Do Catholics Pray to Mary?

[Fred]

In the Book of Revelation St. John sees that "the twenty-four elders [the leaders of the people of God in heaven] fell down before the Lamb, each holding a harp, and with golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints". Rev. 5:8

Therefore the saints in heaven offer to God the prayers of the saints on earth. 



1. Nothing in Revelation 5:8 teaches that those on earth addressed any of their prayers to the 28 (4 living creatures and the 24 elders)
2. Nothing indicates they fully know the hearts from which these prayers sprang forth. Since they do not fully know the hearts of all then they are not the proper recipient of prayer. See post 11.

 

[Donald]

We will be like the angels.


But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage; nor can they die anymore, for they are equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection. Luke 20:34-35

Angels are called sons of God.

We will be like them.

Somewhat yes.

In a general sense, the Bible indicates that resurrected humans in heaven will be like angels in that they will not marry or be given in marriage, but they will not become angels themselves.This shared characteristic emphasizes their spiritual and immortal nature, distinct from earthly life. While they will share aspects of angelic existence, they will also have unique roles and status, potentially judged angels and possessing a higher status than angels

So just to make it clear, resurrected human beings will be like angels in one respect: Men will not marry, and women will not be given in marriage.

 

[Donald]

Mary is mother of the Church under this more individualistic aspect, since she is effectively concerned for the salvation of each individual. Mary participates in redemption with Jesus Christ. Also grace is granted by Jesus only through the intercession of Mary; Then we get to the fact all prayers from the faithful must flow through Mary, who brings them to the attention of her Son.

Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou amongst women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death, Amen.

 

[Affinity]

Mary is mother of the Church under this more individualistic aspect, since she is effectively concerned for the salvation of each individual. Mary participates in redemption with Jesus Christ. Also grace is granted by Jesus only through the intercession of Mary; Then we get to the fact all prayers from the faithful must flow through Mary, who brings them to the attention of her Son.

Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou amongst women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death, Amen.

I don't have the slightest clue what Catholicism is all about so now might be a good time to learn. Any pointers?

 

[JLB]

Mary is mother of the Church under this more individualistic aspect, since she is effectively concerned for the salvation of each individual.

Mary is a human being who had other sons after Jesus.

She is blessed for sure. We love her and honor her.

However Jesus said this statement to those who spoke of Mary.

• “More than that, blessed are those who hear the word of God and keep it!”

And it happened, as He spoke these things, that a certain woman from the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, “Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!”
But He said, “More than that, blessed are those who hear the word of God and keep it!”
Luke 11:27-28

 

[Elliot]

I don't have the slightest clue what Catholicism is all about so now might be a good time to learn. Any pointers?

I came up with this.

The magisterium of Roman Catholicism is the special teaching authority of the Church itself. According to Catholic doctrines, this teaching authority resides only within the Pope and Catholic bishops. This implies that only those doctrinal statements that proceed from the Roman Catholic Church (RCC) can be true. It also means that, at times, the teaching authority of the RCC is uniquely free from error, a property called “infallibility.”

 

[Elliot]

This is interesting.

What was the Counter-Reformation?

Answer: The Counter-Reformation was Roman Catholicism’s response to the Protestant Reformation. In the late 15th and early 16th centuries, Christians began to openly criticize the Roman Catholic Church for teaching things contrary to the Bible. The Reformers objected to the veneration (worship) of Mary, the selling of indulgences, the insistence that rituals and sacraments were necessary for salvation, and so forth. As the Reformation took hold culturally and theologically, Catholicism responded with its own efforts. Some of these were intended to change the Catholic Church itself, but most were designed to resist the claims of the Reformers. Collectively, these Catholic efforts became known as the Counter-Reformation.
Got Questions Ministries

The selling of indulgences sounds just plain weird to me.

The medieval indulgence was a writ offered by the Church, for money, guaranteeing the remission of sin, and its abuse was the spark that inspired Martin Luther's 95 Theses. Luther (l. 1483-1546) claimed the sale of indulgences was unbiblical, challenging the authority of the Church and its claim as God's earthly representative.

Medieval Indulgence & Martin Luther

The medieval indulgence was a writ offered by the Church, for money, guaranteeing the remission of sin, and its abuse was the spark that inspired Martin Luther's 95 Theses. Luther (l. 1483-1546) claimed...

www.worldhistory.org

 

[Affinity]

I came up with this.

