Are Christians Today Required to Keep the Law of Moses?

[Soyeong]

He said he never knew them
who are them? Those who tried to get to God their way (by works)

Jesus did not say that he would tell people to depart from him because they were workers of lawfulness but because they were workers of lawlessness.

lol.. Again, YOU MUST BE PERFECT AS YOUR FATHER IN HEAVEN IS PERFECT.

If your not perfect. The law condemns you where you stand.

I pray you see this soon.

In Matthew 5:43-48, Jesus was speaking about having a loving that is full, complete, or refined, where we don't just love those who love us but also love our enemies, which has nothing to do with the post that you are trying to make. In Matthew 7:24, Jesus didn't end the Sermon on the Mount by saying that he was just kidding and that we can't actually do as he said because we all fall short of perfect obedience, but rather he concluded by saying that everyone who hears his words and does them is like a man who builds his house on a rock. There would be no point in telling people who have already sinned that they need to have sinless obedience because it would already be too late.

 

[Studyman]

then you are by defenition cursed by the law..and apart from the grace of God. you will end up suffering that curse.

If I rely on the "LAW" to take away the death my transgressions caused, then I am cursed, because there is no Law that can take away sins. I would "HAVE TO" be perfect and Keep All the Law at all times, because if I sin, the wages of sin "is death". This is the "Curse" of the Law, If you transgress God's Laws, you will die.

And there is no Law that can take away this death.

But I have already sinned. It's too late for me. It wouldn't matter if I followed every Law of God for the rest of my life, the Law of God defines sin, it doesn't remove the death transgression of God's Law brings. I would be cursed above measure if I relied on the Law to take away the death, the "Curse" that transgressing it brings. And there is no Law of God that can take away sins.

Gal. 3: 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

What you refuse to accept, even after you were shown, is that in God's Mercy, after golden Calf, HE "ADDED" a Law concerning burnt offering and sacrifices for sins. This "Law" was temporary as it was only to be in place, "Till the Seed should Come", to who the promise we made. (This would be Jesus, which it seems you don't know)

This is not "my gospel", but reflects what is actually written in Scriptures.

Heb. 10: 1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never "with those sacrifices" which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. 5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering "thou wouldest not", but "a body" hast thou prepared me: 6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

The Pharisees in Galatians didn't believe Jesus was this Seed, they were still relying on, or "Of" these sacrificial "Works" of the Added Law that God "added" because on Transgressions.

Paul is explaining that it was never the Blood of Goats that removed the death their transgression brought on them, it was always Grace and Mercy for those who "Believed in and Loved God" enough to bring for works worthy of repentance.

I believe in this God, and HIS Christ, despite this world's religious system and traditions you are here to promote.

so why are you watering the law down and thinking you can be ok when the law says you are not ok?

God's Laws defines for those who seek Him, Righteousness, Holiness, Cleanliness, Goodness, Mercy and Compassion. If I repent from living by and promoting the man-made traditions, high days, judgment's and philosophies of this world's religious system you have chosen to "Live By", and are promoting to others, I will not be OK.
But if a man repents of this wickedness, "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in "the children of disobedience", and he follows the teaching of those who were actually sent by God, like Paul. This man will, " repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."

These "works" would be obedient works, not disobedient works. This isn't "watering God's Laws down", rather, it would be showing belief, honor and respect for God, with all ones heart. That is why I will not submit to your preaching, rather, I will follow the Teaching of my Lord and Savior, the Jesus, "Of the Bible" and chose to Live By the Word's HE instructs. As Paul also teaches.

1 Tim. 3: 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for "instruction in righteousness": 17 That the "man of God" may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

I believe these would be the "works" God before ordained, that we should walk in them.

I have responded to your posts so many times in the past I lost count.

I didn't say you refused to "respond", you almost always respond in some sort or fashion, and have so many times I have lost count. That isn't what I said. Here is what I posted, "You keep refusing to address the scriptures of my post, or engaging in any manner of honest discussion about them".

And yes, you "responded" to the post. but not the Scriptures sited in them, nor do you ever engage in any honest discussion or examination of them.

Like when you refuse to acknowledge that Jesus and His Father were not promoting different Laws in Matt. 5, as you and "Many", who come in Christ's Name Promote.

