always speak explicitly about certain things. Sometimes
the law's rules and procedures imply principles that we call "the spirit of the law".
For example Jesus' critics were educated experts in the black and white letter of the
law relative to the weekly routine sabbath but they were as illiterate as mannequins in
regard to applying the spirit of the sabbath. (Matt 12:1-13 & Mark 3:1-5)
_
● 1Cor 14:34 . . Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed
to speak; but must be in submission (i.e. subordinate to the men)
It could be argued, with some merit, that this rule applies only to tongues and
prophecy; but Paul goes further with this rule in a letter to his friend Timothy.
"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to
teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first
formed, then Eve." (1Tim 2:11-13)
It's important to note that this is neither a gender issue nor an issue related to
competence; it's an issue related to primogeniture. For that reason it's an
insubordinate act of contempt for authority when Christian women lead Christian
men in a Christian congregation.
FAQ: Doesn't 1Cor 11:3-10 permit women to pray and/or prophecy just so long as
they cover their hair?
REPLY: There is a gender limit to that privilege. In other words: Christian woman
are not allowed to pray and/or prophecy in the hearing of a mixed congregation;
i.e. where Christian men are present.
FAQ: What about women like Anne Graham Lotz and/or Tara-Leigh Cobble? Aren't
they out of order?
REPLY: The rule is limited to congregational meetings. It doesn't include public
venue's, e.g. forums, street corners, coliseums, stadiums, convention centers,
radio, television, or social media like YouTube and/or Facebook.
FAQ: What about Deborah in the Old Testament book of judges? Exactly how was
she an exception to the rule, if indeed she was?
REPLY: Things are quite a bit different now with Christ at the helm, i.e. Christ's
association with his church trumps Deborah's association with the Jews. I do not
recommend using her, or any other woman in the Bible, as an excuse to defy
Christ's edicts in matters pertaining to the governance of Christian congregations.
NOTE: Debbie was neither a priest nor a member of the Sanhedrin; her
involvement in the Jews' affairs was limited to her position as a judge, viz: the
Temple's sacred business was none of her business; that was strictly a man's world.
** Paul appealed to "the law" as the basis for 1Cor 14:34. Normally when Paul
speaks of the law he's referring to the covenant that Moses' people agreed upon
with God as per Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy.
Exactly where in the covenant that women are forbidden to preach, or teach, or
usurp authority over men in matters of religion, I don't know. However, it's quite
obvious that the covenant is very sexist, i.e. women are not permitted in either the
priesthood or the Sanhedrin.
However; the law doesn't always speak explicitly about certain things. Sometimes
the law's rules and procedures imply principles that we call "the spirit of the law".
For example Jesus' critics were educated experts in the black and white letter of the
law relative to the weekly routine sabbath but they were as illiterate as mannequins in
regard to applying the spirit of the sabbath. (Matt 12:1-13 & Mark 3:1-5)
_