The magisterium of Roman Catholicism is the special teaching authority of the Church itself. According to Catholic doctrines, this teaching authority resides only within the Pope and Catholic bishops. This implies that only those doctrinal statements that proceed from the Roman Catholic Church (RCC) can be true. It also means that, at times, the teaching authority of the RCC is uniquely free from error, a property called “infallibility.”

“infallibility.” That's like taking a long walk on a short pier. Be sure to bring a life vest

 

[Affinity]

This is interesting.

What was the Counter-Reformation?

Answer: The Counter-Reformation was Roman Catholicism’s response to the Protestant Reformation. In the late 15th and early 16th centuries, Christians began to openly criticize the Roman Catholic Church for teaching things contrary to the Bible. The Reformers objected to the veneration (worship) of Mary, the selling of indulgences, the insistence that rituals and sacraments were necessary for salvation, and so forth. As the Reformation took hold culturally and theologically, Catholicism responded with its own efforts. Some of these were intended to change the Catholic Church itself, but most were designed to resist the claims of the Reformers. Collectively, these Catholic efforts became known as the Counter-Reformation.
Got Questions Ministries

The selling of indulgences sounds just plain weird to me.

The medieval indulgence was a writ offered by the Church, for money, guaranteeing the remission of sin, and its abuse was the spark that inspired Martin Luther's 95 Theses. Luther (l. 1483-1546) claimed the sale of indulgences was unbiblical, challenging the authority of the Church and its claim as God's earthly representative.

Medieval Indulgence & Martin Luther

The medieval indulgence was a writ offered by the Church, for money, guaranteeing the remission of sin, and its abuse was the spark that inspired Martin Luther's 95 Theses. Luther (l. 1483-1546) claimed...

www.worldhistory.org

I would be broke long ago.

 

[mikepec]

Not find in Bible.

Find another hailed by an angel as “ completed in grace “ ( Greek kechairotomene ) and told “ the lord is with you”
Its in everyone’s Bible except yours

 

[mikepec]

“infallibility.” That's like taking a long walk on a short pier. Be sure to bring a life vest

You would not have a Bible unless there were those acting under inspiration, in both writing the books and selecting them.

Thankfully Jesus recognised the need for some to give definitive inspired judgement on doctrinal disputes.
It was referred to by first century Judaism as the power “ to bind and loose”
And as you see it was given to Peter alone and apostles jointly.
That’s why you can trust the Bible contents, the creed and other proclamations of councils.

It’s good he did. You would not have a Bible but for those given infallibility.
It is very limited in context.

Protestants have no basis to give definitive judgement on any matter of doctrine, because they cut themselves off from the tree and that’s why they disagree on every matter of doctrine. The reformation doctrine was clearly false because even the reformers could not agree on anything except they wanted to disagree, so they have disagreed ever since. They did not wish to abolish the pope, they all wanted to be pope, whilst misunderstanding the source if his powers.

 

[Fred]

Find another hailed by an angel

Others can declare it and it is equally true.

as “ completed in grace “ ( Greek kechairotomene )

Luke 1:28
And coming to her, he said, "Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you." (New American Bible)

The New American Bible - IntraText

and told “ the lord is with you”

Judges 6:12
the angel of the LORD appeared to him and said, "The LORD is with you, O champion!"

The New American Bible - IntraText

Its in everyone’s Bible except yours

Easily refuted.

 

[mikepec]

Others can declare it and it is equally true.



Luke 1:28
And coming to her, he said, "Hail, favored one! The Lord is with you." (New American Bible)

The New American Bible - IntraText

Judges 6:12
the angel of the LORD appeared to him and said, "The LORD is with you, O champion!"

The New American Bible - IntraText

Easily refuted.

If you use a false translation it’s not surprising you don’t understand any of it.
The Greek is “:kechairotomene” hail “ completed in grace “usually said “ full of grace”(, but the Greek tense implies completion ) the “ lord is with you”

Study the early fathers , they will put you right.

 

[Fred]

If you use a false translation it’s not surprising you don’t understand any of it.
The Greek is “:kechairotomene” hail “ completed in grace “usually said “ full of grace”(, but the Greek tense implies completion ) the “ lord is with you”

The New American Bible (NAB) is an English translation of the Bible first published in 1970. The 1986 Revised NAB is the basis of the revised Lectionary. In the Catholic Church it is the only translation approved for use during Mass in the United States.