You responded, but didn't address or discuss, or even acknowledge in most cases.

That's OK, I mean you are free to live as you please, and then justify your works.

I was talking about what is actually written in scriptures.

I have not rejected anything God has said.

Really???

OK, it's your sermon.

yet you continually try to puff yourself up and reject the gospel of christ..

LOL, and yet it is you who brag about having no beam in your eye, and that you haven't rejected anything God has said.

Fascinating!!!!

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

If I rely on the "LAW" to take away the death my transgressions caused, then I am cursed, because there is no Law that can take away sins. I would "HAVE TO" be perfect and Keep All the Law at all times, because if I sin, the wages of sin "is death". This is the "Curse" of the Law, If you transgress God's Laws, you will die.

And there is no Law that can take away this death.

But I have already sinned. It's too late for me. It wouldn't matter if I followed every Law of God for the rest of my life, the Law of God defines sin, it doesn't remove the death transgression of God's Law brings. I would be cursed above measure if I relied on the Law to take away the death, the "Curse" that transgressing it brings. And there is no Law of God that can take away sins.

Gal. 3: 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

What you refuse to accept, even after you were shown, is that in God's Mercy, after golden Calf, HE "ADDED" a Law concerning burnt offering and sacrifices for sins. This "Law" was temporary as it was only to be in place, "Till the Seed should Come", to who the promise we made. (This would be Jesus, which it seems you don't know)

This is not "my gospel", but reflects what is actually written in Scriptures.

Heb. 10: 1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never "with those sacrifices" which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. 5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering "thou wouldest not", but "a body" hast thou prepared me: 6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

The Pharisees in Galatians didn't believe Jesus was this Seed, they were still relying on, or "Of" these sacrificial "Works" of the Added Law that God "added" because on Transgressions.

Paul is explaining that it was never the Blood of Goats that removed the death their transgression brought on them, it was always Grace and Mercy for those who "Believed in and Loved God" enough to bring for works worthy of repentance.

I believe in this God, and HIS Christ, despite this world's religious system and traditions you are here to promote.



God's Laws defines for those who seek Him, Righteousness, Holiness, Cleanliness, Goodness, Mercy and Compassion. If I repent from living by and promoting the man-made traditions, high days, judgment's and philosophies of this world's religious system you have chosen to "Live By", and are promoting to others, I will not be OK.
But if a man repents of this wickedness, "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in "the children of disobedience", and he follows the teaching of those who were actually sent by God, like Paul. This man will, " repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance."

These "works" would be obedient works, not disobedient works. This isn't "watering God's Laws down", rather, it would be showing belief, honor and respect for God, with all ones heart. That is why I will not submit to your preaching, rather, I will follow the Teaching of my Lord and Savior, the Jesus, "Of the Bible" and chose to Live By the Word's HE instructs. As Paul also teaches.

1 Tim. 3: 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for "instruction in righteousness": 17 That the "man of God" may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

I believe these would be the "works" God before ordained, that we should walk in them.



I didn't say you refused to "respond", you almost always respond in some sort or fashion, and have so many times I have lost count. That isn't what I said. Here is what I posted, "You keep refusing to address the scriptures of my post, or engaging in any manner of honest discussion about them".

And yes, you "responded" to the post. but not the Scriptures sited in them, nor do you ever engage in any honest discussion or examination of them.

Like when you refuse to acknowledge that Jesus and His Father were not promoting different Laws in Matt. 5, as you and "Many", who come in Christ's Name Promote.

You responded, but didn't address or discuss, or even acknowledge in most cases.

That's OK, I mean you are free to live as you please, and then justify your works.

I was talking about what is actually written in scriptures.



Really???

OK, it's your sermon.



LOL, and yet it is you who brag about having no beam in your eye, and that you haven't rejected anything God has said.

Fascinating!!!!

if you do not rely on grace to take away your sin, you are under law

there are 2 ways to heaven

The cross. The law.

since no one has kep the law. it must be the cross.