New American Bible - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Study the early fathers , they will put you right.

Study the Bible. It will put you right.
https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/praying-to-jesus.2061/page-3#post-113603

 

[Fred]

Since you are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses,

Which doesn't necessitate praying to them.

 

[Affinity]

You would not have a Bible unless there were those acting under inspiration, in both writing the books and selecting them.

Thankfully Jesus recognised the need for some to give definitive inspired judgement on doctrinal disputes.
It was referred to by first century Judaism as the power “ to bind and loose”
And as you see it was given to Peter alone and apostles jointly.
That’s why you can trust the Bible contents, the creed and other proclamations of councils.

It’s good he did. You would not have a Bible but for those given infallibility.
It is very limited in context.

Protestants have no basis to give definitive judgement on any matter of doctrine, because they cut themselves off from the tree and that’s why they disagree on every matter of doctrine. The reformation doctrine was clearly false because even the reformers could not agree on anything except they wanted to disagree, so they have disagreed ever since. They did not wish to abolish the pope, they all wanted to be pope, whilst misunderstanding the source if his powers.

@Elliot came up with this.
#26

The magisterium of Roman Catholicism is the special teaching authority of the Church itself. According to Catholic doctrines, this teaching authority resides only within the Pope and Catholic bishops. This implies that only those doctrinal statements that proceed from the Roman Catholic Church (RCC) can be true. It also means that, at times, the teaching authority of the RCC is uniquely free from error, a property called “infallibility.”

Sorry but I just can't buy into that. Murphy's law may fit in there.

 

[mikepec]

@Elliot came up with this.
#26



Sorry but I just can't buy into that. Murphy's law may fit in there.

I gave you the scriptural authority.
the power to “bind and loose” which is the power to give definitive judgement on matters of faith and morals , that’s what it means, and what it meant to His audience.
Jesus gave it to Peter alone, and the keys ( stewardship) and to the apostles jointly. ( and successors)

You would neither have Bible nor creed nor authorative councils without it.
Nor indeed would you have the doctrine which was handed down before there was a Bible “ paradosis” translated as a traditon ( with colloquial use and connotations which isn’t helpful) to which Paul tells you to stay true.
The early fathers state clearly the succession bishops from apostles are the true source of the deposit of faith.

That’s why the church is deemed the “ foundation of truth”, not scripture to which you take disputes, just as they did before Jesus with Moses seat, also exercising thr power to bind and loose . It is the origin of “ ex cathedra”

 

[DavidTree]

I get this asked this question all the time. The answer is yes but maybe not in the way you may think.

i am a former RCC member:
1.) Conceived by practicing RCC parents = both mother & father
2.) RCC baptism as a baby
3.) RCC education - Grade school
4.) RCC Confirmation
5.) RCC practitioner
a.) RCC Confession
b.) RCC holy eucharist
c.) Rosary beads/praying to Mary
d.) All the RCC holy days participant = Christmas, Easter, Ash Wednesday, etc
e.) Praying to Saints
f.) RCC statues
g.) RCC holy water and lighting of candles

It's not in the same way we pray to God.

YES it is

"We ask her to intercede for us with God"

Which is sin = idolatry

1 Timothy 2:5
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,
who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,

 

[mikepec]

i am a former RCC member:
1.) Conceived by practicing RCC parents = both mother & father
2.) RCC baptism as a baby
3.) RCC education - Grade school
4.) RCC Confirmation
5.) RCC practitioner
a.) RCC Confession
b.) RCC holy eucharist
c.) Rosary beads/praying to Mary
d.) All the RCC holy days participant = Christmas, Easter, Ash Wednesday, etc
e.) Praying to Saints
f.) RCC statues
g.) RCC holy water and lighting of candles


YES it is



Which is sin = idolatry

1 Timothy 2:5
For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,
who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,

All that advantage and
Sadly You never even knew your faith or the faith of the early church.
So like too many cradle Catholics you wore RCC as a badge, you never were RCC or even knew what it teaches,
You even thought Mary was God which is blasphemy ! RCC doesn’t think that , and does not pray to her as God.

So you are easy pickings for the false reformation evangelists . And worse, you even mislead others.

So sad .

 

[Fred]

All that advantage and
Sadly You never even knew your faith or the faith of the early church.

The faith of the early church did not consist of praying to anyone but God alone.