Not the cross plus.. the cross.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Christ fulfilled all the commands and precepts of the Law. His life was a perfect life, and He committed no transgressions of the Law. He fulfilled every jot and tittle.
When a person is born-again Christ comes to dwell in the believer. And because Christ dwells within us and having fulfilled every jot and tittle God now sees that believer as having fulfilled every jot and tittle as Christ did. And because of this God sees us as having fulfilled every jot and tittle because of Christ within us this is our justification, and justification is God declaring the believer in whom Christ resides as being "Not Guilty!" of transgressing the Law in all its precepts and commands. Imputation has been made and we are imputed the Righteousness of Christ (while He is imputed our sinful nature.)
The Doctrine of Imputation is a nature-swap. He takes our sin nature, and we are imputed His Righteous nature.
That's basically it in a handbag. Nothing more need be done.

 

[Soyeong]

Christ fulfilled all the commands and precepts of the Law. His life was a perfect life, and He committed no transgressions of the Law. He fulfilled every jot and tittle.

"To fulfill the law" means "to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be" (NAS Greek Lexicon: pleroo), so after Jesus said that he came to fulfill the law in Matthew 5:17-19, he then proceeded to fulfill it throughout the rest of the chapter by correcting what the people had heard being said and by teaching how to correctly obey it as it was originally intended.

And because Christ dwells within us and having fulfilled every jot and tittle God now sees that believer as having fulfilled every jot and tittle as Christ did.

Nowhere does the Bible state that. Our salvation is not about just about being seen as being like Chris but about actually experiencing being made to be like him. In Titus 2:11-13, the content of our gift of salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, so if Jesus had fulfilled the law for us instead of graciously teaching us to experience fulfilling it, then he would have been removing the content of our gift of salvation from us.

And because of this God sees us as having fulfilled every jot and tittle because of Christ within us this is our justification, and justification is God declaring the believer in whom Christ resides as being "Not Guilty!" of transgressing the Law in all its precepts and commands. Imputation has been made and we are imputed the Righteousness of Christ (while He is imputed our sinful nature.)
The Doctrine of Imputation is a nature-swap. He takes our sin nature, and we are imputed His Righteous nature.
That's basically it in a handbag. Nothing more need be done.

The only way to be declared righteous is through faith in Christ, not through God seeing us as having fulfilled every jot and tittle. We can't earn our righteousness even as the result of perfectly fulfilling Law of God because it was never given as a way of earning our righteousness in the first place (Romans 4:1-5), but rather it was given to describe the life of someone who is righteous as it describes the life of Christ. In other words, Christ embodied the righteousness of God through his works by being a doer of the Law of God, so the Law of God is what we have the gift of getting to become a doer of by being imputed with the righteousness of God.

 

[Soyeong]

if you do not rely on grace to take away your sin, you are under law

there are 2 ways to heaven

The cross. The law.

since no one has kep the law. it must be the cross.

Not the cross plus.. the cross.

If no one can enter the Kingdom of Heaven by earning it as the result of their obedience to the Law of God, then there is no point in counting that as a way to enter it. There are many examples In the Bible of people who have kept the law, such as with those in Joshua 22:1-3, Luke 1:5-6, Revelation 14:12, and Revelation 22:14, so the reason why we can't earn our entrance into the Kingdom of Heaven is not because no one can keep it but because it was never given as a way of earning our entrance in the first place. In Matthew 7:21-23, Jesus said that only those who do the will of the Father will enter the Kingdom of Heaven in contrast with saying that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so there is only one way to enter the Kingdom of Heaven, which is by doing the will of the Father being workers of lawfulness, and the reason why we are required to do the will of the Father by being workers of lawfulness is not in order to earn our way there but because that is the way to know Jesus. In Titus 2:14 Jesus gave himself to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so the way to believe in the cross is by becoming zealous for being workers of lawfulness (Acts 21;20).

 

[jeremiah1five]

"To fulfill the law" means "to cause God's will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be" (NAS Greek Lexicon: pleroo), so after Jesus said that he came to fulfill the law in Matthew 5:17-19, he then proceeded to fulfill it throughout the rest of the chapter by correcting what the people had heard being said and by teaching how to correctly obey it as it was originally intended.

I think I said that.

Nowhere does the Bible state that. Our salvation is not about just about being seen as being like Chris but about actually experiencing being made to be like him. In Titus 2:11-13, the content of our gift of salvation is described as being trained by grace to do what is godly, righteous, and good, and to renounce doing what is ungodly, so if Jesus had fulfilled the law for us instead of graciously teaching us to experience fulfilling it, then he would have been removing the content of our gift of salvation from us.

When I said "sees" I meant it in the sense of approved/accepted. We might be "made to be like Him" which is the word "conformed." We are conformed into the image of Christ. We are not Christ, but made through justification and sanctification to be conformed to Christ. We are not Christ. We are not "little Christ's" which some define the word Christian. In one instance God sees us as a finished product, the same finished product if all our sanctification was completed in one moment in time. But realistically, we still have our sin nature that creates problems for us and God deals with us as a finished product still in this body of this death. So, let me clarify.

God sees us as holy, righteous, sinless beings. That is the way He's always seen His elect. Because that's the way He contemplated us in His Mind when He decided to create man and from man birth His elect. That's the only way He can contemplate us. There is no sin in God; there is no death in God. So, before He created man He contemplated His elect of millions and millions of souls as holy, righteous, and sinless beings. Then came the creation of man. Man was created from the sinful dust of the ground, blew into man's nostrils to animate the man and at the same time blew His elect into the man's nostrils and into the loins of the man who was named Adam. Adam (and the woman) was created sinful, or as the word is defined in Greek: hamartia = "missing the mark." What is the "mark" missed? The glory of God, or the glory that is God. Man was created with a sin nature because that's the only way he can be created, for Isaiah says, "there is only ONE God, there is NONE like Him, and He gives His glory to NO ONE." Adam was a three-fold being made up of body, soul, and human spirit (not Holy Spirit.) When man ate from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil man died "in the day" he ate from the tree. So, what died? Not his physical life for Adam lived 930 years. Not his soul for the soul consists of intellect, emotions, senses, mind, will, and conscience. Thus, his human spirit died "in the day" he ate from the tree. And now that man became body and soul each and every child born from Adam is born body and soul - no human spirit. It is when one is born-again that God creates a new human spirit in that person and that person is restored to the three-fold image of God.

In the same act Christ dwells within us and God deals with Christ in that person, not the person. Christ deals with the person and God deals with Christ. The reverse is also true. Christ represents us to the Father. We have an eternal Advocate and Intercessor. God does not deal with the person as a stand-alone for no flesh shall glory in His Presence. We have our Mediator. And because Christ fulfilled every precept and command of the Law, God sees us through the finished Work of Christ, and it is in this where we find our justification: being declared "Not Guilty!"

The only way to be declared righteous is through faith in Christ, not through God seeing us as having fulfilled every jot and tittle.

Salvation is of the LORD. Our will is passive in our spiritual birth. We have no power over our physical birth, and we have no power in our spiritual birth. God is the birther and we are born of God. We are dead in trespasses and sin. Like Lazarus could not exert faith to be saved, or in his case, resurrected, we have no say in our spiritual birth. There is a book of life of the lamb that has the names of every person predestined to salvation, and when the appointed time comes, that lost son or daughter will come without fail. There is no "accept Jesus into your heart" nor is God waiting for people to "accept His Son because being in bondage to sin we have our master and we obey that master, and that master is sin. The stronger man must come, bind the strong man, and then he can take his goods. No man seeks God. "Neither do the come to Him" on their own. All God does is free the person from their bondage and there is only one place to go: God. And we go because He has set us free. We can never choose God while in bondage to another master. We must be made free and this is God doing the liberating. There are only two directions we can go. In sin we are on a path that leads to eternal death. Once liberated we repent and go in the opposite direction to God. There is no left turn or right turn. Forward to death or repent 180 degrees into the opposite direction. That's it.

We can't earn our righteousness even as the result of perfectly fulfilling Law of God because it was never given as a way of earning our righteousness in the first place (Romans 4:1-5), but rather it was given to describe the life of someone who is righteous as it describes the life of Christ.

It is only when one is born-again from above that the Law and the Prophets instruct us in righteousness so that we may live righteous lives for God. (2 Tim. 3:16-17.)

In other words, Christ embodied the righteousness of God through his works by being a doer of the Law of God, so the Law of God is what we have the gift of getting to become a doer of by being imputed with the righteousness of God.

I thought I said that.
But there are times we will fail. But still, that doesn't change the way God sees us: Holy, righteous, sinless.
He ever seen His Chosen Elect people as holy righteous and sinless.